How much canned food and how many times per day?

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Daddy Jack's Mommy (GA)

Daddy Jack's Mommy (GA)

Member Since 2019
Jack was diagnosed on Friday, and confirmed with fructosamine results on Sunday. After reading so much about the horrors of dry food, I removed it and have fed him only canned as of Sunday night. I'm so happy to see that all 5 of my cats love it!! I have such regrets for having fed them a food that I thought was so healthy (expensive and grain fee dry).
Jack has yet to get his first insulin shot, as I ordered his Prozinc on Monday and I'm waiting for it to arrive. I have tried, only two days so far, to get a glucose reading. I was unsuccessful both days, having pierced the skin but unable to draw enough blood. I'm going to try again today. All this aside... I have questions about feeding canned food.

How much canned food should be given in a day, per cat?
Should I feed them twice a day, giving half each time, or should I be leaving some out so they can have more available? I feel bad because they're used to grazing as they want. I do think they are acting hungry, not all day but for a while before they're fed.
Once Jack is on insulin, is it OK for him to eat canned during the day, without getting an insulin shot?
Also, can I feed them all varieties of Fancy Feast, or only those that are 5-6 grams of carbs (figured with removing moisture content) as opposed to 10 grams?

I have so much to learn.
 
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Don't beat yourself up about feeding dry food before you knew better. Almost all of us here did the same. You don't know what you don't know!

Are you heating up the ear before you poke it? It makes a big difference in how well/fast it will bleed. Some people fill a cotton sock with rice and microwave it then hold that to the ear. I run very hot water on the corner of a washcloth and wring out the excess. I hold it to Mia's ear before poking then use it to apply light pressure and clean the area after the test.

There are formulas for determining how many calories a cat should be eating. One that I see often for the 'average' indoor cat is 20 calories per pound of ideal body weight. So, check the calories on the food you are feeding and determine how much to feed. As far as how often, it is usually best to feed multiple times per day. My girls are fed 4 times per day (every 6 hours), and leftovers remain out for them to graze. When you are first starting out, you will want to remove food two hours before your pre-insulin-shot glucose test so that the test results will not be impacted by food and you will know if it is safe to give the intended insulin dose, but other than that period of time, grazing is fine as long as you are feeding appropriate quality protein, low-carb food providing the right calories. You want to keep the carbs pretty low - definitely below 10%, but most of us find it necessary to stay even lower than that, maybe 5% or less. If you have not already seen the cat food chart/database, it is very helpful in picking the foods to try. I have a link in my signature.
 
I'm a little confused about the carbohydrate content. I see a lot of people here feed their cats a variety of Fancy Feast foods. When I figure the carb content of those foods, they are 10 or 11%. I've only found, so far, a couple of varieties of Fancy Feast that fall within that 5 to 6% category.
 
Have you used the cat food database? For the foods included there, the work has been done for you, so there is no calculating involved.

There are some Fancy Feast options that are too high in carbs. The classic pates are pretty safe.
 
Good morning Carolyn. If you click on this link https://catinfo.org/docs/CatFoodProteinFatCarbPhosphorusChart.pdf and click on the Extensive Filters option, you can type in Fancy Feast Classics in the Filter box. Then you can see the carb amounts of the different flavors. You don't have to use Fancy Feast exclusively. Since you have 5 cats, it might be worth trying the Friskies classic pates. Use the filter to see the carbs in those flavors. You can buy some of the Friskies pates flavors in larger cans, I think about 13 oz, which will save you some money, and help feed your furry tribe. I have purchased both the 5.5 oz cans and 13 oz cans at local grocery stores. I have also read that some people are able to obtain the larger Friskies pates at the dollar stores.
You might purchase some of the larger cans, freeze portions in ice cube trays and leave out cubes to thaw and be grazed on throughout the day or night.
I have also seen mention of a certain brand of low carb canned food found at Walmart, but I cannot remember the name of it. Perhaps other members will see and be able to provide some information.
 
Daddy Jack's Mommy said:
I'm a little confused about the carbohydrate content.
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The Guaranteed Analysis numbers you see on the can or at the manufacturer's website have just maximum or minimum values and so cannot be used to accurately calculate the percentage of carbs. Dr Lisa Pierson gets better numbers from the manufacturer and uses them for the values you see in her chart. Her site, catinfo.org, is very much worth a read.
 
Idjit's mom said:
Good morning Carolyn. If you click on this link https://catinfo.org/docs/CatFoodProteinFatCarbPhosphorusChart.pdf and click on the Extensive Filters option, you can type in Fancy Feast Classics in the Filter box. Then you can see the carb amounts of the different flavors. You don't have to use Fancy Feast exclusively. Since you have 5 cats, it might be worth trying the Friskies classic pates. Use the filter to see the carbs in those flavors. You can buy some of the Friskies pates flavors in larger cans, I think about 13 oz, which will save you some money, and help feed your furry tribe. I have purchased both the 5.5 oz cans and 13 oz cans at local grocery stores. I have also read that some people are able to obtain the larger Friskies pates at the dollar stores.
You might purchase some of the larger cans, freeze portions in ice cube trays and leave out cubes to thaw and be grazed on throughout the day or night.
I have also seen mention of a certain brand of low carb canned food found at Walmart, but I cannot remember the name of it. Perhaps other members will see and be able to provide some information.
Click to expand...

I'm a little confudes because I was using a formula to find the carb count in canned food, and I'm coming up wiy a number different than I'm seeing on this chart.
 
FurBabiesMama said:
Have you used the cat food database? For the foods included there, the work has been done for you, so there is no calculating involved.

There are some Fancy Feast options that are too high in carbs. The classic pates are pretty safe.
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Thank you for sharing the link. According to that chart, I can give my fur balls Friskies Classic Pates. When I figure the carb content on my own, I come up with a higher number. To make it easier on myself, I'm just going to use the chart. And I will start putting out little frozen chunks of food during the day. What a great idea!
As far as the glucose monitoring - I have warmed the ear with wet paper towels in a plastic bag, but still no blood. I'm hoping for more success today.
 
Don't give up on the testing, it takes awhile for most of us to be successful. The more you test, the more capillaries develop and it gets much easier to get that little blood sample. Patience and practice are the keywords. Relax, sing to Jack, it will calm both of you. I sing to Idjit all the time, and although I have been told in no uncertain terms to keep my day job, Idjit has never protested!
Condition Jack by going through the process as many times a day as you can, without actually pricking the ear, and don't forget to give him a treat. That way he associates this as "this is a good thing!"
It's all new and strange right now, but you are doing so very well. Kudos to you, you are a wonderful kitty mom!
 
Tom & Thomas said:
The Guaranteed Analysis numbers you see on the can or at the manufacturer's website have just maximum or minimum values and so cannot be used to accurately calculate the percentage of carbs. Dr Lisa Pierson gets better numbers from the manufacturer and uses them for the values you see in her chart. Her site, catinfo.org, is very much worth a read.
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Thank you do much for that explanation! I was driving myself crazy trying to figure out why my estimates differed so much from those on the chart. I am so relieved to know that I can just rely on that from now on.
 
Idjit's mom said:
Don't give up on the testing, it takes awhile for most of us to be successful. The more you test, the more capillaries develop and it gets much easier to get that little blood sample. Patience and practice are the keywords. Relax, sing to Jack, it will calm both of you. I sing to Idjit all the time, and although I have been told in no uncertain terms to keep my day job, Idjit has never protested!
Condition Jack by going through the process as many times a day as you can, without actually pricking the ear, and don't forget to give him a treat. That way he associates this as "this is a good thing!"
It's all new and strange right now, but you are doing so very well. Kudos to you, you are a wonderful kitty mom!
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I appreciate all of that advice! (I have one cat who loves it when I sing, so she'll probably have to come check it out.) I haven't tried checking it today. However, I'm going to in just a little while. I'm hoping for the best...
 
SandyB127 said:
What treats can my diabetic cat have ? I tried Blue grain fee and she will not eat them
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Jack LOVES freeze dried minnows, made by Vital Essentials. I also buy the ones made for dogs. They're the same as the freeze dried minnows for cats. just cheaper. They also carry other freeze dried treats. I ordered mine through Amazon.
 
I got this formula from Dr Karen Becker, another holistic vet I really like. She is on YouTube and Mercola website.

Know exactly how many calories kitty should be eating each day. In order to know how much food to feed your cat, you must calculate calories. I recommend checking with your veterinarian on the proper weight for your kitty.

To figure out how many calories your cat requires per day to achieve her ideal weight, first weigh her. Next, figure your kitty's weight in kilograms by dividing her weight in pounds by 2.2. So for example, if your cat weighs 15 pounds, her weight in kilograms is 15 divided by 2.2, or 6.82 kilograms.

Multiply your cat's weight in kilograms by 30 and then add 70 to that result: 6.82 kilos x 30 = 205 + 70 = 275. Now multiply that result by 0.8: 275 x 0.8 = 220.

Your cat needs 220 calories in a day to maintain her 15-pound weight. If your cat eats less than 220 calories she'll lose weight. If she gets over 220 calories a day, she'll gain weight. If you keep her right at those 220 calories, she'll maintain her current weight.

Let's say your 15-pound cat's ideal weight is 10 pounds. Here's how to calculate how many calories she should be eating:

10 pounds divided by 2.2 = 4.55 kilograms
4.55 kilos x 30 = 137
137 + 70 = 207
207 x 0.8 = 166 calories

To get your kitty down to her ideal weight of 10 pounds, you need to feed her about 166 calories in a 24 hour period – not the 220 calories she's been eating. So decreasing her caloric intake slightly over time will allow for slow and healthy weight loss.

If your cat has a lot of weight to lose, it's important you reduce calories slowly over time. As you meet you cat's new weight goal (let's say 12 pounds, down from 14 pounds) you re-adjust her daily calories again until you reach her targeted weight (10 pounds). (link to article :https://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2016/04/30/overfeeding-cats.aspx )
 
sybil said:
I got this formula from Dr Karen Becker, another holistic vet I really like. She is on YouTube and Mercola website.

Know exactly how many calories kitty should be eating each day. In order to know how much food to feed your cat, you must calculate calories. I recommend checking with your veterinarian on the proper weight for your kitty.

To figure out how many calories your cat requires per day to achieve her ideal weight, first weigh her. Next, figure your kitty's weight in kilograms by dividing her weight in pounds by 2.2. So for example, if your cat weighs 15 pounds, her weight in kilograms is 15 divided by 2.2, or 6.82 kilograms.

Multiply your cat's weight in kilograms by 30 and then add 70 to that result: 6.82 kilos x 30 = 205 + 70 = 275. Now multiply that result by 0.8: 275 x 0.8 = 220.

Your cat needs 220 calories in a day to maintain her 15-pound weight. If your cat eats less than 220 calories she'll lose weight. If she gets over 220 calories a day, she'll gain weight. If you keep her right at those 220 calories, she'll maintain her current weight.

Let's say your 15-pound cat's ideal weight is 10 pounds. Here's how to calculate how many calories she should be eating:

10 pounds divided by 2.2 = 4.55 kilograms
4.55 kilos x 30 = 137
137 + 70 = 207
207 x 0.8 = 166 calories

To get your kitty down to her ideal weight of 10 pounds, you need to feed her about 166 calories in a 24 hour period – not the 220 calories she's been eating. So decreasing her caloric intake slightly over time will allow for slow and healthy weight loss.

If your cat has a lot of weight to lose, it's important you reduce calories slowly over time. As you meet you cat's new weight goal (let's say 12 pounds, down from 14 pounds) you re-adjust her daily calories again until you reach her targeted weight (10 pounds). (link to article :https://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2016/04/30/overfeeding-cats.aspx )
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Thank you very much for all the information
 
Idjit's mom said:
Good morning Carolyn. If you click on this link https://catinfo.org/docs/CatFoodProteinFatCarbPhosphorusChart.pdf and click on the Extensive Filters option, you can type in Fancy Feast Classics in the Filter box. Then you can see the carb amounts of the different flavors. You don't have to use Fancy Feast exclusively. Since you have 5 cats, it might be worth trying the Friskies classic pates. Use the filter to see the carbs in those flavors. You can buy some of the Friskies pates flavors in larger cans, I think about 13 oz, which will save you some money, and help feed your furry tribe. I have purchased both the 5.5 oz cans and 13 oz cans at local grocery stores. I have also read that some people are able to obtain the larger Friskies pates at the dollar stores.
You might purchase some of the larger cans, freeze portions in ice cube trays and leave out cubes to thaw and be grazed on throughout the day or night.
I have also seen mention of a certain brand of low carb canned food found at Walmart, but I cannot remember the name of it. Perhaps other members will see and be able to provide some information.
Click to expand...
This is Paula Nowak with Elvis the cat. I was looking on the food chart here. I looked up the food that my cat eats which is Fancy Feast turkey and giblets Feast pate. I have notice that the calculations here are quite different from what I have found when I did my research. When I did my research on the turkey and giblets feast pate, I found that that is 7% in dry matter analysis for carbohydrates and it is 5% fat and 11% protein but on the info chart that I saw on here when I clicked on it , has those numbers much different than what I found. They have down that turkey and giblets feast pate is only 2% carbohydrate but that 2% is the wet matter analysis and I was told that you need to look at the dry matter analysis of percentage for carbohydrates in foods when you're having to do with a diabetic cat or just concerned about carbohydrates in general for your cat. Also, I noticed that the protein percentage here is quite high also I was I think it was somewhere like 39% on here on that chart but on the back of the can of turkey and giblets Fancy Feast it says that they have it listed as 11% protein. So now I don't know what to think because I know what the can says but then when I read the chart, it says that the protein content is way much higher, like thirty something percent I don't think that's correct at all so now what? The only food that I found that was really good was the turkey and giblets Feast which is actually the lowest in carbohydrate which is 7% dry matter analysis I also found that the Mariners catch of the friskies is 14% carbohydrate dry matter analysis. I was reading that you have to look at the dry matter analysis of cat food and not the wet matter analysis because when you take away the wet matter which is just liquid then there's dry matter left so that's what has to be considered here when you're thinking of percentages of carbohydrate. There is a dry matter analysis calculator for wet cat food online. I just can't remember the exact website, but I can find it and see and then what you do is you put in how much protein, how much fat, how much Ash, and how much moisture, and then it will give you an analysis of what the wet matter analysis percentage is and the dry matter analysis is.
 
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Paula Nowak said:
This is Paula Nowak with Elvis the cat. I was looking on the food chart here. I looked up the food that my cat eats which is Fancy Feast turkey and giblets Feast pate. I have notice that the calculations here are quite different from what I have found when I did my research. When I did my research on the turkey and giblets feast pate, I found that that is 7% in dry matter analysis for carbohydrates and it is 5% fat and 11% protein but on the info chart that I saw on here when I clicked on it , has those numbers much different than what I found. They have down that turkey and giblets feast pate is only 2% carbohydrate but that 2% is the wet matter analysis and I was told that you need to look at the dry matter analysis of percentage for carbohydrates in foods when you're having to do with a diabetic cat or just concerned about carbohydrates in general for your cat. Also, I noticed that the protein percentage here is quite high also I was I think it was somewhere like 39% on here on that chart but on the back of the can of turkey and giblets Fancy Feast it says that they have it listed as 11% protein. So now I don't know what to think because I know what the can says but then when I read the chart, it says that the protein content is way much higher, like thirty something percent I don't think that's correct at all so now what? The only food that I found that was really good was the turkey and giblets Feast which is actually the lowest in carbohydrate which is 7% dry matter analysis I also found that the Mariners catch of the friskies is 14% carbohydrate dry matter analysis. I was reading that you have to look at the dry matter analysis of cat food and not the wet matter analysis because when you take away the wet matter which is just liquid then there's dry matter left so that's what has to be considered here when you're thinking of percentages of carbohydrate. There is a dry matter analysis calculator for wet cat food online. I just can't remember the exact website, but I can find it and see and then what you do is you put in how much protein, how much fat, how much fiber, how much Ash, and how much moisture, and then it will give you an analysis of what the wet matter analysis percentage is and the dry matter analysis is.
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Ok, put in the search box,. Cat Food Nutrition Calculator Elizabeth C. Scheyder and you should see where to click on for that sites name. You have to have the percentags for each food for protein, fat, fiber and moisture. I know that when I did it for Fancy Feast turkey and giblets pate it came out when I hit the calculator that it was 7% dry matter analysis carbohydrate the wet matter analysis was much lower I believe it was like 2% but when considering how much carbohydrate a cat should have in dealing with conditions like diabetes it should be less than 10% and the turkey and giblets feast Pate is 7% so that's a good number . The way that I did it was I looked on chewy.com and put in the search of the cat food that I was looking for and then you look up what the nutritional value is and that's where you can get your calculations for the protein fat and fiber and Ash content.
 
Paula Nowak said:
Ok, put in the search box,. Cat Food Nutrition Calculator Elizabeth C. Scheyder and you should see where to click on for that sites name. You have to have the percentags for each food for protein, fat, fiber and moisture. I know that when I did it for Fancy Feast turkey and giblets pate it came out when I hit the calculator that it was 7% dry matter analysis carbohydrate the wet matter analysis was much lower I believe it was like 2% but when considering how much carbohydrate a cat should have in dealing with conditions like diabetes it should be less than 10% and the turkey and giblets feast Pate is 7% so that's a good number . The way that I did it was I looked on chewy.com and put in the search of the cat food that I was looking for and then you look up what the nutritional value is and that's where you can get your calculations for the protein fat and fiber and Ash content.
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Thank you Paula
 
Paula Nowak said:
I have notice that the calculations here are quite different from what I have found when I did my research.
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Hi Paula. I was doing the same thing you're doing now when I first joined this forum. I was driving myself insane figuring out the calculations on every can of food, and what I was seeing here wasn't the same as the numbers I was coming up with. But it was explained to me, by a few people in a few different threads, that the calculations you and I get from those cans are different than the calculations that Doctor Lisa Pearson has on her chart. Why? Because Dr. Pearson called the manufacturers and got the precise amounts of fat, protein, moisture content, and ash. What we see listed on the cans are the minimum and maximum amounts of those ingredients, but they're not absolute. Dr. Pearson did all the work for us by contacting the manufacturers and producing that amazing chart to make our life easier. (Read @Tom & Thomas comment above in this thread.) So now, I just go by what I see on that chart and I've stop driving myself insane calculating it, only to come up with a number different than the manufacturer would give me. I hope that helps!
 
Daddy Jack's Mommy said:
Hi Paula. I was doing the same thing you're doing now when I first joined this forum. I was driving myself insane figuring out the calculations on every can of food, and what I was seeing here wasn't the same as the numbers I was coming up with. But it was explained to me, by a few people in a few different threads, that the calculations you and I get from those cans are different than the calculations that Doctor Lisa Pearson has on her chart. Why? Because Dr. Pearson called the manufacturers and got the precise amounts of fat, protein, moisture content, and ash. What we see listed on the cans are the minimum and maximum amounts of those ingredients, but they're not absolute. Dr. Pearson did all the work for us by contacting the manufacturers and producing that amazing chart to make our life easier. (Read @Tom & Thomas comment above in this thread.) So now, I just go by what I see on that chart and I've stop driving myself insane calculating it, only to come up with a number different than the manufacturer would give me. I hope that helps!
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Wow I never knew that! that is so interesting because now the carbohydrate content in the food that I am giving all this which is Fancy Feast turkey and giblets Feast classic Pate is actually really lower in carbohydrates than what I thought and saw from the calculations on the back of the actual can. Its funny that they don't say what it really is and have to put bet on the back of the can because then people don't really know for sure. That's really not good that people don't really know and hear they are trying to calculate from the back of the cans and actually it's a totally different number oh, wow!!!I'm going to need to look up Lisa Pearson's calculations from the manufacturer again for the turkey and giblets classic Pate Fancy Feast. I know I just told you what I saw on there but I have to look at it again because my vet is saying that the protein content for Elvis's food is not enough and actually it really is enough so that's going to be good news for my vet because of what she wants but then again she also was the one that said that I should not test for 2 weeks and keep giving my cat Elvis 2 units without testing which is crazy because the first night he was 173 and if I had given him 2 units that would have been too much . I just don't know what I'm going to say to my vet when she gets upset and says to me why didn't I not give Elvis the two units consistently for two weeks and I specifically told you not to test him? Do you have any ideas of what I could say to her because the two units is too much but she was insisting that that's what I do and not test him which is wrong because I am Elvis's advocate and I am going to make sure that there are no problems. I did though get the prescription for the Lantus 5 pack of pens from Mark's Marine Pharmacy. With Mark's Marine Pharmacy you do not need another prescription so I guess whatever my vet says she says but I can keep feeding off of that prescription and that's that so I will do whatever I can that is best for my cat and just like someone said on here you're just going to have to smile and nod at your vet. But I'm still wondering what I'm going to say to her when she says so how did the not testing go and giving him to units when in all actuality I did not give him to units w consistently for 2 weeks and I tested him and she said not to test him so I'm figuring out what I'm going to say to her and I don't want to lie but I am going to have to try to work around it somehow so she doesn't get mad and possibly let me go!I was just trying to figure out what I was going to say to her and I think I did figure it out because I had called the emergency vet and they told me that 2 units would be too much for the 173 that I got the first night on the 22nd of this month. I was actually going to start fresh Saturday and Friday the 22nd was the night that he got the 173 and I'm like well I'm going to call the emergency vet and they agreed with me that there was no way that I should have given Elvis 2 units. Besides the vet said that if I had any issues that I should call an emergency veterinary clinic. So after I wasn't supposed to test for 2 weeks but I did anyway and she just wanted me to give a consistent two units every day for two weeks and then do a curve, so can I still do the curve with how I tested him he was getting consistently mostly one unit in the evening and to units in the morning ? Well I probably still could do the curve and then whatever she figures out then like someone said smile and nod !the only thing is is I'm going to be concerned about the numbers that he's going to be getting when I do the curve. I'm concerned that it's going to maybe be a questionable day maybe not maybe it'll be a very good day for him but like someone also said on her that a curve is what it is for that day and then if you take a curve the next day it could be different so maybe I should just tell her that and just say well.a curve is not all that good because another curve on another day could be much different or could be roughly the same. I really want to get my knowledge on this because I really want her to know that I know what is going on and I am so glad that I have a spreadsheet because she I feel will be impressed and that might save me in all of this!
 
Paula Nowak said:
Do you have any ideas of what I could say to her !
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Just explain to your vet exactly what you said to me now. Tell her that you got another opinion when you called the emergency vet, as she suggested that you do. Show her the spreadsheet, and just breathe deep and relax. In the end, Elvis is your kitty and you're going to do what you think is right. If she still doesn't agree with you maybe you'll need to change vets, so you can be with someone who supports testing. Just have faith in yourself and in what you are doing for Elvis.
 
Daddy Jack's Mommy said:
Just explain to your vet exactly what you said to me now. Tell her that you got another opinion when you called the emergency vet, as she suggested that you do. Show her the spreadsheet, and just breathe deep and relax. In the end, Elvis is your kitty and you're going to do what you think is right. If she still doesn't agree with you maybe you'll need to change vets, so you can be with someone who supports testing. Just have faith in yourself and in what you are doing for Elvis.
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Thank You !
 
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