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pamelasue711

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Hello. My 11 year old cat, Lucien (aka Bug), was just diagnosed with diabetes on friday (9/23). I was given the choice of two insulin shots a day or "the other option". After discussing it with Lu, he assured me he did not want me to give up on him. Since I decided to opt for treatment, what am I in for? How much work is it caring for a diabetic pet? How much does it cost? I don't want to seem heartless. I love my Buggy. However, I have two other cats, two dogs, a toddler, another one on the way, a full-time job, I'm just getting over HG (severe vomiting of pregnancy, which is probably why I didn't notice Bug was sick too), and I doubt my husband will help with any of Bug's medical care. I would appreciate any advice or tips to make this easier (and cheap! as we are a one income household!). Thank you!
 
Welcome Pamela and Lucien! You've landed in the right place to figure all this out! KT was diagnosed in June so we're fairly new to this dance also. The sugar dance is NOT a hard dance, it just takes patience and learning different steps.

I sure am glad you and Lucien decided to ignore that 'other option'. KT is one of 10+ cats as well as 7 dogs and a husband with a serious illness requiring constant care to stay alive. After the first little bit of getting used to it all, it's NOT hard nor overly time-consuming. The cost can be managed with 'regular' canned cat food like Fancy Feast, Friskies, 9 Lives, Special Kitty, etc. Vets LOVE to sell their 'diabetic' foods but there's no reason to go to that expense.

Are you shooting insulin yet? What instructions did the vet give you? There's lots of 'sticky's' all over the place here describing protocols, approaches, tips, 'what to do's', AND lots of experienced people to step up and walk you thru any problems you encounter..

More people will be along to add to this, I just wanted to say WELCOME!
 
Hi Pamela and "bug"!
Once you become familiar with the routine, treating feline diabetes is an very manageable condition. It won't consume your day or your bank account. You would test his blood glucose using an inexpensive human meter, feed him a proper diet of low carb canned foods you can find at the grocery store, and shoot him with insulin twice a day.
A couple things you can let us know...
What type of insulin? And where are you located (city and/or state)? There may be a member close by that could actually show you how to do this.
Carl in SC
 
Welcome Pamela & "Bug"

Once you get in the routine caring for a diabetic pet becomes as simple as brushing your teeth...I have 2 sugarcats...Maxwell and Musette both of which I adopted because they were diabetic and their previous owners had opted for the "other" option. Maxwell is now in remission and off insulin and Musette with any luck at all is headed towards following him there, but for now she is still insulin dependent. However, when I adopted them both I already had 11 other cats, one large dog, and am a full time college student as well as being a wife, mother and grandmother. If this wasn't an easy dance to learn, do you really think I would have signed up for dancing with 2 of them? :-D

Mel, Maxwell, Musette & The Fur Gang
 
Welcome! We started just a couple months ago and here are a few point that made a big difference for us...

Diet, Diet, Diet.
Getting him on a low-carb diet will have a huge impact on Bug's condition, you will probably see a difference in just a day or 2. Your challenge will be keeping him from eating the other cat's food. We ended up changing all our cat's food to low-carb: Fancy Feast Classic wet and EVO dry. Diet has such a huge impact that you can't get into an good insulin "routine" until the food switch is made. Diet and Insulin go hand in hand.

Do everything you can to get him on a long lasting Insulin, avoid Humulin. It will make the whole experience soooo much easier. If Lantus is selected you can call around to find a pharmacy to sell you individual "pens" (<$50) rather than having to by a 5-pack (>$200), or buy Canadian ;-) .

Home test! You can buy all the supplies for what 1 vet visit costs. Plus you wont have to take the time and put Bug through the stress of the vet visit. :-D Home testing and giving the shots, depending on the cat, is often very routine, quick and easy.

Best of success!
 
welcome the both of you!!

I just wanted to let you know that this is easy and after you get the hang of it, not scarey at all. When my Sugar Bean was dx, I found this site within 2-5 days I think. This is THE BEST PLACE YOU WILL FIND!!
Bring it all to the board, vet advice, fears, joys...all of it and it will be shared!

After listening to the folks here (more than the vet advice), my Sugar Bean was in remission within 5 wks and she still is. She still eats only low carb foods, treats and raw! We are now practicing raw transition, will be a slow process and I am waiting on my grinder (complements of my boss) to come in the mail.

I have 3 girls and 2 out of the 3 eat the same low carb....the other is another story and let me say, it is a pain in the a** to have to watch over her and keep the others out of it. GGGRRRRR! I would suggest feeding all the same just as mentioned earlier. And we are working on that too.

I think I spent approx. $30.00 to get the test machine - relion from walmart, strips of 50 ea and lancets...very very affordable and of course some special treats...petco tuna flakes (I am now going to buy those from an asian store).

Keep us posted and welcome aboard!
 
Hi there,

My Lucy was just diagnosed last week as well. Thanks to everyone for the advice already in this thread. It has been very helpful and encouraging.

I have a couple of other queries, if you don't mind giving out a bit more advice.

I have been giving Lucy her insulin shots twice a day for the last week and switched her to the Purina DM wet and dry as the vet suggested. It is very expensive but I thought it was worth it until she gets stabilized.

She is already doing better, much more active and she is starting to gain weight again. But she still has that ravenous hunger and is almost constantly asking for food. It doesn't seem to matter how much wet food I give her, she just keeps wanting more and she is constantly stealing her brother Jasper's wet food, as well. Luckily he is rather obese (though healthy as a horse unlike Lucy who is petite and somehow ended up diabetic) and can afford to lose a little weight. But I am feeding them separately in the mornings and evenings now so that he gets his share of the canned food (also the DM now)

Anyway, my question is how much should I give into Lucy's demands for food?

So far it hasn't made a difference if I feed her half a can each in the morning and evening or if I feed her a quarter can four times a day. She has the Purina DM dry food to nibble on the rest of the time so she (and Jasper) are not starving. I am really not sure if she is asking for food because she is actually hungry or if it is more of an emotional reaction to the rapid weight loss and onset of diabetes. Should I consider giving her more than a can a day?

Has anyone else gone through something like this in the early stages and what did you do about it?

The other question I have is that because I work out of the house most of the time, the cats are alone all day so I have to leave the dry food out for them. As I mentioned, I have switched to the low carb DM, but do you guys think this will impede the possibility of remission for Lucy?
 
Hi!
A newly diagnosed diabetic kitty can't get the nutrition out of food that a non-diabetic or regulated diabetic cat can. Initially, they will act just like your sugarcat is acting - ravenous appetite, feed me feed me feed me!
At this point, feed her as much as she wants. Try not to feed an hour or two before AM and PM pre-shot testing, because her BG will be elevated from the food, and will give you a higher number.
The best thing you can do, however, is try to get rid of any dry food from her diet. Dry food is high in carbs, and carbs are a diabetic kitty's worst enemy. Most vets prescribe the same thing you got - "Diabetic Management" wet and dry, whether it's purina, science diet, Hill's Prescription, or some other sort of "good for diabetics" food.
If you click on the "binky's" link below my name, it will take you to a great page full of links all about feline nutrition. There are links to "canned food charts" (old and new). The charts list many brands of food, sorted in alphabetical order. Many are available at the grocery store. What you want to look at is the column headed "carbs". Look for food that is lower than 10% carbs value. Popular brands include Friskees pates, Fancy Feast Classics, and Wal-Mart's Special Kitty. A lot of us use those, with great results. It will also save you money!
Until you remove the dry food from her diet, it will be very difficult to get her stabilized. Removing dry food from your non-diabetic's diet will also be a great thing you can do for him. Dry food is junk, for all cats.
Carl in SC
 
Thanks for the advice Carl. I will feed Lucy as much wet food as she wants for now.

Also thanks for the advice on the commercial foods. They always ate fancy feast before so it will be good to be able to switch back to that. The prescription food is actually more than I can afford in the long term.

One question about getting rid of the dry food -- because my working hours can be irregular and there is no way I can come home during the day to feed them, what do you suggest I do in the morning before I leave for work. Just put out more wet food than I normally would, ie half a can of Fancy Feast each? Because I have never had to monitor their food intake because of the dry food, I guess I am unsure how much canned food they would need.
 
You can freeze the wet food and leave it out to thaw during the day so they can graze. (I use a silicone cupcake pan- a can of FF fits in each cup.)

BUT don't completely switch over to wet food until you are hometesting. The diet can make a huge difference in the numbers. My cat Oliver went down 100 points overnight when we switched completely from dry to wet.
 
Kalyv,

Feel free to start a new thread so that you can introduce us to you and your brand new sugarcat! Please let us know also what kind of insulin the vet gave you, and what the dosage is. Like Sue said, if you aren't already, you should consider home testing before making a complete diet change. The current dose may be too high once the wet food starts to lower the BG level. You definitely don't want to be shooting "blind" when changing to a low-carb diet.

Carl
 
Thanks to everyone for the support and advice. We have not started insulin yet. I will be visiting Lucien's vet on monday. I wanted to get him some new food though. Lu will NOT eat wet food. At all. Ever. I'm sure my other two would love an all wet food diet, but not my Bug. So, are there any good dry foods? Has anyone tried Blue Buffalo? I'll need something I can leave out all day for all 3 cats to eat. My husband is home during the day, but he's busy with our 21 month old, and he does not multi-task well.
 
pamelasue711 said:
Lu will NOT eat wet food. At all. Ever.
Click to expand...

This is a low-carb dry food. If you click on "guaranteed analysis," you will see that it says 7% carb. On the menu running across the top of the page, check out "Where to buy" for a store near you that carries it.

http://www.evopet.com/products/1441

I feed wet but I keep a bowl of EVO out all the times, mostly because my non-diabetic likes dry. Do whatever you can to try to move your kitty to at least a mixture of wet and dry. Diabetic cats drink and pee a lot, causing problems with dehydration. Wet food helps by adding water to the diet. Dry food adds none.

Lana
 
I took Lucien to the vet today. He is on 4 units of insulin twice a day. The insulin is Prozinc. It was $90 for the vial, which was more than I was expecting. Also, my vet said not to change his diet. And he doesn't recommend home testing. He wants me to bring Lu back in a month or two and leave him there for glucose testing. That's going to be $100. This is getting very expensive. I told the vet I'm changing his food anyway. I got something called Call of the Wild (I think) that is grain free. The dogs seemed excited about it. The cats, not so much. They ate around the pieces of new food. I just think if Lu has a better diet, he might not need as much insulin? Maybe? Also, since I'm not testing his glucose levels, and he hasn't been eating much lately, I'm a little worried about hypoglycemia. I feel like I don't know what I'm doing and I'm a little scared to give Lu his shot in the morning since I've never given a shot before. Also, I'll be at work tomorrow and my in-laws are babysitting my daughter (my husband is out of town), so I'm scared that no one will be watching him.
 
It is hard to hear advice that conflicts with what your vet says, but it sounds like you may be a little unsure of his advice.

4 units is a very high beginning dose. We suggest 1 unit twice daily. We figure you can always add insulin if his numbers remain high, but you can't get the insulin out of the cat once you shoot.

We figure we would never shoot insulin into our 2 legged children without testing first, so we do the same for our 4 legged ones. Numbers at the vet can be much higher than you would get at home. Most cats are stressed at the vet and stress raises blood glucose levels. Then doses based on those numbers can be too high once the kitty gets home and relaxes. So we test at home.

If you won't be home tomorrow, I would either give one unit or wait until the next day when you will be home. I would not give 4 units and leave him alone. If you want help learning to home test, tell us your city and state. Maybe we have a member who lives near you who could help
 
Pamelasue & Lu,
I would stongly suggest that the advice here could save your Lu's life. My vet did Bean's curve 1 week after dx and raised the 1 unit to 2. I had found this site and did not raise it the whole 2, but did increase by .25 to .50.. I was not testing but planned to. I started testing and could not get the process down to actually get a reading for the first 4-5 tests. However, I did get a test in one nite after I had already did the shot. It was 2 hours after the shot and Beans number was ONLY 27!! It took this site, NOT MY VET, that helped me for over 4 hours and well into the night, to get her number back into the 40-50 range.
I would definately test at home, change the food to low carb that you can buy in the local stores and not let the vet intimidate you into something you dont feel comfortable to do!
This site was what saved my sugar girl, not the vets.....
Sorry, really makes me angry reading your post knowing I was there too and could have lost my girl!
What part of the world are you in? I know there are folks everywhere and someone would come help you if needed...... they (wonderful Patricia) did for me.
Good luck and keep us posted
 
pamelasue711 said:
I took Lucien to the vet today. He is on 4 units of insulin twice a day. The insulin is Prozinc. It was $90 for the vial, which was more than I was expecting. Also, my vet said not to change his diet. And he doesn't recommend home testing. He wants me to bring Lu back in a month or two and leave him there for glucose testing. That's going to be $100. This is getting very expensive. I told the vet I'm changing his food anyway. I got something called Call of the Wild (I think) that is grain free. The dogs seemed excited about it. The cats, not so much. They ate around the pieces of new food. I just think if Lu has a better diet, he might not need as much insulin? Maybe? Also, since I'm not testing his glucose levels, and he hasn't been eating much lately, I'm a little worried about hypoglycemia. I feel like I don't know what I'm doing and I'm a little scared to give Lu his shot in the morning since I've never given a shot before. Also, I'll be at work tomorrow and my in-laws are babysitting my daughter (my husband is out of town), so I'm scared that no one will be watching him.
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Pamela,

I think the food you're referring to is "Taste of the Wild". Even though it's grain free, it's still too high in carbs for a diabetic cat (around 26%). I know this personally because it's the dry food Bandit ate when he was diagnosed with diabetes. It has a lot of potatoes in it, which is a high-glycemic food. There are many commercial canned foods that are inexpensive, grain-free, and low carb. Here's a link to the grain-free flavors of Fancy Feast: http://felinediabetes.com/glutenfree.htm. Friskies and Special Kitty also have low carb flavors of wet food. You'll need to make sure Lu has no access to dry food anymore, because it will keep her blood sugar levels high.

Taste of the Wild is a pretty good food for dogs..dogs are fine with having some dry food in their diet, but cats are not. This is a great web site that explains the basics of feline nutrition: http://www.catinfo.org

4 units is a high starting dose. On a low carb canned diet, most cats don't need more than 1u of insulin. I'm afraid your vet is not giving you the correct advice. Testing at home is the only way to keep your cat safe, and testing at the vet is useless because most of the time the numbers are inflated because of stress. My vet recommended home testing to me, and I never would have been able to successfully treat Bandit's diabetes without it--both financially and treatment wise. Not only does it save you a ton of money, the results are more accurate and allows you better control over your cat's blood sugar.

If you are changing to a low carb canned diet, DO NOT shoot 4u of insulin. This could be very dangerous. Many diabetic cats' blood sugar drops over 100 points once the dry food is removed from their diet almost instantly. Some cats even no longer need insulin after the diet is changed, or a very small amount of insulin.
 
pamelasue711 said:
I took Lucien to the vet today. He is on 4 units of insulin twice a day. The insulin is Prozinc. It was $90 for the vial, which was more than I was expecting. Also, my vet said not to change his diet. And he doesn't recommend home testing. He wants me to bring Lu back in a month or two and leave him there for glucose testing. That's going to be $100. This is getting very expensive. I told the vet I'm changing his food anyway. I got something called Call of the Wild (I think) that is grain free. The dogs seemed excited about it. The cats, not so much. They ate around the pieces of new food. I just think if Lu has a better diet, he might not need as much insulin? Maybe? Also, since I'm not testing his glucose levels, and he hasn't been eating much lately, I'm a little worried about hypoglycemia. I feel like I don't know what I'm doing and I'm a little scared to give Lu his shot in the morning since I've never given a shot before. Also, I'll be at work tomorrow and my in-laws are babysitting my daughter (my husband is out of town), so I'm scared that no one will be watching him.
Click to expand...

Pamela,
I don't want to just flat out say "OMG that's way too much insulin for a starting dose!!!". Most kitties seem to be given a i unit twice a day dose at the beginning. BUT there may be a clinical reason for your vet prescribing 4u. There are a couple things that concern me about what your vet said, though.
One is the starting dose. Another is the "don't change the diet". And, the biggest is "don't home test".
There are 3 really important aspects to managing feline diabetes.
Home testing before every shot.
A low-carb diet.
A logical dose regimen using the "start low, go slow" approach.
Thousands of "sugarcats" have been treated, some have gone into remission, and almost all have continued to lead long and healthy lives by following those three steps. Your vet pretty much telling you that none of those three applies to Lu? That's troubling to me.

What I would do is this - call or go by the vet asap. Ask them if you could get a copy of any test results from the bloodwork they did when they diagnosed Lu. With a 4u BID insulin schedule, there has to be a good reason behind that. There could be "other complications" that led them to feel that 4 units are necessary. Did they tell you anything other than "Lu has diabetes"? Did they mention any thyroid issues?
How much does Lu weigh? Some vets decide on a starting dose based on weight. While this might be applicable to dogs, it isn't with cats. It could be they have very little experience with cats and lots with dogs.
If you have a copy of the lab results, there are really experienced members here who can help you make sense of the numbers.


Last thing for now - If there is no logical reason for your vet prescribing an abnormally high starting dose, then I'd say all the advice (dose, don't test, don't change diet, just bring him back in a couple months for another test) is wrong. I'd even go so far as saying it's irresponsible (and I really try not to bash vets). That advice, especially telling you to just shoot him twice a day without any idea of where his blood glucose levels are at, could cost Lu his life, or at best, result in a life-threatening situation.
Please call your vet and ask him lots of questions, and let us know what he says?

Carl
 
I seem to get better advice from this web site then from my vet. I have a few questions I hope that you can help me with. I started Bart on insulin last Thursday. When I test him in the morning should it be before I feed him. or after and if after how long after. I get up at 3am so I can be to work by 5. Also I'm going to be doing his first curve soon and the vet told me that I should feed him in the morning and wait a half hour before I give him his first test but the paper work she had me read said to test him before I feed him. I want to do the best for him and maybe get this turned around. Also what kind of feeding schedule should I put him on he is on FF and I feed him when he is hungry. Thanks
 
bart said:
I seem to get better advice from this web site then from my vet. I have a few questions I hope that you can help me with. I started Bart on insulin last Thursday. When I test him in the morning should it be before I feed him. or after and if after how long after. I get up at 3am so I can be to work by 5. Also I'm going to be doing his first curve soon and the vet told me that I should feed him in the morning and wait a half hour before I give him his first test but the paper work she had me read said to test him before I feed him. I want to do the best for him and maybe get this turned around. Also what kind of feeding schedule should I put him on he is on FF and I feed him when he is hungry. Thanks
Click to expand...

Your best bet is to start a new thread and title it New here, have some questions or Advice needed on feeding and shooting. That way your questions wont get lost in another thread

Yes you test before you feed, you want to know what his blood sugar is before you give him food because the food will raise his blood sugar

I can't answer the questions about the curve, again another reason to start a new thread so that the people who do know the answer can find your post and answer you quickly

How much FF do you give him? There are a couple of options when its comes to feeding. I put out the entire days worth of food out for Raja and she grazes all day. Other people give half of the food in the morning and half in the evening and yet other people freeze part of the food and set it out so that it thaws throughout the day. It depends more on how Bart eats more than anything else because you need to keep in mind when you shoot he needs to eat.

One thing that would be very helpful when you start a new post is to tell us what insulin Bart is on and how much you give him. Also if you can start a spread sheet that's also very helpful
 
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