? Methos amps 287 +4.5 153 +5.5 142 + 6.75 148

SmallestSparrow

SmallestSparrow

Very Active Member
I’m again officially panicked. He’s had all his meals for the 0330 to 1530 period except what should be a 20 cal essentially no carb chicken breast snack at +8 (now about +7). I’m (barely) resisting giving him a pill pocket and greenies. Should I give 20 cal of his really low carb food instead of the even lower carb chicken breast for the snack? Should I give the medium carb food I bought (no idea if he will eat it …) should I feed him now and again in a couple of hours (two snacks).

I think @Bandit's Mom said Glargine gives a flat curve (or something like that)…is this what you mean? I need him to pull up by 1500.

maybe I’ll give him the two snacks. This poor cat deserves a much better mom.

Also not sure if I should use the “?” Or not. I’m new. I’m old. I’m a bit panicked so I’ll fix it if wrong
 
Looking really good and surfing nicely so continue feeding lc. Lantus dues tend to give nice flat cycles. You don’t want to give higher carbs unless under your reduction BG. It says per vet on your ss so I have no idea what that is .
 
tiffmaxee said:
Looking really good and surfing nicely so continue feeding lc. Lantus dues tend to give nice flat cycles. You don’t want to give higher carbs unless under your reduction BG. It says per vet on your ss so I have no idea what that is .
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Thanks so much. So this is a flat cycle? I don’t mind flat but I want it higher before the next shot :nailbiting:

Per vet means I change insulin dose when she says to change…I’m trying for once to not bother her on her day off. On Friday (as I was anxious about all the 300s) she said to go a week from the day I gave a lower pm dose when he did this same thing. Idk if some days I’m just not doing the shot correctly then stumble onto a good shot and it’s too much bc it’s based on bad shots in general… do you think she might reduce it?? I was wondering this am because this is the second time he’s stayed down all day and in between he went high. So I wondered if maybe after a week he gets his tank a little too full. Or I’m inept at giving shots. Or it’s his tumor. Probably the inept thing.

Last week she said “in real life we’d give the 3.5 but so you sleep give 2”…and when his numbers were still dropping before the pm dose even kicked in I panicked and fed him greenies and kibble, had terrible numbers the next day, so trying to avoid that. I bought some medium carb food (I think) though I don’t know if he’ll eat it. The reason I have kibble is he’s picky and before he developed DM turned down many med carb foods I tried (bc I knew DM was coming)…but liked Instinct Heslthy Weight kibble (idk why…cats) so it’s my emergency food pending a trial of the proplan turkey and vegetables

edit: to be clear the kibble and greenies last week was all me. My vet had said to just feed his low carb food. She’s a saint. Who probably REALLY wishes he’d been able to stay on the Bexacat
 
I’m not sure why you think the BG is low. It’s what you want to see as you want to strive for readings in the blue range. Meter variance is 20% so yes this is a flat cycle and you are only half way into the cycle. If you shoot 2.0 units with a BG of 197 you are likely to get wonky numbers. What BG are you comfortable shooting? Close to 200 most people will give a full dose but it’s up to your comfort level.
 
Hi Colleen,

Methos has such a nice cycle today! :cool::cool::cool: Even though I understand you are nervous. :rolleyes: I am sure you will manage very well and will make a good decision. Glad Elise is there to give advice.

I send you a hug and some pawsitive vibes! :bighug::cat::bighug:
 
tiffmaxee said:
I’m not sure why you think the BG is low. It’s what you want to see as you want to strive for readings in the blue range. Meter variance is 20% so yes this is a flat cycle and you are only half way into the cycle. If you shoot 2.0 units with a BG of 197 you are likely to get wonky numbers. What BG are you comfortable shooting? Close to 200 most people will give a full dose but it’s up to your comfort level.
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Variance on AT is 10%. I know these are all essentially the same number I didn’t know what Bandit’s mom meant by flat curve. Thanks
 
Heike & BInie said:
Hi Colleen,

Methos has such a nice cycle today! :cool::cool::cool: Even though I understand you are nervous. :rolleyes: I am sure you will manage very well and will make a good decision. Glad Elise is there to give advice.

I send you a hug and some pawsitive vibes! :bighug::cat::bighug:
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:nailbiting::nailbiting::nailbiting:
thanks. I need to see to the other cat right now (pancreatitis, diarrhea) but I’ll be back to peek at what Binie is up to!
 
You shot 192 before, 189 not that much different. The 192 you shot a reduced dose and he zoomed up. But you may need to monitor tonight (or he could bounce) so take your ability to test tonight into consideration.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
You shot 192 before, 189 not that much different. The 192 you shot a reduced dose and he zoomed up. But you may need to monitor tonight (or he could bounce) so take your ability to test tonight into consideration.
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Yeah. Lots of soaring then. Mostly my BP and pulse. I didn’t want to jerk his adrenals around in either direction. Vet said 2.5 but I didn’t want to text her yet again to say “hey, it went up “ especially since 189 is 200 w variance but I did 2.75. I’m sure I’ll regret it. Trying not to resort to kibble and greenies again.
I wish I knew if the days he does nothing is because I’m not doing the shot correctly
Thanks for your help
 
Wendy&Neko said:
You shot 192 before, 189 not that much different. The 192 you shot a reduced dose and he zoomed up. But you may need to monitor tonight (or he could bounce) so take your ability to test tonight into consideration.
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I just gave the 2.75. Do you think I should have done more? I could add to it but I don’t know if his adrenals or my heart could take it

edit. I thought this time I’d see what a reduced shot does when I don’t give him a handful of greenies. He will be so disappointed.
 
This might be easier on me if twice a day I weren’t giving him meds designed to turn off his adrenals so I have no idea if methos will decide he’s Cushing’s or Addisons, or if he will be hyper or hypo aldosteronism, and his K is always up for grabs. Every time I push a Vetoryl capsule out I see the box warning not to give it with spiranolactone. I then put the capsule into a pill pocket with his spiranolactone and pray. This is icing on that cake. I hope I can keep him where he needs to be.
he deserves so much better
 
How long ago did he start the Vetoryl? From the little I've seen of the responses to Vetoryl, it is pretty obvious when it's starting to impact the insulin dose. Any physical signs of improvement in him?
 
Wendy&Neko said:
How long ago did he start the Vetoryl? From the little I've seen of the responses to Vetoryl, it is pretty obvious when it's starting to impact the insulin dose. Any physical signs of improvement in him?
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Vetoryl started May 2023. Spiranolactone started Aug 2023. So before his diabetes. It wasn’t working as well as it did in the beginning.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
Think of it as an experiment and chance to gather data. Eventually you might have enough data to shoot full dose.
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I used to remind medical students I was supervising that “this isn’t dog lab” meaning we shouldn’t be doing something to see what happened when we did, or we might get an unpleasant surprise.
How often should i check?
I can’t stand it. Going to check
 
My first adrenal tumor Cushing cat diabetes was found first (and didn’t use Vetoryl once it was found). So I knew diabetes was coming but it was easier w Erik bc I didn’t know he had a time bomb sitting on top of his kidney
 
When you shoot a reduced dose the first half is influenced by the earlier dose. If you can stay up I’d hold off on mc. If you can’t stay up a couple more hours then give mc.
 
Thanks so much to you both. I can stay up I’m just not sure how long I’m going to be able to get him to eat. He’s had a lot more low carb food than he usually gets
 
How often should I be checking him?
And in a “flat curve” is he supposed to come back up to where we started by the next shot?
 
Has he only had low carb tonight? If so, you could get another test if you want, but I think he's OK for the night. If he has a couple tests in a row where he's flat or rising and only had LC, you are good to call it a night.
SmallestSparrow said:
And in a “flat curve” is he supposed to come back up to where we started by the next shot?
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One also has to consider that he's a cat, and by trade not predictable. :p. He could stay flat all cycle, or he could start a bounce.
 
Thanks @Wendy&Neko! I mean in general does a flat curve come back up? There are many days where he stays the same number the entire time (as best I can tell from spot checks). Sometimes lower than the start, sometimes higher than the start. So idk if I just didn’t do his shot correctly then or that it’s just not enough insulin yet…or if it’s supposed to look like that.
Bc if it doesn’t come back up then I need it to be a bit higher flat line
 
SmallestSparrow said:
I mean in general does a flat curve come back up?
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Yes and no. There is no "in general". Typically it'll stay flat or go up but I can think of exceptions. The answer also depends on the insulin being used. When Neko was on Levemir, occasionally she'd drop a bit at the end of a flat cycle. But she often nadired at +12. If you mean, do I think Methos will drop low tonight, the answer is no if all you have been feeding is LC.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
Yes and no. There is no "in general". Typically it'll stay flat or go up but I can think of exceptions. The answer also depends on the insulin being used. When Neko was on Levemir, occasionally she'd drop a bit at the end of a flat cycle. But she often nadired at +12. If you mean, do I think Methos will drop low tonight, the answer is no if all you have been feeding is LC.
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Thanks. No i didnt mean tonight, im trying to figure out what im doing wrong bc he will have days when it seems he got no insulin at all and then three times something like today. I’ve done my best to limit variables from a really regimented diet—same foods same amounts for four meals and four snacks, he makes sure I get up each day the same time.
I don’t mind flat but I can’t do something like this all the time. His ears are a wreck.
Thanks again for your help. Going to try to get the other cat to eat and maybe let the next test slide a couple of hours
 
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