Max

All rightly then! This is indeed interesting. I really do have to wonder if he isn't getting into something he shouldn't. Another member recently discovered their cat has managed to get into a box that contained a new bag of kibble and chew the bag open for snack time whenever desired! :woot: Got any pet food you think is stored he might have found access to?

Can you move that reading to the +7/8 cell on the spreadsheet please. One other thing, can you change the title on your sheet to include Max's name so it's identifiable as his. Sometimes those of us helping have multiple spreadsheets open at the same time and it really helps to easily identify the right sheet and avoid any confusion. Thanks. :D
 
I think I found the stash .. the dog had kibble under the chair and a few pieces of candy from the kids too ..: then he was licking their plate after supper in the sink .. they know to rinse it off but I heard the dishes and went in and their he was in the sink
 
Oh the joys of a pilfering cat! Try to keep him out of any contraband between now and tonight's pre-shot.:smuggrin: I am really wondering if the diagnosis is wrong. Did your vet do a fructosamine test when the diagnosis was made? That is usually the definitive way to confirm diagnosis along with sugar in urine and high BG however, even that could be falsely high if kitty was repeatedly getting into stuff he shouldn't.
 
If I difnt know better this cat I swear was a dog ... from the moment the lady gave him up he’s into been into everything including the dog food ... but I never noticed him in it much because they were just always free fed ...

No- he just did the blood test that day and urine ..
 
So all the vet did was an office BG? If so, then the diagnosis becomes even more questionable! Let's see where your little food kleptomaniac's BG is tonight. :p

ETA Did Max display symptoms of diabetes like excess water intake, hungry ALL the time, and peeing excessively before diagnosis?
 
that’s a perfect description for him .::

Yes he did ... he lost a lot of weight and then sounded like a dog drinking water and lots of pee ... ruined an old couch
 
OK. Sorry for the barrage of questions but was he eating dry food at the time of diagnosis? If so what kind and when did you switch to the Friskies/FF?
 
That’s ok ... ask away I appreciate all the help

He has been on Iams hairball/ weight ...I didn’t switch to all wet until about a month ago and that was my decision from trying to read and understand this ... the vet had put him on this prozinc because of the free feeding
 
Well the good news is that some diabetic cats when switched to a wet low carb diet, go into remission and it's possible Max is one of them given what we're seeing in his numbers as confounding as they might be right now. It's really vital to keep him away from anything other than his wet Friskies or FF as hard as that might be. I can only imagine what your household is like given I have 3 of the furry critters here and have to play lunchroom monitor for every meal because my diabetic girl who is in remission will pilfer her brother's food if not supervised. I can relate to how difficult this will be at least to some degree.
 
Well we can forget the accurate reading it was 531... after my last message I found him up on the rafters eating the canned food the other cat must not have finished .... add hudini to thatblist if names
 
Yes we have learned the hard way with out food ... we have all food off the counters ... breads in the oven because countless times they would get into that ..: one night I came down and the top part of my fridge was open and he was eating freezer food ‍♀️‍♀️... I think that just happened by chance because I think he jumped up and his weight pulled the door open
 
At the ripe old age of 3, I wouldn't expect hyperthyroid but might be a idea to have him checked. That is unreal! How do you keep your sanity? Goodness knows what else Max got into. I have no idea what to think or tell you to do. Let me ponder for a few minutes. I think we're right around shot time now, correct?
 
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Yes we are .. he got himself locked in the bathroom ... I have no sanity left lol ... on the bright side he must be feeling well because he got up an 8 foot wall the the rafter beam
 
He was still at 147 last night so I didn’t give any insulin around 11:30 and this morning he was 392
 
Honestly - I think the stress makes his numbers go way up - I locked him in the bathroom early this morning 2 hours prior to testing so I know he wasn’t into anything
 
For some reason I got no notification of your posts Thursday AM. I didn't see any BG on his SS for Thursday so curiosity is getting the better of me.
How is Max doing?
 
I must be doing something wrong in that spreadsheet - later that night he was 147 so I didn’t give him any insulin ... he got locked in the bathroom that night for a couple hours before his am shot and he was 392 in the morning ... so I have him .5 and went to work - cane himento him greeting us st the door and tested he was 176

No pee since the other day ... yahoo
 
He wasn’t acting well this morning ... just seemed like he was weak ... and, almost a paced out look ... so I just took his bg and it’s 443 ....he got his breakfast and he acted very good aggressive ... he was growling st the dogs walking by
 
So did you give him insulin this morning?

I am really wondering if there is something wrong with your glucometer. Your readings are all over the map and just don't make sense.

I tested a meter that was identical (I think same meter but under different brand name here in Canada) and found a number of readings questionable when compared against my other pet meter. I also found that sometimes I could get readings despite the strip not necessarily being seated in the meter properly or having enough/too much blood. I believe the meter has been discontinued at this point in time.

I'd suggest you pick up a Relion Premier meter from Walmart. Lot of folks use the Relion meters here because not only are pet meters expensive to use but but the strips are not readily available and have to ordered online. A human meter will work just fine.
 
I gave him .5 this morning...
I have a reli on that i use for myself, but i tried using it for him and I could never get enough blood.... That may be why I got it so cheap then, if its not accurate.

See, this is why i questioned myself, I feel like I am killing him as his mom.... :(
 
You are not killing him. You are doing your best and working toward getting him figured out and we'll help you do that. You've been proactive working at this. Take a deep breathe. We'll help you get him sorted out. Right now I think he's just feeling punky because of all the ups and downs in his BG due to the inconsistent insulin shots.

If you want a meter that takes the smallest drop of blood, then you could try the Freestyle Lite. Strips are a bit more expensive but a lot of folks have been ordering them on Amazon or Ebay for very reasonable prices.

I wonder if some of those lower readings have been due to not enough blood on the strip. The meter I tested definitely took more blood than both my other pet meter and my Freestyle Lite.

What size lancet are you using? Can't remember what size came with that pet meter. Get some 26 or 28 gauge lancets. Those with higher gauge like 30 or more are too small when you are starting out testing, With time Max will grow more capillaries and getting blood will get easier. Are you warming Max's ear? Try putting a light skim of Vaseline on the spot you intent to poke. It makes the blood bead up instead of spreading into the fur. You can also milk his ear by stroking from the bottom to the top of his ear flap. If you see blood and Max is moving making it hard to get the blood into the strip, then grab the blood bead on a clean finger nail and test from there.

With those high readings, and your report of him looking spacey, I think it would also be a good idea to check Max for ketones. You can get ketostix at the local pharmacy or Walmart and test his urine. Some folks can just hold a strip under kitty as they go. Others catch a sample on a little spoon. If Max is shy, putting scrunched up plastic wrap in the litter box where he likes to pee can catch a small sample for you to test. Now that said, with other cats in the house that can be problematic as you may not know whose pee you are testing.

The other option is to get a glucometer that tests both BG and ketones. They are a bit more expensive but are a lot more convenient for checking ketones. There are several options in this category and I believe the most cost effective are the Nova Max Plus and KetoMojo. Blood tests for ketones do take larger blood samples than those needed for BG.
 
Ok, I can do this... Well, we can do this... with your help we have come alot farther than we were.....

I will get the other meter next week.

I actually have those strips from when I was doing keto...lol
 
it was 95 ... when I tested ... he looked good but acted like he’s starving and is going after everything we pick up to eat tonight

he has a lot of energy - this may seem strange but after he ate he got this strange look to him - almost like he was high

I will def get a new meter at the end of next week though
 
If the readings are anywhere close to accurate, poor Max is riding a roller coaster right now. It's quite normal for him to be very hungry because diabetics don't process and utilitze the food they eat well. They often need more food than usual until they are regulated. He's definitely a puzzle.
I would suggest that tonight if BG is over 250, try a dose of 0.25u. You will have to eyeball it best you can. Let's see if lowering the dose settles his numbers at all. If BG is below 250 then I'd skip and see what he does tomorrow AM.
 
He was good last night so I did not give him any ... he actually came up and crawled in bed with me last night that is something he hasn’t done for months

He was 313 this morning so i gave him .25 and will retest around lunchtime
 
He’s been below 200 for the last 4 testings... he’s even playing with his ball again ..and grooming himself .., I will test again around 6!
 
Well those numbers are certainly a huge improvement but still a tad high. Let's see what he does over the next day or so. You may need to give him a teensy bit of insulin to bring those numbers down a bit more but if he doesn't need insulin, numbers should continue to drop on their own.
 
Ok - will do !! That .25 seemed to be ok when I did give it .., of course there is that part of - is this the calm before the storm ?
 
That 0.25u was Ok when Max' BG started out in the 300s. I wouldn't try 0.25u at his current level but rather a drop or maybe 0.10u. The funny thing about insulin is that too much and too little can look exactly the same and right now every dose has looked to be too high. I have to seriously think that if Max is really diabetic he has had a big improvement from diet alone. Fingers crossed.
 
When you have not given insulin for several cycles there is NO need to worry about low numbers. That is a perfectly good reading. Not sure what you mean by him seeming weak, but I don't think it has anything to do with his BG. My girl as been as low as 47 on her pet meter since remission. I tested a meter that I believe was the Canadian version of yours and found it read low at high readings and high at low readings compared with my other pet meter. Not by enough on either end to make much difference though so it seems Max is right within normal range. The numbers we suggest here are for cats receiving insulin so there is a little cushion built in for safety purposes. Perhaps it's just Max trying to adjust after having his BG fluctuating so much lately.
 
Mcessna said:
I gave him .5 this morning...
I have a reli on that i use for myself, but i tried using it for him and I could never get enough blood.... That may be why I got it so cheap then, if its not accurate.

See, this is why i questioned myself, I feel like I am killing him as his mom.... :(
Click to expand...

It's very odd, but my cat's left ear gives me plenty of blood, but the right one almost none. I suspect it has to do with position and right handedness. I might not be poking as deep in the right ear.
 
:(:( Well I don’t know what transpired through the night but Max decided to poo all over the carpet and then his number was 380 this morning
 
I can't help but think this has something to do with stress and territorial behaviour. Stress can elevate BG by 100 or more points and Max's numbers are so erratic they don't seem to fit the picture of diabetes.

Not sure how all your cats were initially introduced but it may be necessary to go through a re-introduction. If the stress isn't from your cats, there may be a cat in the neighbourhood that is upsetting him by being around your house.

In any event, the picture is still very muddled, you are still dealing with inappropriate elimination and I am not convinced that Max is diabetic and concerned that giving him insulin may be making the problem worse rather than better. With his numbers being so normal for a couple of days and then going way up again, he's either getting into food he shouldn't or he is extremely stressed or both.

My suggestion is to take Max to the vet to totally rule out a UTI or any other urinary issues. Not sure what to tell you about the poo though.
If his issues are territorial/behavioural and he is really stressed out, the vet could prescribe medication to calm him down.
 
OMGGGG.... I think you are right.... So, I didn't give him any insulin this morning.... I set up a cat "sting" operation.... 5 minutes ago I kept getting all these camera notifications..... Eli "the one eye" is attacking Max.... I watched it and heard it...... So, I bet that is what is happening over night too...
 
Sounds like you're on to something. Who was in the house first....Eli or Max? Sounds like Eli wants to be Top Cat and Max is either being bullied out of his top spot or getting the brunt of Eli's dominance and then marking to try to maintain some sense of ownership. I have never dealt with such a problem myself but I think Jackson Galaxy from "My Cat from Hell", has some helpful tips and tricks on his website. I am sure there are other sites with tips too. Perhaps more playtime to take some of the energy out of Eli and Max before bed or leaving the house will have them sleeping instead of fighting in your absence or while you are sleeping. Talking to your vet may also be helpful.
 
This was the order:
Peter ( we adopted him because nobody else would, and he had a throat box injury) he squeaks instead of meows
Eli ( a few months after - again felt bad because he only had one eye - hence the name Eli the one eye)
Rosey - which someone found as a stray so they brought her to me and i was like sure she can stay outside .... well then the eyes kept looking in the window... and that was it ..

Then, came Max.... he was only to be a foster.... The people that had bought him, decided or figured out they were allergic to him..... So they wanted rid of him and I said sure I can help you out.... well that was almost 3 years ago.... Now, that I think back... when he first came he was doing the same thing... pottying on my floors..... and I though now i know why they got rid of you.

Anyway... peter and eli used to be best pals and now its like Eli is a bully..... he goes after Peter too .....

Would stress mimic all the symptoms of diabetes? He even has hair loss ?
 
Stress can do a lot of things and I'm sure like us, every cat is different in how they manifest the stress. Hair loss I think could very well come from stress. Could it be hair loss from fighting or maybe over grooming that cats will do as a soothing strategy.

Are you sure there are no cats hanging around outside that might be triggering Eli to feel more territorial and display it with bullying tactics? Some cats are far more territorial than others. Could your elimination issues with Max be a result of Eli or one of the others stopping him from getting to the litter box or scaring him while he's in the box?

You've got some detective work to do to sort all this out but in the meantime, I'd get them all to the vet for a once over to make sure there isn't anything medical that could be making Eli behave differently now especially with his former pal. Maybe Eli needs medication to calm him down. Definitely speak with your vet for some ideas.
 
Max’s numbers have been high all day .. I even locked him in the bathroom last night

I have separated the other two for now too
 
Being locked in the bathroom could be elevating his numbers too. I don't know what to tell you. You don't want to be giving insulin if it's not needed but then you do need to give it if it is needed. I really think it's time to get some input from your vet about how to move forward.
In the meantime, feed Max and then retest about 3 to 4 hours later to see if his BG has come down.
 
I know I’m a complete mess tonight... I’m trying to get this all right for him ... he had an appointment the 19th ...

He has lost 2 lbs in a month we just weighed him
 
As for the low normal BGs he's been getting and the weight loss, is there any possibility that he wasn't getting the food he would normally eat due to the other kitties? 2 lbs in a month is substantial weight loss. How old is Max? Has he been checked for hyperthyroid?
 
I’m sure some of the weight loss is because he’s on a controlled diet now... they just free fed all the time since we got him until he was diagnosed

No he hasn’t been checked - I’m keeping a log and then going to the dogs vet in two weeks with him ...
 
Thank you for all your help....
Max played like a kitten last night before we went to bed and I was so grateful for that. I was so happy when we went to bed..
Sometime through the night, Max left my bed went downstairs and passed away.. I found him this morning. My heart is broken.... I failed him
 
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