Hi we are new to this...

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Tigger and I

Member Since 2012
Hi my name is Chantél and my kitty's name is Tigger. We are from knysna, south africa and not too clued up with the conversions as I have noticed they are diffrent to yours! He is 9 years old, was diagnosed with diabetes few months ago. He bg was 22 and he had ketones in his urine, he weighed 6.45kg and has probably lost quite a bit since testing. He was put on 8 units of caninsulin 2 times a day and strict diet of hills wd which he just stopped eating and had to change him over to md. Which he likes and seems to be gaining a bit of weight again. He was becoming very bony. Still dont think sugar under control and dont know what else to try. Have to take him in again, vet wants to increase insulin? I just dont know what to do anymore. Think he still has ketones in urine.Worried about what will happen if i dont get it under control. Any advise?
 
Hi guys and welcome! I'm not familiar with your insulin at all, our cat mocha was on lantus .. but 8 units in such a short time seems like quite a bit .. have you done any home testing yourself? I know there are some members on the lantus board that are in South Africa (I think anyways) I'll post a link from here to there, to see if they might be close enough to help you out, at least with home testing .. ok?
 
Hello Chantel and Tigger,
Welcome!

Have you seen this page that talks about your insulin?

viewtopic.php?f=19&t=302

When you first log on to The Main FDMB forum.....There is a category towards the bottom called Insulin Support Groups and it has canninsuln in it so you can also
read other posts from other users specifically on your insulin.
I am not familiar with your insulin either. But we do have a few who are.

Is the Hills diet dry food? That is probably part of the problem. All dry foods are high in carbohydrates even the prescription ones.
What brands are available to you and we can help you find a canned food that would be more beneficial to Tigger.
It is much harder for the insulin to do it's job when Tigger's body is full of carbohydrates.

And it doesn't sound like you are home testing his glucose levels.
This is necessary because it shows you when the dosage is too high and how to correct it or if it is too low.

You have found the right place to get help but you will have to learn a lot , read a lot, and take charge. You may even have to find another vet because many of
them are stuck in their ways and don't want your input.

I think your dosage is probably high and is causing the ketones.
I don't want to tell you to go change the cat's diet because you need to learn everything , especially the home monitoring .
If we change the diet right away and Tigger is still on the high dosage, we could cause a hypo reaction.

If you are willing to start learning and find out if your vet will work with you or not.
Explore the possibility of finding another vet and find out whether or not you have choices in other insulins.
( I know some countries do not have other insulin choices )

http://www.2ndchance.info/diabetescat.htm
www.catinfo.org
explore all the topics on the right side at http://www.felinediabetes.com/


These links will help you start learning quickly so that you won't have to just follow the vets instructions when you know he isn't really helping your cat.
 
As others have said, that is a large amount of insulin. Can you help you learn how to test at home? We test our 4 legged kids just like we would our 2 legged ones, every time before giving a shot to be sure the dose is safe and midcycle to see how the insulin is working. Because most cats are stressed at the vet, we think the numbers at home are more accurate and in some cats, over 100 points lower.

Once you are testing, you can see how the insulin is working. It may be that he is bouncing from a high number to a low number and back again: http://petdiabetes.wikia.com/wiki/Somogyi_rebound

We would also suggest a wet low carb diet BUT not until you are testing regularly. The diet can drastically reduce the insulin requirements. When we switched Oliver from dry to wet, he came down 100 points overnight. If we had shot our regular dose, he would have hypoed. Hills WD is 37% carbs; we try to stay below 8-10%.

Read on the site and ask questions. We would love to help you help your kitty.
 
Hi Chantel, and welcome!

There are a few of us in South Africa, though not many. We're close to Cape Town, so a bit far from you guys. I know of a couple of members in Pretoria and Jo'burg. I'll look around to see if I've missed someone in your area. In the meantime, go ahead and have a look at our spreadsheet (which you'll find the link to in our signature, right below this message). You'll see that we post our numbers both in the international and US notations.

I too don't know much about Caninsulin. There is an insulin-specific group for Caninsulin here on FDMB where you can start reading around, though for now maybe spend a few more days here on the Health forum until you get your bearings.

You've received the most important pieces of advice for someone starting out, so I won't repeat that now :smile:

Keep reading and asking questions! It will get clearer and easier, I promise!
Jane
 
We do have a Canninsulin forum but no one posts there. There are some old posts that might be useful to you if you look at their spreadsheets. It would be best if you continue to post here on Health.
 
Hi again,
I wasn't saying to post in the Canninsulin forum.
I was only suggesting reading about that insulin . That's what that link was, just informaton about that particular insulin.

In addtion to that, reading older posts often helps. It's what put me on the fast track for my own insulin.

Keep posting your questions right here where you are.....
 
Hi Chantel & Tigger

Welcome to the forum - you will get a huge amount of help and advice here. I am not in South Africa (although I did visit your lovely city last summer when I was there on holidays) but my 6 year old cat Scamp is in remission from diabetes and she was on caninsulin. In my opinion you are giving Tigger a scary huge amount of insulin!!!!!!! Scamp was diagnosed in February and she was put on 1 unit twice a day. I immediately started home testing (again my opinion vital to start ASAP)
and switched her to wet food only (luckily that was easy for me because she likes to eat !!). Within a very short period of time she was dropped to 1/2 unit twice a day then down to 1/2 unit once a day and now she has not had a shot for over a month!!! It doesn't happen that way for every cat - she was one of the lucky ones!! Her numbers at the start were in the 30's and now she is diet controlled.

I strongly urge you to start home testing as too much insulin can kill Tigger - please read about what to do if your cat has too much insulin. Scamp's numbers did go down as low as 2 and it is scary (she was asymptomatic and was fine as I gave her food immediately)

Good luck and if you need any more info on the caninsulin I will be happy to help if I know the answer!!

Alix & Scamp
 
What syringes are you using? U40 syringes from the vet or U100 syringes from a human pharmacy?

Caninsulin is a U40 veterinary insulin. IF you are using U100 human syringes, then the dose is really not 8u but 8/2.5 = 3.2u because Caninsulin is dilute compared to human insulins.

phoebe
 
Hi Chantal

I have only just found this site and am amazed that it exists, everyone who hears I have a diabetic cat is most shocked.
Kit Kat just moved in one day (from three houses up) and for the last two years he has been very stable on Caninsulin, (he is on three units twice a day) recently he started getting colds and this plays havoc with his BG.... never heard of the stuff you have, and it sounds like a horribly large dose. I have an amazing vet who is very practical and down to earth about treating Kit Kat and takes lots of time to explain everything to me and does not get irritated with my constant questions, (if your vet is not prepared to explore new treatments etc or take time to explain things to you then change, just as you would with your own GP. Here are some of the basics I will share some of this with you.
1. You cannot use human syringes as the units differ....My vet goes beserk at any mention of human injections, use a 27gauge needle it makes the process so much less traumatice.
2. Any infection will affect his BG and giving more insulin is not the answer, my vet advises treat the cold and then takle the BG/insulin.
3. Just like human diabetics, cats will eventually start suffering from minor side affects, (I have found that Kit Kat has stopped going out so much at night, apparently their night vision is affected)
4. You really should test yourself at home, ( I only test Kit Kat every three days as he is very stable and I can read his moods very well. Just like humans, cats can become grumpy and agressive when there is an imbalance, ( his nickname is Hitler as he terrorises the other cats)
5. My vet advised me to only inject once the Kit Kat is halfway through his meal as if the cat is off their food then injecting the normal dose of insulin has a negative affect, if Kit Kat does not want to eat his food and is not showing any signs of other illness then I only give 1,5 units, sometimes they just are not hungry.
6. Try give the injections at the same time every day.

Trust you and your kitty are doing much better,
Jillian and Kit Kat
 
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