Just found out my 6yr old cat has diabetes

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alohaamoore

alohaamoore

Member Since 2014
As soon as I heard from my vet this morning that my 6 year old cat, Nala, has diabetes I had uncontrollable tears until I found this forum! She said her reading is currently at 433. All of her life I have fed her (and my 8 year old cat) Purina dry food in the morning and a 1/2 a can of Friskies Shredded (with gravy, different flavors) for dinner I usually split one can between my 2 cats for dinner. I plan to completely cut dry food out of their diets and switch to the "Friskies Classic Pate" canned food. I will be taking her in tomorrow so my doctor can train me on everything I need to know and how to give her the insulin. My doctor recommends that I switch her food immediately to R/D cat food which is I think is by Hill's Prescription Diet, but it is $28.00 for 24 cans so it's a bit expensive. My question is if anyone knows if the "Friskies Classic Pate" is just as good for cats with diabetes as the "R/D Hills Prescription Diet" that my doctor recommended? And do you feed each cat a full can of food or half?

I also plan to stop by walmart to pick up a ReliOn Confirm along with lancets & strips so that I can monitor her at home like many of you recommend. I am very anxious for her appointment tomorrow for her to get her first dose of insulin. It is comforting to know that there are great people here to help ease the anxiety just by sharing their experiences!

Thank you in advanced to anyone who replies!
-April
 
Low-carb canned like the Friskies is fine. here is a complete list:
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=117688
Standard feeding is 1 5.5 oz can a day. However, some cats require more , some less to maintain their proper weight.
Until you get the diabetes controlled, feed more since the cat can't process the food because of the high BG. A Confirm meter is fine

Welcome
 
Welcome to FDMB,

A diabetes diagnosis is heartbreaking, scary, and confusing at first but your in the right place. You are correct to cut out the dry food, and to start home testing....home testing is a BIG YES!!!!! Its overwhelming at first but it becomes easier.

As to the food, friskies pates are fine and honestly probably better than the prescription food. Most here eat friskie pates or fancy feast pates.

Here is a link to the recommend cat food: (we recommend 10% or less carbs)
http://www.catinfo.org/docs/FoodChartPublic9-22-12.pdf

Dont forget diabetic friendly treats, unfortunately the day of temptations and the like are no more, most here use freeze dried chicken or boiled chicken. I get the freeze dried from amazon it seems to be the cheapest or chewy.com

http://www.amazon.com/Halo--Littles-Nat ... ed+chicken

that chicken turns them into CARNIVORES lol. My cats go crazy for it.

Have you and your vet discussed what TYPE of insulin yet? The recommended insulin is Lantus, Levemire, Prozinc, or PZI. These are longer working insulins that last baout 12 hrs.

May I ask your cats current weight? Are there any other health issues?
 
Thank you all! I will find out today at her appointment what brand of insulin. When I found out yesterday my vet said they had to order it and it would arrive today but I didnt know to ask what brand. She weighs 9.5lbs and no other health issues. She lost weight around her spine back area
 
Jack was 8.8 lbs on DX 8/9/14 and lost weight in the spine area. In a week he was at 9.24 lbs and since getting his diabetes under control, he has replaced some of the muscle mass.

I still think he needs to put on some weight so I have to check his weight.

I bought a baby scale on line so I can weigh him without have to go to the vet where he has spazzz attack, just waiting for it to arrive.

It will be useful for Samantha as the vet said she could stand to lose a lb. She is 14.9 but 3 years ago she weighed 20 lbs.
 
Just got back from Nala's appointment and Vet gave me "Vetsulin (porcine insulin zinc suspension)". I have read on here that this kind is no good can someone please explain??? I have U-40 Syringes and am supposed to give her 1 unit (Just the first notch on the syringe) after eating twice a day. So i'll be starting that tonight after she eats. Do you normally check before or after eating, or both? She recommends not to check her daily unless she is showing signs of being low but I am probably going to check her anyway for peace of mind and I do NOT want a hypo event although my vet said it wouldn't be surprising if it did happen which is not very comforting!!

During the checkup we checked her with my ReliOn Confirm and they use an AlphaTrak. Here were the numbers:
AlphaTrak: 399
Relion Confirm: 336

I also printed out the Glucose Reference to have her look at and she changed some of the numbers after we tested both the Relion and the AlphaTrak: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1oI_ ... QD2JU/edit

I am pretty sure she mixed up the numbers between the relion and alphatrak because she crossed these out and told me to go by these numbers on my Relion Confirm:
< 40 mg/dL (2.2 mmol/L) {< 57-67 mg/dL for an AlphaTrak} <70 mg/dL
- Treat as if HYPO when on insulin
- At nadir (lowest point between shots) in a long term diabetic (more than a year), may earn a reduction.

< 50 mg/dL (2.8 mmol/L) {< 71-83 mg/dL for an AlphaTrak} <100 mg/dL
- If before nadir, steer with food, ie, give modest amounts of medium carb food to keep from going below 50 (2.8).
- At nadir, often indicates dose reduction is earned.

50 - 130 mg/dL (2.8 - 7.2 mmol/L) {71-83 to 186-217 mg/dL for an AlphaTrak} -250 mg/dL (If less than 200 no shot)
- On insulin - great control when following a tight regulation protocol.
- Off insulin - normal numbers. (May even go as low as the upper 30s (1.7 mmol/L){60s for an AlphaTrak}; if not on insulin, this can be safe.

Does this look right or should I go by the numbers she crossed out? She also said that prescription canned food would be better than the Friskies but I simply cannot afford the prescription canned food so I plan to just feed her the Friskies Classic Pates.

Also can't find what testing around +5 or +7 means can someone please link to me where I can find the SS chart instructions and what SS stands for?

Thank you soo much!
 
The problem with vetsulin is it only lasts for about 8 hrs unlike the others that last 12. What this basically means is that before each shot bg will most likely be higher because its been out of the system for a while allowing for the blood sugar to raise again.

My vet put Hidey on vetsulin when he was first diagnosed, although I was told AND charged for Prozinc......after a month of no progress I DEMANDED the Prozinc and luckily was able to get his numbers under control and he is now diet controlled.

Every cat is different, who knows vetsulin may be enough but the 8 hr time frame is why people on here do not recommend it.

As to the testing, please test BEFORE every shot (before eating), if you can get a test in around 4-6 hrs after injection that is helpful as well to see where the numbers fall.

and OMG! I cant believe your vet made the hypo comment!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That right there is the reason for the home testing!
 
Thanks for your quick reply! As I was reading your post Nala was already eating her food but I just got back from the vet about 30 min ago so it wasn't too long ago when she was at at 336 on the Relion Confirm. Do you think I should take away her food and test her or test her after she eats??
 
It depends on what time your giving her her insulin. You want to have 2 set times and try to stick as close to those times everyday. We say test before food because the food will raise the bg (almost like a false reading then), you should be ok though. Usually a good time to give injections is around their meal time because it can distract them while you give the shot, but also if they DONT eat and they get insulin bg can drop too low.
 
Hi,

The testing at +5, +7 is intended to test at the point whereby the Insulin is at its peak of reaction. Also called the Action Curve. It determines the nadir (lowest BG for the cycle).

It takes a while for the insulin to work its magic and timed with feeding at the time of injection, more or less, offsets each other. This results in a smooth curve.

I am not familiar with the type of insulin that you are giving but I (well Jack and Samantha) were prescribed Lantus. One of the 3 along with Levemir and Prozinc (PZI) that are 12 hour insulin's. Lantus is expensive but IMHO, worth it. For what its worth. Change please?

Nice comment from the Vet about hypo, Geezzzzzzz

Use your ReliOn, setup the SS (Spreadsheet) and monitor the numbers. Your goal when using a Human Meter is 50 - 130 @ nadir.

All the best!
 
I really can't thank you all enough for all of the kind and helpful words.

I fed her around 6pm
Gave her 1.0 units of insulin at 6:15pm
At +1 her BG was 407
Its around +3 right now, should I test her again now or in an hour or two?

Earlier today they trained me how to give her the insulin but only used Saline only because UPS didn't deliver the insulin until the appointment was almost over. Ever since I brought her home from the vet she has been laying around being extra sleepy so I can't tell if she is just tired from the vet trip or from getting the insulin. She is not showing any signs of hypo, shes just sleeping on the couch and i'm being a paranoid mother. nailbite_smile
 
I updated the Glucometer Notes in my signature link. The ranges for the glucometers are approximately what we use here, depending on what insulin protocol you are using - Lantus/Levemir Tight Regulation, Lantus/Levemir Start Low Go slow, or Prozinc/PXI.

The estimates for the AlphaTrak take into account the fact that human glucometers generally read 60 to 70% lower.

ie
AlphaTrak * 0.6 or 0.7 = human glucometer estimate.
Human glucometer / 0.6 to 0.7 - AlphaTrak estimate.
 
Hello April and welcome to you and sweet Nala. It's great that you've taken the initiative to do home testing. Cats have the unique ability to go into remission from diabetes, if given the proper support to do so. First a note about food - we recommend low carb wet food or raw, with a carb % under 10. R/D is listed as 34%, so one of the worst choices for a diabetic cat. If you haven't checked out http://www.catinfo.org yet, it's a good read. Lots of information about proper diet for cats. It's written by a vet who wondered why her clients cats couldn't lose weight on the prescription diets, including R/D. Stick to your Friskies Pate.

My kitty Neko was also on Vetsulin, which is also known as Caninsulin. It's a great insulin for dogs. It used to last about 8-9 hours for Neko and she was miserable the other 3-4 hours of the cycle. We have had a few people have their cats go into remission on Vetsulin/Caninsulin, but the odds are much better with the longer last insulins, plus there is less likelihood of a hypo incident. For now, gather data on how Nala does on Vetsulin and maybe you can convince your vet to switch insulins. I kept asking my vet if it was the right insulin, and then I saw a locum vet who got us onto Lantus and sent me to FDMB (which I'd already been reading). the nadir low point on Vetsulin is earlier than the other insulins, so testing from 4 to 6 hours after the shot will help you find out when it is.
 
Thank you! I have created a SS for Nala and posted in my signature for reference.

After her first dose of insulin last night I already see a change in her behavior. Before starting her treatment she was already showing signs of weakness i'm guessing from all the weight loss and stress of her body, laying around on the floor beside her water bowl (she normally finds a comfy spot on the couch), she was drinking LOTs of water and almost constantly begging for food and acting restless.
After giving her the first shot of insulin last night she still looking a bit weak and sleeping and laying around a lot but she is showing no signs of ravenous hunger anymore but she does finish all of her food and she is not drinking very much water. I noticed that when I talk to her (She is normally very talkative) when she meows back she licks her lips almost as if she is thirsty but she isn't drinking as much water now. Is her water intake supposed to decrease this quickly?? I have also cut out dry food completely since 10/1/14 i'm thinking maybe that is another reason why she isn't drinking a lot because the canned food has more water in it?
 
When it comes to the water intake, every cat is different. The best way to think about it is that a sign of diabetes is more water intake, but a cat that eats dry food is already trying to drink water to make up for the loss of water in the food. Dry food has about 5%-10% water but canned has about 78%. That's a big difference. So now that she has a better diet, and isn't dehydrated from that diet there isn't much need for added water.

Hidey loves his water though, but he drinks it because he likes it and likes to play in it. My other 2 cats....the last time I seen them drink water was the day I took the blue buffalo dry a way.
 
I am also trying to search for info on here about testing for Ketones. I have read that you test from urine but can't find info on when it is necessary to test for them and what product will I need to I test for them? When I was at Walmart yesterday I remember seeing a box of Ketone strips. What specific brand do you recommend?
 
Wysong Epigen is a zero carb dry food that's reasonably priced (cheaper than Young Again Zero Carbs, and comes in 3 flavors). I buy it at 1800petmeds, but many other places also sell it.

Do not give your cat any wet foods with gravy!

Many of the Special Kitty canned cat food are pate and very low wet cat foods. Especially the Turkey and Giblets that comes in a 22oz can for $1. (price in Maryland, may be cheaper elsewhere). Walmart only, and you might have to go to more than one store to find these since Walmart doesn't stock their stores properly.

http://www.walmart.com/ip/Special-Kitty ... z/38345488
0007874203628_215X215.jpg


Not all stores carry the 22oz size (that's the same as 4 "regular" 5.5 oz cans). So if you see them, you should stock up! I do not see any carbs in the ingredient list AND if my cat can eat it without it spiking his blood sugar then I know it's low or no carb!

The other special kitty variety's that are low in carb (but probably have some carbs):
Special Kitty Chicken and Tuna Canned Cat Food I have only ever seen this as 13oz can for .70 or 4 pack of 5.5oz cans for $1.44
http://www.walmart.com/ip/Special-Kitty ... z/38345545
0068113105885_215X215.jpg



Special Kitty Canned Cat Food, Ocean Whitefish & Tuna Dinner, 5.5 oz, 4 count - $1.44
http://www.walmart.com/ip/Special-Kitty ... t/23623489
0007874202610_215X215.jpg

I have not seen this in larger can sizes, only 5.5 oz cans.

Also (not pictures) is the Super Supper and the Classic Tuna also in 13oz cans for .70 each. Widely available and low in carb.

I have tried the Mixed Grill, it's pate and most likely low carb, but my cats don't like it.

I also mix extra water into my wet cat food to form something closer to a soup. I do this to partly makeup for the fact that they are eating mostly dry food and to sort of simulate the gravy that they like so much in high carb wet foods.

And yes feeding my cat this my cat does not need insulin!
 
alohaamoore said:
I am also trying to search for info on here about testing for Ketones. I have read that you test from urine but can't find info on when it is necessary to test for them and what product will I need to I test for them? When I was at Walmart yesterday I remember seeing a box of Ketone strips. What specific brand do you recommend?
Click to expand...


Those are the strips I use.

Here is some added info on ketones and testing:
http://binkyspage.tripod.com/faq.html#ketones

I test as often as I can catch, which isnt too often lol. If he seemed off for some reason, I would definitely check. Ex. not eating, not drinking or drinking more, vomiting.
 
Do the Ketone Strips need a separate meter than the ReliOn Confirm meter to read them or is it built into the strips? I will be going to Walmart in a little bit to buy some.

Shes really worrying me because she seems very tired today and last night.
I just tested her a BG at +4 (283) and +5 (318) and the Vetsulin doesn't seem to be working very long like you said :/
Her numbers are not at Hypo so why is she so tired and sluggish?

She just had her first insulin shot last night so is it too early for me to be worried about Ketones and Diabetic Ketoacidosis and is there anything you can do to prevent it?
 
Ive never had to really deal with diabetic ketacidosis, but from what I've seen is when there is even a tiny bit showing on the test strip to take them to the vet immediately and I know the vets push fluids. The strips do not need anything to go with it.....you may want to grab the box of gloves they have in the diabetic section or a long stirring spoon from the houseware department. The strips are about the same width as the bg test stips but longer....almost resembling a matchstick because at the very end theres a chemical compound. You need to put the end in the strip in the urine, either by putting it in the stream or catching it (some use fish tank gravel or special litter) I just wore gloves and caught his stream.....he just gave me this look like "HEY! Your violating me in the litter box now?!!!!"

The best thing to help prevent it, is just keep up the good work with insulin, testing and diet. As to being sluggish I think thats just the stress of the new routine plus the bodies way of introducing the insulin.

I wish there was more to do right now to lower the numbers but its just one of those things where you have to just wait and see. As to the insulin, honestly it would probably be best (if you can afford it at the moment-UGH vets are so expensive) is to switch insulin. If you look at Hidey's spreadsheet and scroll all the way to the top, you'll see where he was when we started on vetsulin and how his numbers dropped when I got him on prozinc. I paid about $80 for the prozinc and about $50 for the vetsulin, so it was worth the cost, but my vet made me wait a month and see how the vetsulin was working.

Yes....my vet is one of those ones that wanted vetsulin, I DEMANDED prozinc, she wasnt really for home testing, and told me I didnt need to change his diet but IF I wanted to she recommended the Science diet prescription food for diabetics. Nothing felt better than going in there when he needed to have his teeth cleaned, and 2 extractions :( with his spreadsheet OFF insulin in about 2 1/2 months because I DIDN'T follow her advice lol. I wish if they knew they werent knowledgeable in something they would just admit it instead of this god syndrome....whats the shame with learning something new?

On a good note though, it does become easier and may even (eventually) become a bonding time for you and Nala. Hidey has never been a lap kitty, he wouldnt avoid us or anything but he was never the type to lay around with you. He'd say "Hi" get a few rubs and walk away. Now, he loves testing time because of all the chicken he gets but also loves the attention. Out of no where he'll come push his way on to my lap. He's like a whole new cat.....heck he's even stolen his chicken breast out of the pot(I boil chicken for him as a treat too) twice. He's never climbed on the counters before lol
 
Aww I'm so happy to hear that Hidey is doing great just after 2 1/2 months and that hes more cuddly now I think he is definitely thanking you for poking him so many times to make him feel better :) And I feel like our Vets are very similar and if this Vetsulin doesn't seem to be working I will try and switch but my budget is kinda tight to try and switch it right now.

In the early stages of Hideys SS, whenever you started upping the dosage from 1.00 - 1.50 was that off of your instinct or did you get the go from your vet? I feel like I can't call her with the numbers because she told me to not bother to test daily unless I think shes low (not listening to that I will def monitor her daily!) and to do a curve in 2 weeks. I work from home so I have no problem checking her anytime. Also her assistant gave me a price on the "Glucose Intepret Results"($31.50) meaning I can give her the numbers over the phone instead of bringing Nala in to where they can monitor her and do a curve ($100 plus $25 for every BG test!!) Does your vet charge an interpretation of Hidey's numbers?

I am going to make a run to Walmart now to pickup what I need for the Ketone testing.
 
LOL honestly, I have never even heard of that term. The most my vet would do is try to insist on me bringing him in for a curve, and that was like $200 for the day :shock: UMMMMM NO! I can do that at home lol.

Im assuming, thinking about the statement all that means is they'll charge you to call, say hey here's what the numbers are doing, and them go uh ya ok looks good or up the dosage and charge you? I may be incorrect since im not familair but thats what it sounds like to me.

As to upping the dosage, that was both me and the vet only because I would call them and yell at them that his numbers kept going higher and higher and they would say ummmm ok try to up it! GRRRR!

The thing you have going for you is (in my opinion) it seems it was caught early because the numbers arent THAT high. I don't know if you noticed on Hideys spread sheet but he was upper 500's-600's when he was diagnosed. You may be able to regulate with this insulin and diet change, just keep monitoring. Also, you may want to try feeding several small meals a day. If Hidey goes too long without eating his BG starts to rise, so I had to get a timed feeder because the worse time for him would be first thing in the A.M. but maybe since you work from home try to split the meals into 3 or 4 servings to try to level the numbers out some.

In all honesty, the only reason Hidey is in remission is because of the people and information on this board. Unfortunately my vet was no help, which is a shame because up until that I really liked her. Shes always been very caring, thorough and really took the time to talk to you about any concerns.

I'd probably keep the 1 unit 2 times a day for a few days, try to get some more data (tests) in to see what the lowest drop is and then go from there. That will also give Nala's body a chance to get used to the food change but also the insulin.
 
When we were on Vetsulin/Caninsulin, my vet said to stay on a particular dose for 3 days to see how it was doing, before deciding if it needed to go up. You are getting some good test data to show how Nala is doing on the insulin. You want to see how low the insulin is taking her blood sugar so those mid cycle tests are great. My vet never charged for a consultation on dose either - of course, they were getting enough money in blood tests. :roll:

Ketones are a concern if you have a combination of high numbers (not enough insulin) plus not enough food plus infection. If you see anything above trace on the ketone test strips, then you need to contact your vet. Some people use a little tray of tin foil or a ladle that they stick under their cat when peeing. Or if Nala is shy, then using clean aquarium gravel or something like lentils above plastic will help trap the pee. You can get meters that test the blood for ketones, but the strips are more expensive. For kitties that are prone to ketones or really hard to catch in the act, they are a good solution.
 
I am starting to get REALLY worried now.

If you take a look at Nala's SS for today her numbers are high and not budging. She is acting lethargic, she is hiding and sleeping a lot and looking very weak. She just threw up a little liquid (no solid) right now and is having really really soft very foul stinky poop. I got the Ketone strips but have not been able to catch her peeing yet. She is eating ok, but not drinking much water at all, in fact I cannot remember the last time I saw her drinking water!

I wasn't home for most of the day yesterday but when I got home I also found a lot of throw up probably a whole can of food but I have 2 cats and switched them both from 50/50 dry/wet to strickly wet food so I wasn't sure WHO it was who threw up but now I am thinking it WAS Nala. She is also licking her lips a lot as though she is thirsty and dry-mouthed but I can't get her to drink any water. I can't stop worrying and crying I don't know what is wrong she is not feeling well :(

I am so scared she has Diabetic Ketoacidosis because I keep reading about how expensive and serious it is and I just don't know if it is worth putting her through the stress of being hospitalized. I myself have suffered from anxiety in the past and I am just not sure I am strong enough to deal with this I am feeling hopeless :(
 
Re: SO worried! Nala is now vomiting, lethargic and has diar

Could be DKA, could be pancreatitis, could be exocrine pancreatic insufficiency (stinky poop), could be hepatic lipidosis.

If her glucose is high, you can give a token dose of insulin to get the level down. Base it on how much drop you got previously and maybe halve or quarter the dose.
 
Hi. I am new to the board and new to feline diabetes. My 13 1/2 year old tabby, Maxine, was diagnosed two and a half weeks ago. Her bg at vet was 400+. The vet said 1.5 units Lantus twice a day and to feed her DM Savory Selects. Now I hear that gravy isn't good and Savory Selects has gravy AND is higher in carbs than other wet food!! I have taken her off all dry food. She seems much better now....drinking and peeing less, and behaving more herself. But I haven't tested her once! I go to the vet tomorrow. Everyone on this board is making me think more about testing her. Should I be testing her even if she seems ok now?
To summerize: She gets insulin twice a day and 1 3/4 cans wet food daily, consisting of one can DM Savory Selects and 3/4 can Natures Variety Chicken Instinct.
Maybe I should switch Friskies Pâté like everyone does here.
I am so confused and yet, Maxine seems fine. help!
BTW she lost weight/muscle mass before diagnosed and is now 11 lbs. I would like to see her put on a pound so I need a low carb/higher fat wet food. Any suggestions. I can run this all by the vet tomorrow.
Thank you for any response!!
 
Hi Maxine's Mom. Your post will get lost here at the end of the thread. I'll start a new one for you with a star next to it: Maxine Newbie Lantus. Look for responses there.
 
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