Interpreting BG readings for newly diagnosed kitty

Status
Not open for further replies.
F

fearfeasog

Member Since 2013
Hi all, Mark here, our cat Buster is diabetic and in the early stages of insulin regulation. he won't eat though, and testing his blood is difficult seemingly because he's a bit dehydrated, but also we're not so experienced yet.

the doc says 2 units am and pm, but the BG readings we get in the AM are pretty low-100-140. this is the last two days. what should we do in this case? seems risky to inject, even if he does get the minimum amt of food (low carb of course)

when its 400, as it seems to be at dinner time, its a no brainer. we feed what we can and in ject.

this is all very confusing, and it's difficult to find answers to specific situational questions like this, so I appreciate your answers and patience!

best to you all and your kitties!

Mark
 
Hello there!
I need a wee bit more info to go on...
What type of insulin are you giving? Also What kind of food are you giving him (type and brand).

Lastly can you give me an idea of how the results relate to the shot time ie

7am gave shot
8am measured 400
10am measured 100
7pm gave shot
and so on?

Thanks
Wendy
 
Hi and welcome :cool:

Yes, it is all very confusing - at first. You have come to the right place though. Here you will find answers to your questions.

As Wendy mentioned, we need to know what insulin your kitty is on as well as what he is eating.

If you have any data collected, please start a spreadsheet. This will help us help you (as well as help you understand what's going on with your kitty). You'll notice that we have links to our kitties spreadsheets in our signatures.

The link below will take you to the set up instructions:
http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=18207&start=0

You mentioned that he won't eat - how long as this been the case? Please go to the pharmacy and get some Ketostix and start checking his urine for the presence of ketones. It's very important to monitor for ketones, particularly when BGs are unregulated and a kitty is not eating and drinking enough.

Hang in there. You'll get you mind around all this with time. The tribal knowledge here on the FDMB is amazing.
 
Starting at 0.5 to 1.0 units is usually safer. If you find that you are skipping shots because your cat's glucose is too low, its a sign you need to reduce the dose. The ideal dose is an amount which may be given safely, every 12 hours, never taking the glucose too low (below 50).

Generally, you want cats on a low carb, canned or raw diet (<= 10% calories from carbohydrates). See Cat Info for more info and a list of nutritional info for a number of foods available in the Us.

CAUTION: if you are changing from dry food to low carb canned or raw food, the glucose level may drop over 100 points. If you are currently feeding dry, you must be testing to make this change safely.
 
Are you feeding wet food? One trick I use to get some extra water in my cat is to fill the Fancy Feast can (after I've emptied onto Jack's plate) about 1/2 full with warm water and stir it up to get all the leftover bits and gelatin. I tell Jack that it's gravy, and he seems to buy it.

It seems that many vets recommend a high starting dose -- often around 2 units, but it seems that the estimates based on the protocols listed here are quite a bit lower (usually around .5 or 1.0 for Lantus) and are very effective -- I found that to be true, and fortunately had a vet who was willing to be flexible with me (I ended up starting at 1.0 unit, went up to 1.5, and then started working down). You may want to do that calculation for your kitty.

Good luck as you get things figured out! You are in the right place -- people here are wonderful and helpful.
 
Hi again all, sorry I disappeared there...

Buster has been eating dry, up until he wouldn't eat. Now we use friskies that is below the accepted carb range according to the list.but that's WHEN he eats.

Buster gets Lantus

Buster weighs between 7.5 and 8 pounds right now.

I managed to set up the SS and link to it in my sig. BUT I have not quite figured out how to use it. I'll type out the info I have here:

(there were other tests before this, but the test strips were expired--we since bought new ones. FWIW we use a bayer contour meter)

2/2
syringe fed in am unable to get BG reading
7:20 pm BG 346 (new strips)
7:30 syringe fed
7:40 2U

2/3
9:45 am BG 133 (no shot)
food 9:50 (ate small meal on his own)
5:10 pm BG 128 (no shot)
food 5:30 ish (small mean on own)

no reading yet this am. but he ate a very small amt on his own

If someone would explain the mysteries of the SS to me I'd appreciate it! Normally I'd be awake and ready by now but I slept in--yawn!

Question: If as BJM says, switching from dry to wet low carb can cause such a dramatic BG change, is it possible I wasted $150 on a bottle of Lantus? ohmygod_smile

also, will talk to vet abt lower starting dose.

Thanks, all, m
 
ok great! good job on the testing!

The way the SS works is that
AMPS = A.M. Pre Shot. this is the test reading you get just before your morning (a.m.) shot.
U = what dose you gave at that time i.e. 2IU
+1 to +12 = the hours after the shot. For example if you did a reading 4 hours after the morning shot you would enter the data under +4
PMPS = P.M. Pre Shot. So the test reading immediately before his p.m. shot.

With your numbers for example
2/2
PMPS 346
U 2IU

2/3
AMPS 133
U "Skip" (cos you didnt shoot)
PMPS 128
U "Skip" (no shot)

Now I do see a few things though.

1. You need to be consistent with shot times - Lantus needs to be given every 12 hours (give or take 15minutes). Otherwise it affects the dose in his system.
2. You need to get some mid day readings to see how low he is really going during the day like at +5 to +7. Once we have more data we will also know if you should shoot at 130, how he typically behaves on the insulin and whether he needs a reduction or what.

Let me know when you have updated the SS!
thanks

Wendy
 
Hi, Buster's mom Steph here.

Just want to clarify that up until he was diagnosed, Buster was given one small snack of wet food each morning, a meal of wet food for dinner, and another small snack of wet food at bedtime. We left a bowl of dry food out for him to eat when he felt like it. He has always been a picky eater. He likes to nibble throughout the day.

Just after the diagnosis is when he stopped eating and drinking. During that time, we rehydrated him with chicken broth and fed him Hills A/D mixed with chicken broth, everything through a syringe. He has since started eating and drinking small amounts on his own.

We consulted Janet & Binky's Table of Canned Cat Food Nutritional Information and made a list of low carb Friskies food. Now, when Buster eats on his own, he eats Friskies low carb wet to which we add water to help keep him hydrated and because it seems easier for him to eat. If he won't eat on his own, we feed him the Hills AD canned mixed with chicken broth.

I should probably also add that Buster is on his second course of antibiotics--Clavamox--to help clear up what the vet says seems to be an infected ulcer on one side of his mouth. There was probably a month between the first course and the second. We discovered the diabetes during the second mouth checkup when we decided to do blood work because Buster had lost weight. His mouth looks much, much better and he hasn't shown the signs he'd shown previously of it bothering him for a while, but it was still red at the time of the checkup. He's nearly finished with this course of Clavamox which we give him twice daily, morning and night.

Getting BG readings has been difficult. If anyone has any special tips or tricks for making a kitty give up a drop of blood, we'd be happy to hear them. It's not that he gets fussy, it's that he just doesn't bleed. We have to prick his ear multiple times before any sign of red shows up.
 
Thanks for your reply, Wendy! We know that it's supposed to be 12 hours between shots on the Lantus. The reason we haven't done that I guess is that we're erring on the side of caution when we're able to get a BG reading and it seems low to be giving the shot.

Initially, he was lethargic. Rehydrating and getting food into him helped some, but he was still inactive. Then we started the insulin and he started eating and drinking a bit on his own. His energy levels are up from where they were, but he's still not quite himself. He just perked up a bit while I was typing and ate some more. Now he's back lying down, not doing much, but he's responsive and seems less tired than he's been. He hasn't had any insulin for over 24 hours.
 
Update: we just got a BG reading of 136. That's half an hour after he got his antibiotic and ate a bit on his own.
 
Ok you know thats pretty good BG levels given he hasnt had any insulin for a few days.His BG may drop even further once the ulcer clears up as infection can spike BG.

Is he eating properly now.. normal amounts?
 
He's not eating normal amounts yet, just small bits at a time. Thanks, Wendy for replying so quickly and thanks for linking to your tips. I'd found your list and read it the other day. It's very helpful. It's really just a matter of practice now I guess. :)

We had a diabetic kitty years ago who successfully regulated and went into remission for two years after being on Lantus for less than a year. She passed away a couple of years ago, but was able to live happily to 16. This website was incredibly helpful then. We're happy we found you all again now that Buster is diabetic. Thanks for all the help!
 
The lack of eating probably explains the lower numbers too. Can I invite you to move over to the Lantus Tight regulation forum? http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewforum.php?f=9

That forum is very active and there are a lot of very experienced eyes over there who can help advise on dosing - I suspect if you do get a high number that the 2IU is now too much and I would like an expert to look at that so please can you post on there?

You post like this

subject - 2/4 Buster AMPS 136 + 6 98
content of post: quick update on how he is doing and any questions.

Add a ? icon if you have questions to ask. and since you are new add "new to the forum" to the subject too.

They like people to post frequently on there so that the experienced members can keep a good eye on whats going on.
thanks!
Wendy
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top