How to diagnose?

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CookiePlease

CookiePlease

Member Since 2015
hi all -

I live in Mexico and the vet here said that Cookie might have diabetes - she's had two blood work ups first one non-fasting, the she asked to do another after fasting that morning (because she said that stress could have affected the first results), but the vet said she couldn't get a urine sample because cookie's too fat? And that's the definitive way to know if a cat has diabetes. (How do vets, or owners, for that matter, get urine samples on cats?) So wants to start her on some homeopathic something and then test again.

I haven't seen an increased thirst in cookie and she's been on a prescription diet food for probably 8 months and hasn't lost any more weight. So two of the telltale signs I've read about here aren't there (weight loss and increased thirst). She has always been very vocal about her food and was definitely hungry sometimes and always immediately scarfed down the diet food.

She started about 20 pounds, and is now down to 16.6 lbs and has stayed there for the last 3 months, on the diet food. I've always given her dry food - I used to get a high protein one but that seems to be when she really put on more weight. I had a timed self feeder that I stopped using about 4 years ago because she learned to game the system and was getting too much food.

I'm just wondering if I should go to another vet or try her on high protein wet food? I just don't want her to gain more weight. I'm not sure I really believe she's pre-diabetic.
 
Hi there in Mexico! Hola ~ Sorry Cookie could possibly have diabetes. It is my understanding that the fasting blood work tells if they are diabetic and the urine sample tells if there is ketones in the urine. I don't understand what being too fat would have to do with the test.

What is the RX food you have Cookie on? I can tell you this, dry food is much higher in carbs and if Cookie is in fact diabetic, you will want to switch to wet food under 10% carbs. And yes, increased thirst, peeing and losing weight are all signs of a diabetic cat.

And I think I might get another vet opinion.
 
Welcome. More experienced people will pop in shortly to guide you. My opinion is a urine test is important but it is not the only way. Blood testing is the first thing done. The most common symptoms are and what people notice first: Drinking large volumes of water. Peeing large amounts of urine which tends to be sticky when you scoop the box. Loss of weight. There could be an odor on the breathe, but not all cats have this.

Never heard of not being able to get sample because of overweight. You can try to see if Cookie will go in an clean empty litter box. There is also something called No Absorb litter ( don't know if it's still around) I use to get from vet when I needed to. My previous vet use to extract urine with a syringe.

What is the prescription food you are using? Dry or canned? When do you go back to vet to start treatment? Do you know how high the sugar was when they checked? You could test at home yourself but I'll refer this to the more experienced people you will hear from.

Good luck and I will check in with you later.
 
Hello, Cookie and Cookie's Mom, welcome to FDMB!

What information has your vet given you regarding the tests she ran? What were Cookie's glucose levels? Has she recommended insulin?

Please, please try to wean Cookie over to a low carb, canned diet! It doesn't have to be Rx food (actually, probably better if it isn't), as long as the percent of calories from carbs are under 10%. I don't know what's available in your area in Mexico but here is a list lots of us refer to for low carb food: http://www.catinfo.org/docs/FoodChartPublic9-22-12.pdf
Most of us lean towards the Fancy Feast, Friskies, or 9 Lives, due to their affordability. Even if Cookie is not diabetic, this is much healthier for her, overall!

If you need a urine sample, the easiest way to get it is to buy some natural stone gravel (like you would use in a fish tank), rinse it, and put it in a clean litter box. Wait till she pees and then pour off the urine into a clean container. You can also try putting some cellophane wrap over the corner(s) of her litter box, although I've never been very successful with that method.

I think it certainly wouldn't hurt to get another vet's opinion, that's what I would do if I was in your situation. :)

Lucy
 
If she were mine, I would get a human meter and see what her blood glucose levels are. I don't know what is available in Mexico but assume there are probably choices. If you have a Walmart, many people here like ReliOn meters. Otherwise, just get one that takes a tiny sample. The strips are the expensive part (the Walmart ones are cheapest) but available through ebay, so that is a possibility. Here is a thread with lots of info on testing: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/hometesting-links-and-tips.287/

Once you have some numbers, you can figure out whether she has diabetic numbers. We find that most cats, off insulin, range from 40-120 with the majority of the time spent in double digits. If she is in that range, she is probably not diabetic. If she is in the 300/400 range, it is very likely. If she is in the 200s, it might be possible to get her into normal range with a lower carb food.
 
The blood glucose test tells how much glucose is in her blood. The urine test tells you if there is so much glucose or ketones in her system it is spilling into her urine. There should not be much, or any, glucose or ketones in the urine. My vet has been known to put pressure on my cat's bladder manually to get a urine sample, and that may be difficult if Cookie is fat.

You can buy a meter, or you can get Keto diastix from your pharmacy. It's a cheap way to tell if Cookie has high blood glucose or ketones by testing her urine. (The ideas above for getting a urine sample are good, but I just stuck a small cup or ladle under Maggie as she started to pee.) If either are positive, you need to see your vet about starting insulin. I don't know what homeopathic remedy your vet wants to try, but I've never heard of something like that helping a diabetic cat.
 
Thanks everyone. Her fasting glucose was 221. So I think I'll try her on canned food, and forget the diabetic dry food the vet wanted to order, and the homeopath treatment, and then do a home test in a few weeks (which is what the vet also recommended.). We'll see if I can get a sample. Thanks again for the resources.

OK - so the canned food I was looking at online (fancy feast) says that they need one can per three pounds of body weight. And considering cookie is still pretty big, I'm wondering how much to give her per day. I'll ask the vet too.
 
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Our Oliver was a 16 pound Maine Coon. We gave him 3 cans of Fancy Feast daily when he wasn't regulated and constantly wanting to eat. Once he was regulated we cut it back to 2.5, then 2. It depends on how overweight she is and her activity level. Oliver only moved around at mealtime.....
 
CookiePlease said:
Thanks everyone. Her fasting glucose was 221. So I think I'll try her on canned food, and forget the diabetic dry food the vet wanted to order, and the homeopath treatment, and then do a home test in a few weeks (which is what the vet also recommended.). We'll see if I can get a sample. Thanks again for the resources.

OK - so the canned food I was looking at online (fancy feast) says that they need one can per three pounds of body weight. And considering cookie is still pretty big, I'm wondering how much to give her per day. I'll ask the vet too.
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You want to feed based on ideal body weight, not current body weight. Do you know what her ideal body weight should be? For an average sized cat (10-12 lbs), it typically comes out to be about 2 cans (6oz) of Fancy Feast per day.
 
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