List of low carb/low phosphorus fuds

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Wendy&Neko

Wendy&Neko

Member Since 2012
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Based on Dr. Lisa's latest and greatest list, and the work @Adrian and Chino did to enter this into a spreadsheet, I did some sorting to come up with a list of low carb (< 10%) and low phosphorus (200 and under P/100kcal) wet foods. Here is the list.

Once you start looking at carbs and phosphorus, it's hard to feed anything else. :) I still cringe if I see anything high carb or P for the civie.
 
I feed a locally manufactured raw food that is low phosphorus/low carb and feed some home made, also low phosphorus. Darwin's is not available in Canada.

But I agree that some work needs to be done to add the raw foods to this list.
 
Why is phosphorus bad? What causes some of these canned foods with limited ingredients (like Ziwipeak) high in phosphorus?
 
What about these?

Wellness Core Grain Free Beef, Venison & Lamb
Instinct Grain Free 95% Rabbit
Instinct Grain Free 95% Venison

I have them on my list of low carb/low phosphorus
 
Thanks Wendy; that will be helpful! I went to 2 pet food stores today to find food for Allen that is low phosphorous, reasonable amount of carbs, and a reasonable amount of protein. I had prints of 5 foods and left the first store in tears, I was so frustrated. In the second store they had many more choices but it was still difficult to find ones on the list..... but I had Dr Lisa's list on my phone and kept searching until I ended up with 2 different Wellness Core products, neither of which is under 200 mg /100kcal but one is just slightly higher at 215 and the other is 265. It was very frustrating. And I feel that the fat is too high with both of them, being 60% and 57% . But it is what it is.
 
@Judy and Boomer
I can so relate to your frustration. I have found that the smaller/independent pet stores are where you can have the best luck. I will buy on or two cans and try them to see if Gizmo likes them and then order from Amazon or Chewy.

I always try and go back to where I find food whenever I am in the area just so I support them and I know I can get the food locally, if needed, even if it is only one or two cans at a time.
 
LizzieInTexas said:
@Bronx's dad

I think it is from bone but I could be wrong and i think it is hard for their kidneys to eliminate. Wendy will know.

Bronx is looking Good! Just looked at his SS. 17+#'s! He is a big boy.
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Thanks Lizzie, that's interesting if it is the bones because some of the raw stuff has visible bones so wouldn't those foods be even higher in phosphorus?

Yes, Bronx is a big boy and never overweight but has been overeating do the the acro and is getting a pot belly.
 
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LizzieInTexas said:
@Judy and Boomer
I can so relate to your frustration. I have found that the smaller/independent pet stores are where you can have the best luck. I will buy on or two cans and try them to see if Gizmo likes them and then order from Amazon or Chewy.

I always try and go back to where I find food whenever I am in the area just so I support them and I know I can get the food locally, if needed, even if it is only one or two cans at a time.
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They were both part of a chain of stores, much smaller than a Pet Smart though. A lot of the foods on the list are not available in Canada.
 
You may also want to check the recently updated food list on Tanya's CRF site here http://www.felinecrf.org/canned_food_usa.htm
The list is in order based on Phos content - lowest to highest - so you'll have to search the column for carbs too b/c some foods low in Phos are still very high in carbs, but I found this useful when searching for food for Flame in the past month.

Jill has now actually included this in the sticky too.
 
Bobbie And Bubba said:
Question: Can Phosphorus binder be added to raw food ?
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Absolutely - I did it with Neko. My preference was to chose a low phosphorus raw, because some types of binders can be constipating.
Bronx's dad said:
Why is phosphorus bad? What causes some of these canned foods with limited ingredients (like Ziwipeak) high in phosphorus?
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Phosphorus is bad for kitties with kidney issues as they tend to have higher phosphorus, which makes them feel icky. And keeping phosphorus under control helps slow the progress of CKD. Usually people with CKD kitties are looking to feed low phorphorus, to avoid having to add binder, if possible, or at least delay it. For raw foods, the bone is definitely higher in phosphorus. There are some raw products that used eggshell calcium instead of bone, which are lower phosphorus. I've also got access to some raw that used bone powder in smaller quantities and is lower P.
LizzieInTexas said:
What about these?

Wellness Core Grain Free Beef, Venison & Lamb
Instinct Grain Free 95% Rabbit
Instinct Grain Free 95% Venison
Click to expand...
The new list from Dr. Lisa has the Wellness Core Beef, Venison and Lamb at 266 for phosphorus, and the Instinct Rabbit and Venison over 300 now. :(
Donna and Flame said:
You may also want to check the recently updated food list on Tanya's CRF site
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Yes, that's a good next step. Not all the fuds out there are on Dr. Lisa's list and I should cross check against Tanya's list, though she uses dry matter basis vs. the mg P/kcal used by Dr. Lisa.:bookworm:
 
Barbara & Uncle said:
BUMMER! I just bought a bunch as a go to for Uncle if he won't eat his raw
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I have some of each for the civvie too - I prefer him on low phosphorus diet because of his previous cystitis issues. :banghead:
Bobbie And Bubba said:
Why is that? Just trying to learn.
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Usually the first step is to feed low phosphorus foods to see if you can keep the phosphorus numbers low that way. Much easier than adding meds. If that's not enough or kitty won't eat what's good for them ;), then you have to move to binder. Much more about the topic on Tanya's site: http://www.felinecrf.org/phosphorus.htm
 
Wendy&Neko said:
I have some of each for the civvie too - I prefer him on low phosphorus diet because of his previous cystitis issues. :banghead:

Usually the first step is to feed low phosphorus foods to see if you can keep the phosphorus numbers low that way. Much easier than adding meds. If that's not enough or kitty won't eat what's good for them ;), then you have to move to binder. Much more about the topic on Tanya's site: http://www.felinecrf.org/phosphorus.htm
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Thx Wendy.
 
According to Dr. Lisa the commercially made raw likely have too much bone which can cause problems such as blockage and constipatiin in addition to adding high phosphorus . I'm thinking of using EZ Complete some of the time for the kittens in addition to Wellness since they both ate a little chicken today for the first time.

I'm glad Helen updated her list too. She hadn't last time I checked.
 
tiffmaxee said:
According to Dr. Lisa the commercially made raw likely have too much bone which can cause problems such as blockage and constipatiin in addition to adding high phosphorus . I'm thinking of using EZ Complete some of the time for the kittens in addition to Wellness since they both ate a little chicken today for the first time.

I'm glad Helen updated her list too. She hadn't last time I checked.
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The Darwin's I've been feeding Uncle for the past few years has backs and necks including bone. He has had constipation issues for about a year now. I wonder if that is contributing. The relatively new Darwin's Intelligent Design Kidney Support raw doesn't look like it contains any bone at all. It's $2 more a pound. Might be good. Maybe I will have to think about making my own if it's not or I can't afford it. It will be a challenge for me as I have been a vegetarian for 44 years :nailbiting:
 
Some updates. First I reordered the list by manufacturer. Second, I added some I found on Tanya's site with results differing from Dr. Lisa's. Those that differ between the two sites are marked with a * beside them.
  • Merrick LID Duck. It's listed as 15% carbs on Dr. Lisa's list but 5% on Tanya's site. I fed it to Neko regularly and it was definitely not HC.
  • Several others that were either not on Dr. Lisa's list (but on Tanya's) or not listed as low phosphorus by Dr. Lisa but they were below 1% DM on Tanya's site.
Back on the raw and phosphorus discussion, there are some raw products that use eggshell calcium instead of ground bone so are are lower phosphorus.
 
We could make a fortune if we all put our head together and came out with a line of LC/LP cat food. I don't know what to do now. :banghead:
Barbara & Uncle said:
I'll donate them to the shelter with caveat
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I already have a trunk full to take to my vet's office. A couple of the gals there volunteer at a shelter and they take the food.
 
Completely confused now. Tanya's site show FF Turkey and Giblets as 22.73 Carbs?? I know a lot of us used that - has it changed?

This is not how I wanted this day to start. :banghead:
 
Barbara & Uncle said:
Maybe I will have to think about making my own if it's not or I can't afford it. It will be a challenge for me as I have been a vegetarian for 44 years :nailbiting:
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Hi Barbara. We are vegan so I know how you feel. We have fed our dogs a home prepared diet for many years. It is very easy when doing that to formulate the diet based on the individual needs/ health issues of the pet. Morris is also on a home prepared diet. I spend less $ per day to feed him, using quality meat (grass fed, certified humane) than if I fed him Fancy Feast or Tiki can food. This is who I used to have his diet formulated: http://www.evolveanimalservices.com
The diet can be formulated in a number of ways. I prefer getting as many nutrients as possible from food. But you can also have a diet that uses fewer ingredients but more supplements. I can make 3 weeks of food in less than 30 minutes including clean up. I freeze in glass bowls, 2 days of food in each bowl.
 
A few of us have been working on updating the food list and the numbers we got on Wellness Core Beef, Venison & Lamb was 5.3 carbs and .9 phos DM, which is more in line with the chart on Tanya's site. We also got 3.6 carbs for the Merrick LID Duck with a phos level of .6 DM. I've fed it and, like Wendy said, I haven't noticed any higher food spikes when I do. Not saying our numbers are right and Dr Lisa's are wrong, just reporting the numbers we got using the info provided by the companies and using the calculations provided by Catinfo.org. When I get a chance I will call the companies again and see if anything has changed since we got the numbers a few months ago.
 
@Barbara & Uncle : Here's some info on chitosan. Look toward the bottom of the link for the section on renal failure. It is the primary ingredient in Epakitin, a phos binder, which is readily available.

@rhiannon and shadow (GA) - Darwin's now has 2 formulations available. One is their standard formula that does contain bone. The other is a prescription formulation that is for cats with kidney issues.

I just want to mention one issue. Unless you have a cat whose kidney values are compromised, you do not need to go overboard trying to find a low carb/low phos food. Diabetes can be hard on the kidneys and this is why we encourage everyone to get their cat's BG numbers below renal threshold as soon as their cat will let them. So many people here struggle with cats who are picky eaters. It's hard enough to find some food that their cat will eat on a reliable basis. Throw another variable like low phos into the mix and caregivers start to tear their hair out. Restricting phos in a cat, especially a young cat, doesn't make sense. It's needed for bone and teeth as well as fat and protein metabolism and overall health. Low phos disturbs the electrolyte balance. It's only once these levels are rising, as with kidney issues, that restricting dietary phos is an issue.

 
LizzieInTexas said:
I just bought a case of the Wellness Core. It will be delivered today.
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I just bought Wellness Core yesterday, what is wrong with it? I know it's a bit higher in p but our options in Canada are very limited so it is what it is. At least it's quite a bit lower in phosphorous than what Allen is getting now (Fancy Feast)
 
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Aren't there a lot of Fancy Feast pates on the new list that are low in carbs? And didn't we see new information late last year that told us Fancy Feast had changed their formulas and the carbs were now higher and a lot were no longer under 10%?
 
Judy and Boomer said:
Aren't there a lot of Fancy Feast pates on the new list that are low in carbs? And didn't we see new information late last year that told us Fancy Feast had changed their formulas and the carbs were now higher and a lot were no longer under 10%?
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There are lots of them but still plenty of tge pates are under 10%. You can find them on both lists.
 
tiffmaxee said:
There are lots of them but still plenty of tge pates are under 10%. You can find them on both lists.
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There was a different list that was shared with me back in the fall and it showed the Fancy Feast that I had been given Boomer was now close to or above 10% carbs.
Boomer is off Fancy Feast now so it doesn't matter; I just found it curious that the "old" carb values were there.
 
I just want to thank those that are working on these values. I really means a lot to me. I just don't have the time or energy to pursue these - so, just - THANKS :bighug: It is truly appreciated.
 
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