Latte- unable to move....concerns re constipation/poop

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carolynandlatte

carolynandlatte

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Hello.
Latte had an accident on Friday a.m. She was very excited to see me get out of bed and jumped up from where she was laying. She lost balance and half her body went one way, the other half the other way. She now can not do anything but lay on her side. ITs a struggle just to lift her head...but she can. She tries to sit up on occassion, but it takes a lot of work and usually ends in her falling back down into a laying position. She was seen by the vet and xrays done to make sure nothing was broken. At the moment I am giving her 24/7 care to get bare minimum food and water in her, fluids, insulin/medications, etc (along with lots of love). She is getting injectible bupe for pain. If you are not familiar with latte, I would encourage you to read her profile. All her medications and conditions are listed there. She is my world. Because of her age and a number of other factors I do seriously question if she will recover from this w/0 serious complications and hinderance to QOL.

So my main question at the moment is regarding LB issues, specifically poop! She has been pretty stressed out about not being able to get to the LB to pee. However, does eventually pee on a puppy pad that I lay under her tail (cant move her to get anything under). I dont think its going to be possible to get any lactulose in her, which she takes 1.5ml 2x/day. Im afraid it will hurt her more, or she will aspirate since she cant sit up. She is not eating enough/drinking to feel comfy giving miralax. She pooped about 1hr before the incident (friday, today is Saturday). OF course she has not since then. Im wondering how I can deal with this. She cannot get to the LB, and me picking her up and putting her in there has proven to be more detrimental than helpful. Can a cat poop laying down on their side? Strange question, I know. But if she REALLY had to let it out, Im wondering if she could. I also wonder tho, about the pain. If she cant get it out becuase of pain, despite the position, then we are looking at compaction. I cant see how the vet could help get it out w/o anesthesia at this point due to the pain. That is not an option. At what point do we consider a laxative for comfort?

I could TRY the lactulose. I do know it will be an added stress to her, possibly causing more pain in the back , and maybe aspiration. i wonder if I even WANT to try...do I WANT to encourage her to need to poop at this point? That sounds like the silliest question, too. Im just confused as to what might be the best way to deal with this...encourage poops and see if she can do it laying on her side? Or dont press the issue and see what her body does, accepting any complications?

Thanks for any thoughts. Hope this made sense.
 
Hi Carolyn,
I am really sorry to hear this has happened to you and Latte. :(

My Spot became paralyzed and motility was considered a potential problem since he was going to be on his side as well. I used Miralax to keep things moving, which worked quite well. He never did get constipated. You must watch out for urine scald. Keep her rear end very clean, washing every time you notice she has peed. You might choose to shave her back there to aid in keeping it clean. I used a Goldbond salve I found at Petsmart to help keep his rear end free of the burn, which he did get initially. Between the bathing and the salve, he never got it again.

If this is a spondylosis/arthritis situation and nothing is broken, I would heavily recommend trying to locate an animal acupuncturist. After only one trip to the acupuncturist I could see a huge improvement in Spot. They also gave him Chinese herbs to combat the injury and swelling around his nerves. Spot was almost walking full time again when he had what was probably a stroke, went into seizures several months after his injury and died, but it was never thought that the two were related. He was a very happy cat even through his injury, and I feel were it not for the acupuncture, our story would have been quite different. His quality of life was very good. I hope this will help. Feel free to email me at wnstnbabe at gmail dot com or find me on facebook if you have any questions.. I now have a job, so I'm gone a lot more, but I will be glad to help you if you have questions.

((((Hugs)))) to you and Latte,
..C
 
((((Carolyn)))) I have no first hand experience with this, as Carolyn does, and her advice sounds good.

The only question I can answer if that yes, a cat can poop when laying down on its side. It's a sad story as to how I know that, so I won't tell it. You don't need sad stories.

My continuing best thoughts for you and Latte.
 
Carolyn, I just can't say how sorry I am about what's happening with Latte. I know how stressful and heartbreaking this can be. I went through the same type of situation with Munchkin towards the end of her cancer ordeal. I can tell you that I have had experience with a cat that had hind leg paralysis and could not get to the LB and yes, they can poop on their sides. The issue of urine burn is definitely something to be mindful of. Do you know if Latte will eat pumpkin? That helps keep things "on the move" so to speak. Not sure what impact pumpkin (the plain canned variety with no spices added) would have on the diabetes though. I am praying that Latte improves soon.
 
My Gwyn had constipation issues since 1994 (constipating IBD and eventually megacolon), and was on lactulose for years and years and Miralax for a lesser period of time. She also had a stroke in 2007 that left her hind quarters not working for two months, and another stroke in 2008 that left her with a neurological inability to walk for 18+ months. I know from very definite experience that cats *can* poop when they're lying on their side.

Regarding the lactulose, I'd suggest mixing it in with her food; that can be easily done and thus avoid the aspiration issue entirely. Also contributing to the constipation may be the decrease in water intake, so you may want to add extra water to her food.

If it helps at all, here's a post I made a little while back on some things we did to try to help Gwyn when she had mobility problems. By the time this all happened, we had also switched to this litterbox, which was great. It has a very wide lower lip across the front so that, when Gwyn *was* able to walk, she didn't have to lift her legs very much to get in / out of the litterbox. And it's bigger than normal size which was a blessing. When she could walk, she wasn't always stable, especially on 'unstable' surfaces like litter; the oversize box allowed her to take a wide, stabilising stance and still avoid standing in a used area or peeing over the side. And when she couldn't walk and we covered part of the litter with a towel and left her on her own to pee, this larger litterbox was significantly more comfortable for her to lay upon.

I'll try to keep my eye on your thread here; if you've any questions that you think I may be able to help with, please feel free to PM me at any time.

-- Jean and her Gwyn
 
Thank you for the help in this thread.

Latte DID poop this a.m....AND in her LB (it was also a good, soft, stinky one :lol: )

It took nearly an hour of her showing some signs of distress and trying to sit up enough to drag her the foot to the LB. It was hard to watch, but I knew trying to help her was only going to hurt more. She had to get herself at least TO the box on her own. I know some of you reading may think I should have just picked her up and how cruel to just watch her go through this. Please just trust me on this one. The process she went through on her own was most likely the least harmful to her. Once she was there and a small space between her tummy and floor showed, I slipped a towel underneath for a sling. I lifted her in and she immediately went, without any crying. I used the sling to bring her back to her spot with little complaints. She was a little tuckered from the ordeal (as was I), but ate some more baby food, and purred from the pets I gave her.

Its good to know cats CAN poop from their sides. I kept telling her it would be okay and we would clean it (just like the urine). I just didnt know if it was possible. She wants none of that, I guess. Considering this is the most she has moved in 2.5 days, despite how hard it was, Im glad to see she CAN do it and has the will to try!

She does have her bottom shaved from a previous issue and have kept it shaved. I used shea butter the last time she had an issue with an icky bottom, which cleared it up real quick.

An acupuncturer was suggested by her regular vet, so I will send him an email and see what they can do on Monday. Her old vet does the acupuncture at the same clinic we go to...so she is very familiar with latte.

thanks for understanding what was somewhat of an incoherent post yesterday. Ive been on virtually no sleep since Friday. Its hard for me to update much from the computer because it is in a seperate room from Latte and she really needs almost minute by minute care/watching over. I am updating twice daily in LL, for anyone interested in following her story.
 
What a trooper your little girl is! You did the right thing in letting her get to the box herself. I know that was hard to do. But only she can feel what her body needs and can move in such a way as to not injure herself more. It's an encouraging sign, I think, that she got herself that far. You are a loving kittymom and it's so easy to see how much you love Latte. Continued GLOW for her recovery.
 
Poor kitty. Hopefully it's just a muscle strain or something. Does she seem to feel better if you do massage--not nec. to the area, but to other areas? Maybe somoe pressure point/shiatsu, or even Reiki (look up the distance healing network and you can put your animal in).

As far as pooping, Fred has DEF. pooped on his side and maybe not ideal but it can be done. Fred is now in a diaper 24/7 because he just doesn't go far enough to the litter box and misses it. So when you say you can't move her, not sure if that's because you souldn't, or you don't want to. If it's the latter your kitty should be great with a diaper then.

The fab thing about the diapers is that they absorb the pee and so it is NOT on the kitties skin, leading to rashes and all that. The poop is solid so also generally not a problem if you don't leave it around too long.

The tough part is experimenting with the type and size of diaper. I've gone thru a lot of this iin the past 9 months and I'll give youmy 2 cents.

Fred at his obese peak was 18 pounds. He was a BIG cat with a gut. At his 'ideal' he is 12, mabye even 13 pounds. Currently, at his Db, CRF and HCM 20 year old state he is 8 1/2 pounds. Very bony--hips and spine--and not as much muscle as he used to be, but stilll a big, long cat.

I currently use SIZE 2 diapers for him. Pampers are good because they smell good. But I've also used Huggies. (The cheaper brands are not as good).

What also works REALLY well is the 'Little Swimmers'. I believe these are Huggies. You get them in the smallest size--which is a little bit big...and they are like underwear, instead of a diaper--however, they do open at both sides.

The MAIN thing to watch out for--which actually will NOT be a problem for you if you r Latte does not move--is that the side of the diaper can cause an abrasion on the thin skin at the hip flexor area when they walk. Fred had an awful sore in the fall and would not heal because the diaper kept rubbing the scab off. I experiemented with cutting the diaper away and that sort of worked but because these things are hard to keep UP when they walk--if they are tight enough around the waist, they are too tight around the kitty thigh...it would fall and rub against the tender area. I end p buying 'mole skin' some soft stuff in the shoe padding dept of the drug stored that you can just stick on the edge of the diaper and that actually works perfectly--you can cut it in strips, but it's expensive. I also go thru period where he is not in the diaper (when his blood sugar is low so he is peeing less) to give his skin a break....but for Latte--if she's just lying there this is not a concern.

If you can move her, but not much--the LIttle Swimmers are the best to use. If you can flip her over and lie her on her back to put them on, then normal diapers are ok. But Little Swimmers will absorb A LOT of pee, and no leakage....much better than the pads because they lie in the wet pee on the pad (I went thru these too)

Baby diapers are better than dog/pet diapers because they are the exact same thing but MUCH CHEaper. The only difference is you have to cut your tail hole. I did not notice that the dog diapers fit the cat any better than the baby ones--and both are not perfect. The baby ones are 15 cents each vs. $1.80 each for pet diapers, roughgly.

To cut the tail hole you you simply figure out where the tail goes and cut an 'x' or 'cross/plus sign' in the place--then pull the tail thru (hopefully you can pull her tail a bit and that's not painful? If not, you can cut a whole round hole--not as tight, but the pee comes in the front, not the back anyway, so probalby not a big difference.

Just remember, the pee is in the front, where the tummy is, so the thickest part of the diaper goes there (tends to be reverse for children). So when you buy the LIttle Swimmers, there is a marking--a round drawing/circle and that goes in front, by the tummy. You then make the cut X for tail just above the diaper crease on the other side (which is technically the front of the diaper). There are soft velcro sides to this diaper that you can open one or both side to put on.

I've used Miralax for Fred and it seems to be ok, also put pumpkin in his food, and more water--all these to help bowel movements. Massaging the tummymay help too if he is constipated.

good luck

PS if you have any specific diaper questions I would be happy to talk you thru it over the phone, just PM me...
 
Also, Fred has no clue what these diapers are for. Because he still walks to the litter box to pee, while wearing them. But since he never makes it into the litter box most of the time--he stops anywhere from 5 feet to 6 inches away--he doesn't pee on the floor. So even if you are letting latte go to the litter box on her own--for moments when she is too weak to get up, her pee will be caught safely...At night, Fred never gets out of our bed anymore to go pee--it's just too much effort for him I think--so the diapers are a must for us at night.
 
Latte is resting quietly right now, so I thought I would take a moment to update for those who are not in LL .

Latte has been starting to show some improvements. COnsidering she couldnt move for about 4.5 days at all, every little thing is HUGE. However, she is still far from being independent. Day 3 she started lifting her head a little, and occassionaly sitting up with a great deal of assistance. Day 4 she was able to sit up, mostly when assisted or propped. This was very helpful when it came to eating or drinking. Day 4 in the evening she stopped eating/drinking. She looked pretty defeated and depressed. That continued into day 5...the day we had an accupuncture appt. I was hesitant to follow through on the appt because I thought maybe she was trying to tell me she was done. I met with her vet before the appt and we talked things over. I agreed to increasing her bupe A LOT (she was only on a micro dose due to reactions). At this point it was worth the risk of a bad reaction since I waas having to consider pts, possibly that day. I also had her go through the acupuncture. She did well with it, all things considered.

Day 5 - pm...she ate really well straight from a can. She also drank well. At one point I left the room for a bit and came back to find her about 4-5 feet from where she had been laying. She was right next to her water bowls and obviously fell over as she reached it. after a while I brought her back to her spot for some more food, but she really wanted the water bowls...so she managed to stand up and WALK (with lots of wobbles and nearly falling multiple times) back to her water bowl. Of course, falling over as she got to it.

Today I found her IN the LB. She fell over in it before she could do her business.

Generally since the acupuncture she has been more calm (aside from 1 or 2 anxiety attacks over water and LB). I did also increase the bupe so it could be related to that as well. She has shown a little more success with her mobility, but really cant go anywhere. She IS pooping and peeing. And eating pretty well. Today was the first time I felt comfortable leaving a cup of water next to her without thinking she would knock it over and I wouldnt be able to get her up to clean the mess on her bed. She drank independantly thru the day as I continued to fill it up.

She still is not sleeping much. A little after the acupuncture, and as today goes on MAYBE a little more. Her eyes are generally wide open and bug eyed since last Thursday. She must be sooooo, sooooo tired.

I dont know what is going to happen here yet. Taking it all day by day. Im planning future days with her (bringing to work, having a friend come sit with her while Im at work, etc). But Im also not counting on the fact that she WILL be here. I hope that makes sense.

She certainly has some big will. Im just baffled that she has not flat out given up with all she has going on. Most humans certainly would.
 
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