more ?'s from Michele and Soccer

Status
Not open for further replies.
MicheleS

MicheleS

Member
Hi everyone,
Just when I though I had this under control... Soccer has thrown me a curve-ball. A GOOD curve-ball, but I'm confused nonetheless.

A brief summary (I can't figure out the profile feature here :? ):

Soccer is on ProZinc.

Diagnosed 1 week ago. Has been PU/PD for a while (I think) but we have multiple cats so I couldn't figure out who the offender was .

BG 493 at dx. Liver & kidney fcn OK. Muscle loss on hindlimbs but all else on physical exam OK.

Obese.

Last week I changed to canned friskies (ick), using the food chart to select low carb. There is some dry out (Wellness Core) while I transition everyone to canned. They all used to eat Purina ONE Adult Hairball.

Feeding: meal 1: 5am (at insulin), meal 2: +5, meal 3: +9-10, meal 4: 5-6pm (at insulin), meal 7: +4-5

BG and insulin are on our spread sheet.


SO, yesterday, I get home and DH tells me that our DD has *fed* the cats. Uggghhh. Soccer had been on a bender of carby treats. I checked his BG (this was +10) and it was less than 150??? :o Huh??? So I fed him his afternoon snack as usual. PMPS was still less than 150 so I fed him again and waited 2 hrs. STILL less than 150 so I punted the pm-insulin, figuring that amps would be SKY-High. It wasn't. :shock: So... this am I gave him 0.4 units (down from 0.6) because it was 190. I'm going to go home to feed him his meal #2 and check BG then. (DH works from home but isn't comfortable checking BG.)


So- what is happening? Is he going OTI already? or is he fooling me? FWIW~ he is mad as hell about the testing. He bit me yesterday... so I know he is feeling better. ;-)

Thanks!!
Michele
 
It's early days so it's hard to tell just what's happening. Are you using the PZI Insulin Support Group? They would have a btter idea of how to fine tune your insulin. As for the weakness in the hindquarters, it may be neuropathy and giving Methyl B-12 supplement could help.
 
sounds like his insulin needs are going down :-D aren't you glad you are testing at home? Squeak did this...at first we were only using fructosamines to dose by and man does that not work when a cat needs a little but not a lot. So we started testing and his dose went lower and lower and soon he was at SID dosing and then none at all...fingers crossed this goes the same for you!
 
Jen & Squeak said:
sounds like his insulin needs are going down :-D aren't you glad you are testing at home? Squeak did this...at first we were only using fructosamines to dose by and man does that not work when a cat needs a little but not a lot. So we started testing and his dose went lower and lower and soon he was at SID dosing and then none at all...fingers crossed this goes the same for you!
Click to expand...

How often do you check BG on Squeak?
 
LOL! Squeak went off of insulin in 2003 (edited improper date)...we used our expired strips once a month or so but my meter went wonky a year ago and I haven't tried fixing it. I keep telling myself to get a new meter just in case... But several months ago he had his predental workup and even with stress he was about 7, which translates to 126 in US measurements.. He's 13 now and going strong!
 
Michele,

It does appear that Soccer's pancreas is helping out. This is the time when testing is extra important, and you understand that.

It looks like you may have set 180 as your shoot/no shoot line. That's a common line for PZI.

One thing that wakes up a sleeping pancreas is food. I believe that Lori on the PZI Board is experiencing this with her cat Tom. Is there is anyway to test Soccer after food to see whether it brings him down? Somewhere +.5 to +1.5 after food? If food brings a 190 down to 120 by two hours after food, you then know the pancreas is working and you need to be extra careful with the insulin.
 
Venita and The Boyz said:
It looks like you may have set 180 as your shoot/no shoot line. That's a common line for PZI.

<snip>

Is there is anyway to test Soccer after food to see whether it brings him down? Somewhere +.5 to +1.5 after food? If food brings a 190 down to 120 by two hours after food, you then know the pancreas is working and you need to be extra careful with the insulin.
Click to expand...

I was tentatively thinking 150. Between 150 and 190: 0.4 units. And, above 190: 0.6 units. I can try to get a +1 in the evening (either tonight or tomorrow night. A morning +1 would be impossible because things are frantic trying to get the boys to school and me to work... We have to be out the door by 645 and I already have to get up at 430 in order to get everything done... uuuggggh.

Thanks fo rthe advice! Let me know if you think that 150 is too low as a "no-shoot" line.
Michele
 
150 with a reduced dose might be just fine for him. You will find out as you gather more data.
 
Venita and The Boyz said:
It does appear that Soccer's pancreas is helping out. This is the time when testing is extra important, and you understand that.

<snip>
One thing that wakes up a sleeping pancreas is food. I believe that Lori on the PZI Board is experiencing this with her cat Tom. Is there is anyway to test Soccer after food to see whether it brings him down? Somewhere +.5 to +1.5 after food? If food brings a 190 down to 120 by two hours after food, you then know the pancreas is working and you need to be extra careful with the insulin.
Click to expand...

Venita, I did as you suggested and it did go down. So, yes, his pancreas is doing something. So, now what? Just keep going? His PMPS was 166. Eventhough I had planned on 0.4 units, I wimped out and gave him 0.2. I'm glad I reduced it again because at +1, he is at 148.

I'm going to post in the PZI forum about sliding scales for ProZinc... but I wanted your thoughts on the +1 drop since you were smart enough to suggest it!

thanks, Michele
 
One thing to do if you get a lower than usual preshot value like tonight is to hold off and keep testing...if he keeps dropping you know you don't want to give more as you'll get overlap that can work against you by working too well....
 
Jen & Squeak said:
One thing to do if you get a lower than usual preshot value like tonight is to hold off [giving insulin] and keep testing...if he keeps dropping you know you don't want to give [insulin]
Click to expand...

I agree with Jen. With a lower preshot, do not shoot but rather check out what is going on by giving food and retesting somewhere +.5 to +1.5 post food. I experienced this with my Maxwell (on PZI) and wrote this in his case study on the wiki:

Max went his first 48 hours without exogenous insulin from 12/21/05 PM to 12/23/05 PM. During that time, he rode mostly in the 130s/140s. Although I wanted to keep him as low as possible with insulin shots PRN, it was difficult to know when to shoot him because at times he was helping out and that would drive his levels with an insulin shot very low. I also started to find him getting a food dip instead of a food spike: his pancreas dumps insulin in response to the food. So my process became one of testing him prefood, giving him dollops of food every hour until he'd had enough and got the sleepies, and then testing him again to see whether he needed a shot. Usually he would be lower and I could skip the shot. There would be times, however, that I found his prefood number very high (in the 180s--I suspected dawn phenomenon) and I gave a token shot.
Click to expand...

Good luck!!

Venita
 
This amps was 168. I gave him 0.2 units (like last night). I can't test today again (till tonight) because I am teaching. He's going to be fed at +3 and +8. Plus, I confined the binging cat (also the puker... ick), so Soccer can likely free-feed some today too. (The other 3 cats don't binge on the canned like Cricket does.) I'll try to do some additional testing tonight... though, Wednesdays are bad because the boys have soccer and b-ball practice. <siiiiiigh> You don't think he'll go hypo with a 0.2 dose do you?

Jen & Venita, Thanks for your advice!
 
I think you'll be fine with .2U. I don't think microdosing is such a big thing with PZI the way it is with Lantus.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top