insulin beginner #3

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CathleenCat

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I checked with my vet office and find that Toby is taking Prozinc. He must be sensitive to some component here because his hind legs are almost useless; this morning he could hardly walk without spraddling out both hind legs. I have ordered the B12 as recommended, will get it soon and begin giving it. I just find it hard to believe that he acquired neuropathy as the same time he got the diabetes. Can it be that fast? I've done my best to do a ear blood draw this noon but punctured him six times without blood so am going back to review the video again. I have a dread of finding him paralyzed everytime I have to leave the house and return. Checked with vet's receptionist and he will call me as soon as possible. It's awful to know something is wrong but not what. He's still eating and drinking as usual.
 
Hi,

neuropathy is a symptom of diabetes. With insulin treatment and the B12, the symptoms of neuropathy can be greatly reduced.

Keep trying on the blood draw. If you look 'newly diagnosed ketoacidiosis' and 'my cat is newly diagnosed' threads, you'll find some helpful info and a pic of the best place to try and get a blood draw.
Have a look at the sticky 'hometesting tips' too.

It's scary at first but you've come to the right place for help and advice.

Good luck :-D
 
I too am wondering about the timing...neuropathy is usually considered to be gradual, not sudden. There could be a multitude of issues, including hypoglycemia, low potassium.....
 
Re: insulin beginner #4 and neuropathy

Toby got to the vet today and his blood sugar was over 500. I suspect his wobbles are connected with uncontrolled diabetes. The vet raised him to 2 units of ProZinc, gave him an appetite stimulant (worked!) and IV fluids. He's been continuously slightly dehydrated, probably from all the peeing.I continue the IV fluids at home for at least a week. I have found the leg vein and will begin blood draw from there since he's growling and fighting after the six ear stick day. The vet gave me some dry food called "Diabetes Management", high protein, low carb, and he's getting a small amount in addition to his wet food because he really likes it. Today was very scary, though the upside was no ketones or kidney problems. When I got him home he plunged his muzzle into his cat food and ate like a wild man, cat. Vet trips are so stressful for both of us. The vet did notice his spraddle legged gait but did not think it was true neuropathy because it came on so fast. I will ask to have his potassium level checked next week. Thanks for all your feedback and help, this is a wonderful forum and is so helpful for us beginners.
 
Re: insulin beginner #4 and neuropathy

CathleenCat said:
I continue the IV fluids at home for at least a week.
Click to expand...

Are you giving IV fluids or Sub-Q fluids? Did the vet leave a port in for IV ?
Usually IV fluids are only given at the vet.

CathleenCat said:
I have found the leg vein and will begin blood draw from there since he's growling and fighting after the six ear stick day.
Click to expand...

I know of no-one here who does blood draws from a vein for home BG testing.
This is very odd. Do you mean 'sticking' for the blood drop, or are you using a syringe
to draw blood from the vein.

Are you warming the ear before sticking for the drop of blood ?
Are you smearing a bit of vaseline on the target area to help the blood bead up into
a nice drop for sipping onto the strip ?
I hope you're not using a 'needle' for the stick (they hurt). You should be using a regular
lancet (either free-hand or in a lancet device aka 'clicker').
Are you giving a treat to kitty at each BG test attempt ?

CathleenCat said:
The vet gave me some dry food called "Diabetes Management", high protein, low carb, and he's getting a small amount in addition to his wet food because he really likes it.
Click to expand...

Sorry to say, D/M dry food is not a good choice. DM is not really that 'low carb. Better to stick with
low-carb canned food. There are good choices at your grocery store. Cheaper, too, than Prescription foods.


CathleenCat said:
Today was very scary, though the upside was no ketones or kidney problems. When I got him home he plunged his muzzle into his cat food and ate like a wild man, cat.
Click to expand...

Un-regulated diabetics are often 'starving'. They actually are starving, because the body is not
utilizing food properly.
 
Re: insulin beginner #4 and neuropathy

CathleenCat said:
I have found the leg vein and will begin blood draw from there since he's growling and fighting after the six ear stick day.
Click to expand...
I have NEVER heard of anyone using the leg vein for home tests. The usual alternate site for home testing is the paw. And the meters are designed to use capillary blood, not the blood from the vein. Please reconsider. Most cats get used to the ear prick, but it can take a little while. Here are my testing tips:

1. Pet your kitty and massage the ear while you are petting him or use a rice sock to warm his ears.

2. Find a place with good light to do the testing. I used a section of my kitchen counter because it's a good height and has under cabinet lights. Put a towel down on the counter. Some people get the cat in between their legs while kneeling on the floor. Others use a couch or chair and put the cat between them and the arm. Others test in their lap. I sometimes tested Maggie in her bed.

3. Set out everything you need before getting your cat. I put the tesing strip part way into the meter, cock the pen.

4. Put a very thin smear of vaseline on the ear to help the blood bead up and not flow into the hair. I would talk to her and tell her she's being a very good girl.

5. Put something firm behind the ear - I used a waded up paper towel. It gives a firm base to work on, and keeps you from getting poked. It's handy to put light pressure on the spot after it bleeds. A little pressure will stop the bleeding and reduced bruising.

6. Most lancet pens have adjustment for depth. I started with it almost at the deepest. I worked down to the next to the smallest. Some people don't use the pen, they use the lancet free-hand.

7. Hold the ear firmly or you'll get the dreaded "ear flick" that send little spots of blood all over!

8. Some people use their fingernail to "scoop" up the blood drop, and test from the nail.

9. Don't forget the treats!

It takes time to get the technique down that will work the best for you. And If you're tense, your cat will be tense. So breathe and try to relax. Don't give up. After a while it will become second nature. And Maggie would actually purr during her test, so I know it didn't hurt her. The thing she disliked the most seemed to be holding the glucometer up to her ear - I think it tickled.
 
Hi there and welcome.

We use ProZinc too. :smile:

You are more than welcome to join us over in the PZI Insulin Support Group:
http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewforum.php?f=24

There are instructions in the stickies at the top of the Tech Support form for putting together a spread sheet and profile which will help us help you better:
http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewforum.php?f=6

One of our vets taught me how to do the leg vein too. It is NOT the place you want to be getting the blood from. As Debby mentioned the place to get it is from the very tip of the ear - the "sweet spot" between the vein and the edge of the ear [not the vein]. I've not had good luck with the vaseline so YMMV. What I have had good luck with is taking my time to get the ear nice and warm with the rice sock then when I push the "go" button on the lancer to count "one-kitty-kitty" before I move. If you move the lance too soon or jerk when it pokes then you may miss the ear.

Make sure to read all the resources in the stickies here about how to do the home testing.

And yes, the dry food is not going to cut it for diabetes. Your kitty needs to be on a low carb wet food ONLY diet. That means below 9-10% carbs as %Kcal as can be found in this list:
http://binkyspage.tripod.com/canfood.html

When you switch to the low carb wet only diet your kitty will most likely end up needing less insulin - some kitties will go off insulin completely with the diet switch. Nonetheless, make sure you are monitoring the blood glucose levels closely so you can compensate for any reduced amount of insulin your kitty needs.
 
Thank you for all the advice, which I am taking to heart, believe me. I am not using a leg vein - I couldn't find it so that was that. I don't actually have a problem hitting the ear vein with the injector, but I get very little blood, even with warming ear carefully. I don't get enough blood to activate my Accura glucometer; I called about getting the Aviva and it was sent to me, but hasn't arrived yet. I understand this takes a much smaller sample. Next time, tomorrow morning before feeding, I will try for the sweet spot at the ear top and see what happens also putting Vaseline on his ear to see if the blood beads more. It makes me so unhappy to have to continually hurt him to get enough of a sample. I jumped over to the PZI form and am sort of glad to find that everyone else is as stressed out as I am, for whatever reason. I managed to get a reading finally about 4:00pm and found Toby's BS to be 383 even on 2 units BID. On the other hand he was getting the DM today which probably threw his sugar levels off. I did get DM from the vet but really get that Toby should not have any dry food at all and will cease with the crunchies immediately. Actually I give him a couple of Pounces after the ear stick (which of course he loves, the Pounces, not the ear stick) but maybe that's not so hot? How about Greenies? He doesn't like the dried treats and I'd like to give him a little something to make up for the difficult time (she said, guiltily). Sorry about saying IV for the fluids, it is sub cut, in the nape. I managed to get half of what he needs in today, and will try for the whole 2-3 level tomorrow, not sure if that is 100mg or 1000mg, whatever, 2-3 on the bag. He is still lethargic and spraddling his legs, though he's much more responsive to me, coming and lying on my legs and sleeping by me. I think we both feel like whining a little bit. In any case, I'm very grateful for your responses and information and am learning as fast as I can. I'm going back over to the PZI forum now and learn some more. Check in tomorrow, gratefully, Cathleen
 
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