Insulin Advice
- Thread starter tiffmaxee
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julie & punkin (ga)
Member Since 2011
Hi Elise!
Glad you've made it here to Lantus Land. it's intimidating to start out hometesting, but you'll get there. all of us have had that start and we learn how to do it.
The answer to your question on whether or not it's safe to give him his dose of insulin tonight is by getting his blood sugar. I know you're a bit nervous about it - what can we do to help you? Have you tried yet? You want to warm his ear, hold the lancet device firmly against his ear (something not-soft behind so the ear doesn't just bend) and click it. have the meter ready beside you with the strip just a little into it, so when you have a bead of blood you can push the strip in the rest of the way and touch it to the blood.
trying on yourself is an excellent way to start.
We test because, just like if you were giving insulin to your child, there's no way to know whether it's safe to give without that magic number.
I'm going to link your most recent previous posts - we do that so that people giving advice can see what's already been said.
Glucose Meters
Lantus Dosing if I don't test at home
New Here With Max-Insulin
Introducing Max
edited to add other previous posts
Glad you've made it here to Lantus Land. it's intimidating to start out hometesting, but you'll get there. all of us have had that start and we learn how to do it.
The answer to your question on whether or not it's safe to give him his dose of insulin tonight is by getting his blood sugar. I know you're a bit nervous about it - what can we do to help you? Have you tried yet? You want to warm his ear, hold the lancet device firmly against his ear (something not-soft behind so the ear doesn't just bend) and click it. have the meter ready beside you with the strip just a little into it, so when you have a bead of blood you can push the strip in the rest of the way and touch it to the blood.
trying on yourself is an excellent way to start.
We test because, just like if you were giving insulin to your child, there's no way to know whether it's safe to give without that magic number.
I'm going to link your most recent previous posts - we do that so that people giving advice can see what's already been said.
Glucose Meters
Lantus Dosing if I don't test at home
New Here With Max-Insulin
Introducing Max
edited to add other previous posts
Hello and welcome here. When people first start in the Health Forum, we suggest people do not give insulin if kitty is below 200 at preshot time. On this forum, we use 150 as the number where we suggest people post for help before feeding and giving insulin. People will eventually shoot at lower numbers, once they've got the experience and data to do so.
Once you start collecting blood glucose data, people who give advice will like to see the numbers in a spreadsheet. Here are the instructions on how to set one up.
Once you start collecting blood glucose data, people who give advice will like to see the numbers in a spreadsheet. Here are the instructions on how to set one up.
Chris & China (GA)
Member Since 2013
Hi Elise and extra sweet Max! Welcome to Lantus Land!
Just to add to Wendy's answer, if you get a pre-shot test that's 150 or below, you still don't exactly "Withold" insulin, but you do what we call "Stall".
When you stall, you don't feed, and retest in 20-30 minutes to see if the numbers are rising. You don't want to feed him so you can be sure he's on the way up without the influence of food. (which is also why you should take up any food you have down for the 2 hours prior to pre-shot time).
During that "stall time", post here and ask for help. If you go to your first post of the day and edit the subject line, just add something like "Stalling..advice needed" so when people are scanning the board, they can see that you need help quickly.
Once you get more data on how Max reacts to insulin and food, that "no shot" number comes down, but there is rarely a time that we don't give any insulin at all.
If you post and ask for help, and nobody is available in that 20 minutes(or the board is down, or you have internet issues) you should have Shooting and handling low numbers printed out somewhere where you can find it. On the refrigerator door is where mine are, and there's a copy in my "hypo kit" too.
Once again, welcome!
Just to add to Wendy's answer, if you get a pre-shot test that's 150 or below, you still don't exactly "Withold" insulin, but you do what we call "Stall".
When you stall, you don't feed, and retest in 20-30 minutes to see if the numbers are rising. You don't want to feed him so you can be sure he's on the way up without the influence of food. (which is also why you should take up any food you have down for the 2 hours prior to pre-shot time).
During that "stall time", post here and ask for help. If you go to your first post of the day and edit the subject line, just add something like "Stalling..advice needed" so when people are scanning the board, they can see that you need help quickly.
Once you get more data on how Max reacts to insulin and food, that "no shot" number comes down, but there is rarely a time that we don't give any insulin at all.
If you post and ask for help, and nobody is available in that 20 minutes(or the board is down, or you have internet issues) you should have Shooting and handling low numbers printed out somewhere where you can find it. On the refrigerator door is where mine are, and there's a copy in my "hypo kit" too.
Once again, welcome!
Sorry to hear that your mom is in the hospital.
What is your schedule like while you're mom is ill? In other words, what time do you shoot relative to when you leave the house and return?
What is your schedule like while you're mom is ill? In other words, what time do you shoot relative to when you leave the house and return?
tiffmaxee
Member Since 2013
He gets his insulin at 7:15. It was cut to 1/2 unit. I tried to draw blood but didn't get enough so I did go ahead and give him insulin and he ate. I will be leaving here by noon and won't be back until between 6 and 6:45. My vet knows I won't likely be testing before our visit on Wednesday BUT hopefully my mom will improve and come home by Monday. We though she would come home by Thursday but she got a bad cold virus in the hospital and has been VERY sick. They tested her when she arrived to be treated and she didn't have it then. She is 92 and has serious issues. I need to know how to keep Max as safe as possible for now. I changed his food to fancy feast classics so he is on very low carbs now. Should I feed him the higher sliced for the weekend to play it safe?
Chris & China (GA)
Member Since 2013
If you shoot at 7:15, could you test/shoot/feed all about that same time (or test/feed/shoot) and get a +2 at 9:15? ...that +2 is a good predictor into how active the cycle is going to be.
If the +2 is much lower than the Pre-shot, that means it's probably going to be an "active" cycle where you'd want to get more tests in if at all possible (but if not, you'd know it's important to leave down some higher carb food so if his blood glucose dropped while you were gone, he'd have it to eat.) They usually go looking for food if their blood sugar drops just like humans go looking for a candy bar or a Coke when their numbers drop.
Then if you could get a test in right before you have to leave for the hospital, that would be about +5 so getting close to where they "usually" nadir. Again, this would give you a good idea of if you should leave down some low carb food or maybe something with a few more carbs just in case.
If you test/feed/shoot usually at 7:15, if you got a number under 150, could you "stall" for 20 minutes and retest to see if his numbers are climbing? (and while you're waiting, post and ask for help)
I know we harp on it a lot, but it's really important for you to go ahead and spend a few minutes to get that spreadsheet up. It's already "programmed" so all you really have to do is sign into your Google account (or open one) and you're pretty much good to go. All you have to do is go in and put his numbers into the correct box. If you look below at my signature box, you'll see China's spreadsheet...Now I am able to test frequently (usually) and that's not totally necessary...I just wanted to show you mine..all I do is type the result I get into the appropriate box...it color codes itself
I totally understand your problem with your mother. I'm dealing with something similar myself. Mine had triple bypass surgery on 11/8 and was readmitted Thursday back in heart failure, kidney problems and water in the pleural sac around her lungs. It's been one thing after another, and leaving China home alone for long stretches of time still makes me nervous but because of all the testing I do, I pretty much know how she'll react. At this point, you don't have that kind of data because you're new to this disease
Good luck to you! I totally understand how you feel with your mom's health so touchy right now, but still wanting to do your best to help Max
Edited to add...I understand it may be too late now to get a +2. I don't know where you are so not sure about time zone
If the +2 is much lower than the Pre-shot, that means it's probably going to be an "active" cycle where you'd want to get more tests in if at all possible (but if not, you'd know it's important to leave down some higher carb food so if his blood glucose dropped while you were gone, he'd have it to eat.) They usually go looking for food if their blood sugar drops just like humans go looking for a candy bar or a Coke when their numbers drop.
Then if you could get a test in right before you have to leave for the hospital, that would be about +5 so getting close to where they "usually" nadir. Again, this would give you a good idea of if you should leave down some low carb food or maybe something with a few more carbs just in case.
If you test/feed/shoot usually at 7:15, if you got a number under 150, could you "stall" for 20 minutes and retest to see if his numbers are climbing? (and while you're waiting, post and ask for help)
I know we harp on it a lot, but it's really important for you to go ahead and spend a few minutes to get that spreadsheet up. It's already "programmed" so all you really have to do is sign into your Google account (or open one) and you're pretty much good to go. All you have to do is go in and put his numbers into the correct box. If you look below at my signature box, you'll see China's spreadsheet...Now I am able to test frequently (usually) and that's not totally necessary...I just wanted to show you mine..all I do is type the result I get into the appropriate box...it color codes itself
I totally understand your problem with your mother. I'm dealing with something similar myself. Mine had triple bypass surgery on 11/8 and was readmitted Thursday back in heart failure, kidney problems and water in the pleural sac around her lungs. It's been one thing after another, and leaving China home alone for long stretches of time still makes me nervous but because of all the testing I do, I pretty much know how she'll react. At this point, you don't have that kind of data because you're new to this disease
Good luck to you! I totally understand how you feel with your mom's health so touchy right now, but still wanting to do your best to help Max
Edited to add...I understand it may be too late now to get a +2. I don't know where you are so not sure about time zone
julie & punkin (ga)
Member Since 2011
by the way, elise, it takes about 2 weeks of consistent poking to get blood every time. the ears will grow capillaries where you poke. so don't be discouraged by not getting blood at the beginning. in a couple of weeks you'll have enough to test every time. you're investing now in success later. it helps to keep that in mind!
in the meantime, try 3 pokes and give Max a break. make sure he gets some little treat after every poking session. i boiled chicken breasts, cut them in 1/2" dice, and gave punkin one or 2 each time. it's amazing how that little treat will make Max tolerate the poking.
if you can pick up some Neosporin with pain relief ointment and put it on after you poke max's ear, it'll heal it and take the owie out very quickly. i tried it on myself where my punkin had scratched me with several claws and thought it was incredible how much it helped. wipe it mostly off before you test again so it doesn't goo up with test strip.
i'm so sorry about your mom being in the hospital. both of my parents are gone now - it's a difficult phase of life to be in with aging parents. sending both of you the best healing thoughts.
keep asking questions and let us know how we can help.
in the meantime, try 3 pokes and give Max a break. make sure he gets some little treat after every poking session. i boiled chicken breasts, cut them in 1/2" dice, and gave punkin one or 2 each time. it's amazing how that little treat will make Max tolerate the poking.
if you can pick up some Neosporin with pain relief ointment and put it on after you poke max's ear, it'll heal it and take the owie out very quickly. i tried it on myself where my punkin had scratched me with several claws and thought it was incredible how much it helped. wipe it mostly off before you test again so it doesn't goo up with test strip.
i'm so sorry about your mom being in the hospital. both of my parents are gone now - it's a difficult phase of life to be in with aging parents. sending both of you the best healing thoughts.
keep asking questions and let us know how we can help.
tiffmaxee
Member Since 2013
Just got back from the vet. Max's BG was 194 on his Alpha and 104 on my Relion. He is holding the insulin and I go back Friday. I took a few needles to try at home. My mom isn't doing much better so i am not home a lot during the day. My vet wants to continue .5 if his BG goes up and try without for a week if it is still within normal range but he suspects Max will need the insulin. Thoughts? Going back to walk my sister's dog now and possibly back to the hospital but will check for replies. Thanks.
Elise
Elise
Dyana
Member Since 2009
I think you're doing a good job with all you have "on your plate", right now.
I hope your mom is doing better and has a quick recovery.
I'm glad you're learning to test because that can be a life saver for Max.
Do you have your hypo kit and printed instructions for just in case?
I hope your mom is doing better and has a quick recovery.
I'm glad you're learning to test because that can be a life saver for Max.
Do you have your hypo kit and printed instructions for just in case?
Chris & China (GA)
Member Since 2013
Elise, it sure would help for you to get our spreadsheet and the tests you can get, put those numbers in...It's the only way to give you any advice on the dose, but I know you have a pretty full plate right now.
I sure feel for you. I just got my mom back out of the hospital and caring for an elderly parent is a really tough job.
If Max is getting decent numbers on the .5, I'm not sure I'd advise you to just stop for a week, but that has to be a decision you'll need to make.
Stay strong and know that we're here for you when you need us
I sure feel for you. I just got my mom back out of the hospital and caring for an elderly parent is a really tough job.
If Max is getting decent numbers on the .5, I'm not sure I'd advise you to just stop for a week, but that has to be a decision you'll need to make.
Stay strong and know that we're here for you when you need us
tiffmaxee
Member Since 2013
The reason my vet is considering holding insulin for a week is to see if Max is in remission. He said we would do that if he is normal tomorrow. Why would that not be a good idea? I tried to do a spreadsheet but I didn't see a way to name or save it so I don't know if it exists. Thanks. I
Chris & China (GA)
Member Since 2013
To get a spreadsheet, you just need to get a Google Account, and the spreadsheet program we use is here: How to get a Spreadsheet
We have some people who can set it up for you if you can't figure it out and then all you have to do is sign in, and enter the numbers in the spreadsheet...It saves itself automatically. Let us know if you'd like someone to set one up for you
The reason I'm not sure it's a good idea is because we are very careful about getting our kitties into remission here. Even those that are on tiny doses, like .5 twice/day, we recommend going down to .25, and then down to .1 before trying an OTJ trial.
Getting a cat into remission once is a wonderful thing, but if it's rushed, and they fall back out, it's a lot harder (if it's possible at all) to get them into remission for a 2nd time.
Hope your mother is doing better!
We have some people who can set it up for you if you can't figure it out and then all you have to do is sign in, and enter the numbers in the spreadsheet...It saves itself automatically. Let us know if you'd like someone to set one up for you
The reason I'm not sure it's a good idea is because we are very careful about getting our kitties into remission here. Even those that are on tiny doses, like .5 twice/day, we recommend going down to .25, and then down to .1 before trying an OTJ trial.
Getting a cat into remission once is a wonderful thing, but if it's rushed, and they fall back out, it's a lot harder (if it's possible at all) to get them into remission for a 2nd time.
Hope your mother is doing better!
Welcome to Lantus Land Elise and Max.
It would be great if Max didn't need any more insulin. If you need help with the spreadsheet, please send me a private message and I can do it for you pretty quickly. It helps us if you include all the numbers he's had on and offf insulin.
It would be great if Max didn't need any more insulin. If you need help with the spreadsheet, please send me a private message and I can do it for you pretty quickly. It helps us if you include all the numbers he's had on and offf insulin.
tiffmaxee
Member Since 2013
Re: Insulin Advice before Vet visit in 2 hours
I logged in to my account and entered numbers. If anyone has a chance you can look and see if it is there. Max has only been on insulin since 11/15/13. He started with l unit and was dropped briefly to l unit in the morning and 1/2 at night. I was advised here to give him .75 both times and so I did. Then we went down to 1/2 unit and got a Nadir of 70. The following Nadir was 104 on my meter but 194 on my vet's. They were done at the same time in his office on Wednesday. So I go back today in two hours to check again. It was suggested by a friend to ask if they have more than one machine and when it was last calibrated.
My mom is still in the hospital but is improving. If she can walk enough to get to the bathroom she will come home tomorrow or Sunday. She is so weak. Thanks for asking.
I logged in to my account and entered numbers. If anyone has a chance you can look and see if it is there. Max has only been on insulin since 11/15/13. He started with l unit and was dropped briefly to l unit in the morning and 1/2 at night. I was advised here to give him .75 both times and so I did. Then we went down to 1/2 unit and got a Nadir of 70. The following Nadir was 104 on my meter but 194 on my vet's. They were done at the same time in his office on Wednesday. So I go back today in two hours to check again. It was suggested by a friend to ask if they have more than one machine and when it was last calibrated.
My mom is still in the hospital but is improving. If she can walk enough to get to the bathroom she will come home tomorrow or Sunday. She is so weak. Thanks for asking.
Chris & China (GA)
Member Since 2013
We can't see your spreadsheet without the link to it.
Go to your spreadsheet and up in the right corner find where it says "Share". Click there and then choose "Anyone with the link" and then click "Done"
Then copy the link (either from the address bar or when you're on that "Share" page, it has it highlighted for you) and then paste it into your signature box.
To edit your signature to add the link, go to the User Control Panel at the top left of this page. Click on "Profile" and then "Edit Signature"...paste the link to your spreadsheet there and "save"
Good to hear your mom is doing better. Hopefully they'll let her come home and she can start getting some strength back soon
Go to your spreadsheet and up in the right corner find where it says "Share". Click there and then choose "Anyone with the link" and then click "Done"
Then copy the link (either from the address bar or when you're on that "Share" page, it has it highlighted for you) and then paste it into your signature box.
To edit your signature to add the link, go to the User Control Panel at the top left of this page. Click on "Profile" and then "Edit Signature"...paste the link to your spreadsheet there and "save"
Good to hear your mom is doing better. Hopefully they'll let her come home and she can start getting some strength back soon
While this will work, it is not the best way to do it. What you actually need to do is open the google SS you created from our template and in the upper left corner, click on "Publish to the Web". It will bring up a box; be sure that the box by "automatically republish when changes are made" is checked. In the bottom box, copy the link.
Login to FDMB and go to User Control Panel. Then click on "profile" and "edit signature". Put your cursor in the text box and then click on the "url" box above the text box. It will put this in the text box:
Paste your link between the two boxes above and check to be sure that instead of "ccc", the link has "pub".
Paste Link Here
You can then fancy it up by doing this:
Max's SpreadSheet
Click "Submit"
tiffmaxee
Member Since 2013
I'm too exhausted to deal with spreadsheets. Maybe next week if its needed. Last Friday Max's Nadir at the vet's was 236 on his meter and 130 on mine without insulin. I was told not to give him any insulin and I go back to my vet in a week, which will be Friday.
Elise
Elise
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