How do I make food for Bandit?

[Lyneteck]

This is my first post here. Hello everyone. A couple of weeks ago, our previously pudgy Bandit, was diagnosed with diabetes. He is 4 years old and had lost a significant amount of weight. That was the issue that caused the initial concern. We had been feeding him the dry Meow Mix his entire life up until then. The vet suggested we put him on the Hills Science Diet W/D. He did eat some of it for a day or two. But, after doing more internet searching, I did find the information on the benefits of the Fancy Feast Classic's and the warnings of Hills brand dry foods. I bought several different varieties of the Fancy Feast Classic's. Bandit did eat them for a few days, but he has now backed way off of eating that as well. We are very concerned about stopping his weight loss and getting the proper nutrition into his system. The vet wants us to try to control his diabetes with nutrition for a couple of months first, before we possibly begin an insulin program. I was glad to read that we can test his blood sugar with human test equipment. We do have these supplies in house. I am currently feeding him canned tuna (in water). But I just read in one of the posts here that tuna is not a good food for them due to the lack of nutrients needed for cats. He is now starting to turn his nose away from the tuna as well. I have very little trust in most foods not only for cats, but for people as well. I don't mind buying truly organic meats and supplies to feed him. But, I just want to know what ingredients I should use in order to get him the proper nutrition. I need to lower his blood sugar levels and to stop his weight loss.

 

[Hillary & Maui (GA)]

Before investing in the purchase of a meat grinder (unless you already have one), you could try one of the premade raw foods. If you visit Dr. Lisa's website: www.catinfo.org - she provides a recipe for making raw food as well as recommendations for pre-made raw food.

There is a lot to choose from - frozen to freeze dried, to mixes that you just add to ground meat. You may want to start of simply just to see if your cat(s) will even eat it.

And if you try Nature's Variety, there is a coupon on supply closet forum that you may find helpful. And do read the ingredients, not all raw food is the same.

May I ask why your vet doesn't want to start insulin immediately? Do you have test results that you can share. What were her BG (blood glucose) tests?

As you already have a meter and strips, can you get some tests in to help us see what her BG's are and help you to convince the vet to write a scrip for insulin (or help you find another vet who will).

And as far as insulin, the best choices are Levimer, Lantus or Prozinc. Levimer and Lantus are human insulins and best purchased at the human pharmacy - in pen form, rather than vial. these two insulins work in similar fashion.

May I suggest that you visit the Lantus forum http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewforum.php?f=9

and read the stickies (starred) information at the top so you better understand these insulins.

And not to be left out, here is the link to the PZI (prozinc forum) and read the stickies starred info there too: http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewforum.php?f=24

 

[Lyneteck]

Bandit's blood sugar level was 383. I have a meter, but I need to get some more test strips. I will try to get a current number soon. Bandit currently weighed a little under 10lbs as of last week. He has lost 4lbs over the last several months. I'm not really sure why the vet didn't want to start him on insulin right away. He wanted to see if we could control his sugar levels with diet first. He wants to see him again in two months. I guess that's why I am here. I felt 2 months was too long to wait to take the next step. My wife checked into the mix where you add your own ground up meat (Felion's Pride). It looked promising and we will probably end up going that route. It will take me a week or so to get that system shipped here. I would like to make him some kind of food here at home today. I'm just not sure what to put in it. I know he needs a low carb diet that is high in protein. I think it needs to have some animal fats in it as well. I'm leaning toward some chicken with some fat/skin on it. My wife just weighed him again a few minutes ago. He is now down to 8lbs. He has lost another pound and a half in the last week.

 

[Wendy&Tiggy(GA)]

He has lost a pound in a week?! Thats a very rapid weight loss. You should go back to your vet and have him checked out and discuss insulin as soon as possible. I am concerned he wont last the two months at this rate, and that there may be something else going on.

You could try the other low carb (under 10% foods) instead. Some people here use the Friskies pates and some the Wellness grain free: http://www.catinfo.org/docs/Food Chart Public 9-22-12.pdf

 

[Hillary & Maui (GA)]

if you want to give him homemade food now-you can cut up a chicken and given him the skin, meat and bone to eat - make sure it's raw. the bone (the stuff inside it) has the taurine and nutriments needed for a cat.

if you cook it, then don't give any bones.

you can serve it in chunks or grind it like burger. a meat grinder or a good food processor could break up the bone.

i also think your vet is out of touch with diabetes treatment. food change and insulin are needed in order to get him into remission. while it is possible that just a food change alone, will lower the bg, most times insulin is needed in conjunction with the food change.

if your vet is telling you to come back in 2 months, without doing anything, then your vet really doesn't understand diabetes. sadly many vets just don't understand it, which is why we are here and can help you manage this.

great that you have a meter, do you know how to test? here is a link to help you:

http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=287

in addition, to testing bg, you also need to test for ketones - you can pick up ketone strips at the pharmacy, diabetes section and yes, you will need to stalk the cat to test his pee. it;s best to wait for him to start and then put the strip in the urine stream. if that isn't possible there are other tricks you can do to get the pee.

let us know what else we can do to help.

 

[Lyneteck]

Thanks so much for the ideas. My wife made a mistake when she weighed him. He had not lost weight again. I went downstairs to weigh him myself. His weight is holding steady at 9.8 lbs.. I weighed him several times and got the same number. I just got back from the store with some good organic chicken thighs. I do have an old meat grinder that I'm going to try to use. If it doesn't work, I guess I'll try the food processor. I will try it raw with skin and bone first. Can't get the test strips until tomorrow for the blood meter. My wife is going to have the doc call in a prescription tomorrow for more needles and strips. I'll have to check and see where I can get the strips to check the urine. Again, thanks for the information. Isn't it sad that you don't get this information from the vets office.

 

[Lyneteck]

Hillary and Maui, the picture that you have of your cat, (I assume that's Maui), looks exactly like our Bandit. That is soooo funny.

 

[Hillary & Maui (GA)]

You don't need a scrip for test strips. so if the store is open today, you ought to be able to buy strips.

depending on the state you live in, a scrip may be needed for insulin needles, which makes me ask - do you already have insulin? and if you do, what do you have?

yes the pic is maui - she is black and now has white whiskers instead of black. also, I found that because of her black ears it was very helpful to have a flashlight to use as a spotlight in order to see where i was poking for tests. if bandit has black ears, you may want to use a flashlight too. i held it between my teeth to keep my hands free for testing.

 

[squeem3]

I am currently feeding him canned tuna (in water). But I just read in one of the posts here that tuna is not a good food for them due to the lack of nutrients needed for cats.

"People tuna" is not good because it lacks nutrients for a cat. As an occasional treat it is ok but not for daily meals. There are some tuna canned cat foods but seafood in general shouldn't be fed every day to a cat. Some cats get addicted to eating seafood and will refuse to eat anything else, the protein amount tends to be low, the phosphorus content can be hard on the kidneys, etc.

Before investing in the purchase of a meat grinder (unless you already have one), you could try one of the premade raw foods. If you visit Dr. Lisa's website: www.catinfo.org - she provides a recipe for making raw food as well as recommendations for pre-made raw food.

There is also a recipie at http://www.catnutrition.org/recipes.html that some people here use.

There is a lot to choose from - frozen to freeze dried, to mixes that you just add to ground meat. You may want to start of simply just to see if your cat(s) will even eat it.

Not all commerical freeze dried raw foods are complete diets so it's important to read the label. One brand that is a complete diet is Stella and Chewy's

Commercial frozen raw is usually a complete diet but again, read the label. Nature's Variety is one brand that is a complete diet, except the bison formula. This brand is listed on Dr. Lisa's food chart along with a few other brands suitable for diabetic cats.

A pre-mix is another option. The pre-mix contains all the vitamins and minerals. All you do is add ground/chunked raw meats of your choice to a measured amount of the pre-mix. Some brands are Better In The Raw, TC Feline, and Alnutrin.

And if you try Nature's Variety, there is a coupon on supply closet forum that you may find helpful. [/url]

The coupon is for a full sized bag of NV raw. I suggest trying a trial sized bag of either the medallions or the raw bites first.

Some cats don't take to raw food right away and may need a little bribing with yummy canned food, tuna juice, FortiFlora, etc for awhile before they accept plain raw food. I used freeze dried raw to get my rescue cat to eat raw food.

You don't need a scrip for test strips. so if the store is open today, you ought to be able to buy strips.

Some pharmacies keep test strips locked up in a cabinet in the diabetes aisle or behind the pharmacy counter. Ask the pharmacist if the tst s trips aren't readily available.

 

[Ann & Tess GA]

I've tried making raw food w/ an old fashioned hand grinder and they really can't handle the bones. You would be better off just cutting the meat into chunks , 1/2" to an inch that he has to chew. Try giving him just a piece or two or plain raw chicken to see if he will eat it before making a whole batch. If you do it without the bones there is a note in Dr. Lisa's article on adding bone meal as a replacement. For Taurine hearts are the best and lots of cats love them as treats, they are also very good for their teeth!

All the supplements can be found a a health food store or vitamin shop. They ran about $50 to get everything but it was enough for at least half a year! There are also some vitamin and mineral supplements that you can find at pet stores that may help to tide you over until the mix you plan to order comes without the expense of buying all the separate vitamin and minerals if you decide to go w/ the premix. Not for long term, but better than adding nothing.