Maxx with high readings....all in the 300's now

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chekoya

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Maxx has been diabetic for 7 to 8 years. He was very well regulated till June 2010. I decided to change his food from Fancy Feast to Evo 95% canned. He doesn't get any dry food. Very high readings started and I changed back to Fancy Feast with no better results. Took him to the vet and there weren't any other problems. Vet said to put him on Science Diet diabetic food. After 2 months Maxx still had high readings. Vet said to try Purina DM and have been on that now for 3 months with high readings. In between I tried him on cooked chicken and fish and that didn't help either. He cannot eat raw food as he just throws it up.

I have gone back to 1 unit and started all over with the BCP PZI and am now up to 2 units at 6am and 6pm.
Yesterdays readings: 6am 393....8am 359.....11am 230....4pm 477....6pm 453

I don't think the Purina DM is the best food as it has so many carbs. I don't know if I'm giving him too much insulin or too little. He used to be regulated with just 1/2 unit.

Maxx was just to the vet for a full blood workup only 4 months ago. Vet said no problems.

I have decided to change his food back to Evo 95% as I know it's much less carbs than the purina DM. He hasn't done well on this or the Hills science diet for diabetics.

I also lowered his dosage to 1 1/2 units......will wait a week at least to see if his glucose readings stabilize lower....yesterday his numbers were mostly in the 300 range but some were down to the 200's so I might be heading in the right direction.

Just started a new bottle of PZI......have new test strips......thinking of getting a new meter next if things don't improve. I will also bring him back to the vet for another blood workup and complete checkup......also get his teeth checked again as he had to have teeth pulled a year ago. Do diabetic katz have more dental problems?? My other katz don't have any dental problems. Tomorrow I will check again every 2 hours and post his readings.

He doesn't get any treats or food in between feedings.....and I don't want to get him used to eating in the middle of the day cause I hope to be working again soon. I am getting him to 7:30am and pm gradually since the time change.

Here are his readings for the past 3 days......not quite every 2 hours as I work sometimes in the middle of the day. Maxx gets tested and shot every 12 hours with his feedings. I am still on 1 1/2 units twice a day. He is back on EVO 95% canned.
I give him approx. 3 ounces am and pm. He weighed 9lbs something on his last visit to the vet.
March 17th...6:30am 342 10am 337 3:30pm 254 6:30pm 274

March 18th...7am 348 9am 386 7pm 365

March 19th...7am 397 9:30 330 12:30 334 3pm 350 5pm 372

Should I go down to 1 unit?? Or should I start with 1/2 a unit again and see what happens?? One week at each increment is enough, right? Or should I wait 2 weeks before changing the dosage?

Thank you for any help......chekoya
 
Wow, you have tried lots of things. I'm sure you are frustrated.

I have a couple of ideas. I would try free feeding. Sometimes small frequent meals will help support the pancreas. You can free feed wet using an automatic feeder. Lots of us freeze the wet and let it thaw during the day. Have you checked the food charts to see the carbs for the various foods? Under 8-10% is usually the goal.

It would help us a lot if you would set up a spreadsheet. It will be easy for us to see your dose history and give you a clear picture of your kitty's trends and patterns.

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=18207

I am wondering what kind of increases you made. We suggest increasing by .5 or even .25 units at a time. Sometimes if you increase by one full unit, you miss the good dose.
 
Thank you for your really quick reply. I couldn't find anything relating to your request for a spreadsheet. Could you be a little more specific?

I will try to take more 2hr readings, if that is what you are referring to.

I will be working again soon...at least I am looking for work desperately..and I have 4 katz. Maxx is the oldest, then I have another 16-17 yr old that has to have only kidney problem food, and two kitties without any problems, 12yrs and 6yrs old. Free feeding would be impossible as I wouldn't know who ate what. I hope there are other solutions that will work for Maxx.

Thank you, chekoya
 
Here is the spreadsheet: Setting up a spreadsheet

Please explain the food situation. Is Maxx fed separately from the other cats and has no possible access to their food? If not - if he can get into any dry - that may be your problem. We switched Oliver from dry to wet and he went down 100 points overnight. Have you seen Dr. Lisa's site: www.catinfo.org She feels all cats do best on wet - including kidney issue cats. You might post on Health and ask about feeding multiple cats including a diabetic and a kidney cat. There are a number of people on the board who free feed multiple cats on all wet.

Those mid cycle tests will help us see the whole picture.
 
I’m no dosing expert since we are noobs at this whole thing, but I can tell you we were on Science Diet MD at my first vets strong urging and we switched to Blue Buffalo Wilderness Chicken wet food and have had success.

Our civvie Alby eats it (who was very addicted to dry food), along with Asher the sugar cat. It is between 1 and 2% carbs and the MD was almost 14%, strange for a "diabetic food”. The company makes 3 flavors as I understand it in this Wilderness type, chicken, duck, and turkey. Our guys won’t touch the duck but love the chicken.

We do a modified free feed since we have hoover cats. I put out a little more than they will eat in one sitting at feed/shot time, then mix water with the leftovers and they come back throughout the day to snack on it. It’s usually gone by the time I’d need to remove the food anyway to get a pre-shot test. Our snacks are baked chicken treats we make here (when skinless boneless chicken goes on sale).
 
The purina DM wet I believe has 7% carbs, but yes, EVO has less than that and is a better food all the way around. It looks like you were getting a decent little drop on the 2u twice a day, so dropping back to 1.5u and getting a flat curve tells me that Maxx may just need a little more insulin. If you don't start seeing a curve in the next day or two, try sneaking up the dose to 1.75u and see where that goes.

It is also really important that Maxx doesn't have a chance to steal any higher carb stuff. I have to man the dog bowls at feeding time in my house because invariably Oscar decides he wants to steal a kibble or lick the bowl after they are done ohmygod_smile
 
Just wanted to say hello. I have a Max too. He's Maximilian. My Max is pretty carb sensitive, so I think you're right to switch back to the EVO. My vet recommended Science Diet M/D, but Max has done a lot better on the wet foods with lower carbs. So sorry your Maxx's numbers are giving you such a hard time. It may be that as he is aging his body is changing and needs a little more insulin. I think Kelly's suggestion is good. Unlike some of the other insulins, you don't have to wait as long to change dose on PZI. I think in your original post you were wondering if you should hold a dose a week or two. You generally don't need to wait that long on PZI.
 
Thank you all for replies and suggestions.....I really appreciate your taking the time.

I stand watch over Maxx at feeding time, or he would eat other katz food. When they are finished I pick up the bowls right away. He gets a little over 3 ounces 7am and 7pm, EVO 95%, chicken/turkey or beef. Two civvie katz get Fancy Feast, only classic varieties w/o glutens and sprinkle of EVO dry. Tom, slight kidney problem, gets purina NF wet with sprinkle of dry NF.

I am at 1 1/2 units now and starting to see a good curve.
3/22 7am 367, 11am 237, 1:30pm 205, 3pm 209(gave a spoon of wet), 7pm 338. Gave spoonful of wet at 10pm.

3/23 7am 387, 11am 196, Hoping this continues......I hate seeing him so hungry all the time.

I went to the site to download the spreadsheet and when I clicked to download I got a blank screen.

I only change 1/2 unit at a time.....up or down. I will keep him at 1 1/2 now for at least 7 days and see if the glucose readings adjusts downward.

I also agree that the purina for diabetic katz seemed to have too many carbs. I think the EVO is a better food with more protein and less carbs. I would feed it to all my katz, but the civvies won't eat it. Maxx is so hungry he will eat anything!!

I have also made another appt for him at the vet to see that he doesn't have any other complications/infection. He was just there about 4 months ago, but no harm in checking again.

I'll post again tonight or tomorrow.......thank you all. chekoya
 
Keep us posted. The #'s are looking a little better and looks like Maxx had a little surfing yesterday with the 205 and 209 (yay!). Now if only his #'s would go a little lower, you'd be a happy mama bean. Spreadsheet will help with the data collection if you can get it set up.
 
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