Hey..so i'm not sure Miel is gonna last much longer....
- Thread starter mirnta
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JanetNJ
Member Since 2016
Awe.
I'm sorry to hear he isn't doing well. What are his numbers like? I don't see a link to your spreadsheet. Maybe he had something else going on like ckd or cancer. Has he been to the vet?
mirnta
Member Since 2015
I dont have a spreadsheet. I write it out by hand and have this whole time, ive told everyone on here that. Haha. Not recently to the vet. His #s were fine. He was doing a little boomeranging so i lowered the dose. I just cant seem to get it right anymore..he was well regulated for 4 yrs. I dont know what else i can do..Awe.
Bron and Sheba (GA)
Member Since 2015
I would set up a spreadsheet and start recording the BSL on it. Also the last couple of months bsl as well would be very useful. There are people here who will be able to help you but they need to see the spreadsheet.
His balance problems could be from neuropathy if his numbers have been high lately. The higher numbers could also explain the weight loss.
His balance problems could be from neuropathy if his numbers have been high lately. The higher numbers could also explain the weight loss.
Bama Kitty Mom (GA)
Member Since 2018
My boy was diagnosed 4 years ago, on the same insulin the whole time, and I can't seem to get him regulated any more. I'm considering an insulin change but going to continue on the same insulin for another few weeks until he is due for a new vial. Maybe consider a change of insulin?
Tracey&Jones (GA)
Member Since 2016
How are his teeth? Is a dental warranted?
mirnta
Member Since 2015
Thanks but ive been on here for 4 yrs and have still never done a spreadsheet and i wont be, sorry. I don't need help with his numbers..i need to know what the next step is when regulating no longer works.
mirnta
Member Since 2015
Last time he was in a year ago they were fine...i can bring him in again to see tho..
mirnta
Member Since 2015
yes i have thought of this...the prob is i cant afford any other ones..
vetsulin is the cheapest...lemme know what happens if you decide to do that!
mirnta
Member Since 2015
Thank you. He is eating, just not much. Vet is friday...but i don't think he's gonna tell me anything i don't already know.If he’s not eating, he needs to see a vet. Be sure to test him for ketones. Sending prayers for Miel
Elizabeth and Bertie
Member Since 2010
If he's off his food at all, as Sharon says DO test his pee for ketones. Ketones can be very dangerous indeed for diabetics if they're allowed to build up, and expensive to treat. The test is simple. You just dip the end of a ketone test strip (available from most pharmacies) into a drop of pee. Then time it, and check the result. ...Crumpling plastic food wrap loosely in the litter tray is often an easy way to get a sample. You only need a drop.
Anything above a 'trace' result is a reason to contact your vet ASAP.
There are many possible reasons for the symptoms you describe...
What have Miel's blood glucose numbers been over the past couple of days?
Eliz
Noah & me (GA)
Member Since 2016
Yes, I have just dealt with this. Our first sugar cat Nigel had textbook curves but Noah was a bouncer and his spreadsheet was in my head. There was just no point because every day had to be dealt with separately. His medical history was a mess, too long to go into here but he managed with a mouthful of rotten teeth and enough BUPE to live a pretty normal life. He knew who and where he was, he could still jump onto chairs and dealt with an 80 pound dog recently brought into the home.
A cat that has recently stopped eating could be any number of things so I'll leave the medical advice to people smarter than me. What I can tell you is this. If it's something "simple" like dental I wouldn't be eating either so explore those possibilities with your vet and don't be shy about asking questions. Teeth can look fine last week and then suddenly make your life absolutely miserable. Noah's coat was always a mess but he trusted me enough to let me trim his belly. Lack of self grooming in older cats is not that unusual.
I cannot go any further right now, still too emotional. Keep posting and let us know how your vet visit goes, make certain you get him weighed.
Veronica & Babu-chiri
Member Since 2016
Sorry to hear he's not feeling well but the symptoms you are describing can be because of a number of things many which can be handled. Some of which once under control his blood glucose numbers may get OK again
Ask the vet to check his kidneys, make sure they check for UTI and his teeth
Ask the vet to check his kidneys, make sure they check for UTI and his teeth
Bama Kitty Mom (GA)
Member Since 2018
yes i have thought of this...the prob is i cant afford any other ones..
Have you checked the prices at Marks Marine Pharmacy in Canada for other insulins? If I go with another insulin I'll probably buy my supply there and go with the pens. Lantus, since that seems to be what most vets around here prescribe.
Sharon14
Member Since 2015
Do you have a copy of his bloodwork? It may help us to see the actual kidney numbers. Are you giving him sub Q fluids. Here is a great source of info .http://www.felinecrf.org/index.htm Maybe start a new thread with kidney disease in the title to get more input.
mirnta
Member Since 2015
I dont have a copy of anything yet...i just found out..he is suffering. How much longer should i allow him to suffer?
JanetNJ
Member Since 2016
With ckd you want to do sub q’s and get on a low carb low phosphorus wet food suck as tiki cat. Depending on the levels you may want to give a phosphorous binder such as aluminum hydroxide. High phosphorus can cause them to feel icky and not want to eat. Ask the vet for the most recent blood tests.
JanetNJ
Member Since 2016
Awe I'm sorry he's not doing well.
. Is he eating anything?
PussCatPrince - GA
Member Since 2017
I'm so sorry to read this. Did the vet indicate which stage it was at all?
Whatever is decided I am right this moment sending you a hug.
Ana & Frosty (GA)
Member Since 2018
If your think your baby is suffering and your vet says the kidney failure is likely end stage and won’t get better, it’s reasonable to decide that enough is enough. I know that it is difficult and painful, but qualify of life is very important to take into consideration with pets. Whatever you decide, we are here for you.
Paigeworthy
Member Since 2018
Thinking of you <3
mirnta
Member Since 2015
No not really..and altho he has strict diet at this point...im just feeding him whatever he will eat now. I just want him.to be happy at the end of his life.Awe I'm sorry he's not doing well.
mirnta
Member Since 2015
Not yet..i will find out all that on monday. But it didnt sound good and he is just not happyI'm so sorry to read this. Did the vet indicate which stage it was at all?
Whatever is decided I am right this moment sending you a hug.
mirnta
Member Since 2015
Thank you for these kind words..i really needed to hear them.If your think your baby is suffering and your vet says the kidney failure is likely end stage and won’t get better, it’s reasonable to decide that enough is enough. I know that it is difficult and painful, but qualify of life is very important to take into consideration with pets. Whatever you decide, we are here for you.
PussCatPrince - GA
Member Since 2017
What a horrible waiting game .
I do hope you can have some cuddles & love time with Miel .
As Ana has written. All our best wishes go with you for Monday & we shall be here no matter what.
M
x
mirnta
Member Since 2015
Thank you. I got an early call from the vet..it is stage 2-3. Severe anemia too. 2.6 is the #? I gotta look up what that means. Even with the sub q fluids and vitamins i can do at home..my vet doesnt think he will last more than a month tops. He is barely eliminating. I think it is his time to go...as horrifically painful as it is..i cant watch him suffer anymore.
Noah & me (GA)
Member Since 2016
Hope you find some peace today. When there is nothing you can do anymore and an animal is suffering is an awful feeling.
Everyone here has been through this and although it might not make sense right now we do know how you feel. You might not feel like sharing those thoughts but when or if you do we are here for you.
Everyone here has been through this and although it might not make sense right now we do know how you feel. You might not feel like sharing those thoughts but when or if you do we are here for you.
Ana & Frosty (GA)
Member Since 2018
I know it is difficult, but you are making the right decision. I am not sure if you read any of my posts, but I waited too long - Frosty didn’t make it to his euthanasia appointment and passed the morning of the appt, on his own and I felt that he suffered unnecessarily. He was in distress and although I rushed him to the ED he passed before they were able to give him any meds. I felt a lot of guilt about it, and I know there are others who feel the same way. It’s fair to give it a few days, but I told myself if Frosty does poorly for 3 days straight, it was a sign that it was time. I really wish I made the decision just a day earlier. I don’t know if that helps.
Keep us posted. Many of us have lost our babies recently, and we are here and understand your pain.
Veronica & Babu-chiri
Member Since 2016
Sorry to hear he's not doing well but still I would like to tell you that stage 2-3 can be handled and they can have a fairly ok live with diet, some supplements and probably subq fluids and phosphorus binders (once you start all of this he will start feeling better) ,
The anemia is at this point is probably the hardest thing to manage and what is causing him to feel worse probably but that can be treated also, besides the vitamins there's some meds that can help with that, I've known of people that have had transfusions for treating anemia (not easily available where I live so I don't know much about it just that is an option) , but is important that the vet finds out what's causing the anemia that is probably the hardest part and once you find that out then you can have a more accurate prognosis
Did the vet told you what his phosphorus levels are?
If his phosphorus level is high (and with stage 2-3 they probably are ) that could be causing him nausea and of course not eating properly you can give him anti nausea med and that will help him feel better (you can give him SEB slippery elm too for that ), and you will need to give him special kidney diet, just not be careful with what kidney diet you give him because most kidney diets are high carb, you need a low carb low phosphorus diet (or with phosphorus binders)
Becky & Baby Girl GA
Member Since 2017
Thinking of you with blessings & comforting hugs today. This is a gift to our most precious of friends...
Larry and Kitties
Member Since 2009
Several of my recent angel cats had a sudden decrease in kidney function from mild CKD to very severe/end stage CKD. That is a HCT fo 20 with phosphorus off scale even with a lot of phosphorus binder being used. They had the same symptoms as Miel. Regarding muscle weakness that an be caused by low potassium.
Dusty Bones
Member Since 2013
Prayers that you both find peace soon.
Mary Ann & Baby
Member Since 2018
I'm sorry you are going through this. You are a good catmom and it's obvious you love your Miel. Whatever you decide, I wish you comfort and peace.
Veronica & Babu-chiri
Member Since 2016
Hopefully one of the really experienced in lab work will take a look soon, but this is what I can understand of his labs
He's stage 2 CKD ( I suggest you take a look at Tanya's web page where there's some really valuable information about CKD that can actually help you http://www.felinecrf.org/how_bad_is_it.htm) and stage 2 is really very manageable with diet especially since his phosphorus level is quite normal still you need to get him a low phosphorus low carb diet and that would help him a lot, at this point he doesn't even need subqs with a creatinine of 2.6 (it is usually given when they are above 3.5), unless he's dehydrated for some other reason
He may have a mild anemia but since is still mild he probably could get better with some B complex and B12 vitamins and a follow up
His potassium is low which can explain for his weakness, lack of appetite and apathy you should talk about it with the vet so that you can give him potassium orally ( renal k if you can get the powder version because the gel has a lot of sugar in it or just potassium gluconate is fairly easy to give with water or food ) but giving potassium should always be done with vet supervision because it has to be monitored closely
He could be having some sort of infection are his teeth ok? has he been tested for IBD or pancreatitis?
He's stage 2 CKD ( I suggest you take a look at Tanya's web page where there's some really valuable information about CKD that can actually help you http://www.felinecrf.org/how_bad_is_it.htm) and stage 2 is really very manageable with diet especially since his phosphorus level is quite normal still you need to get him a low phosphorus low carb diet and that would help him a lot, at this point he doesn't even need subqs with a creatinine of 2.6 (it is usually given when they are above 3.5), unless he's dehydrated for some other reason
He may have a mild anemia but since is still mild he probably could get better with some B complex and B12 vitamins and a follow up
His potassium is low which can explain for his weakness, lack of appetite and apathy you should talk about it with the vet so that you can give him potassium orally ( renal k if you can get the powder version because the gel has a lot of sugar in it or just potassium gluconate is fairly easy to give with water or food ) but giving potassium should always be done with vet supervision because it has to be monitored closely
He could be having some sort of infection are his teeth ok? has he been tested for IBD or pancreatitis?
Larry and Kitties
Member Since 2009
The creatinine level is only a little elevated. The urine specific gravity of 1.015 is indicative of kidney problems. The high reticulocyte means that the body is producing more red blood cells in reaction to the HCT of only 21%. This indicates that the kidney deficiency is not the cause of the low HCT.
Also the potassium is and oral or subQ supplements can be administered.
Also the potassium is and oral or subQ supplements can be administered.
mirnta
Member Since 2015
Thanks for the info. He is already on a zero carb diet. And he barely eats so i just give him what he'll eat.hes already been tested for everything. He is very dehydrated and was given fluids. Im going to get some vits and fluids to do at home. He has severe anemia. And most likely pancreatitis.
mirnta
Member Since 2015
I dont really understand what yr saying sorry. I dont know what hct is. He has severe anemia and most likely pancreatitis i was told.
PussCatPrince - GA
Member Since 2017
I'll tag @Marje and Gracie . Hopefully she may come by.
I was going to post up about the CKD Iris scale yesterday but did not as I thought maybe I had misunderstood which stage it was .
Stage 2 CKD is treatable and manageable. Many , many cats live with CKD stage II for years . Stage 4 is end life.
Pancreatitis is also treatable as is anemia.
If pusscat feels nauseous then an appetite stimulant is not such a good idea. It should be anti-nausea first.
Mirnta's vet has given a prognosis of just one month though so perhaps something else is going on.
@mirnta
I am so sorry you are going through this. You know your cat and you must follow your gut feeling.
mirnta
Member Since 2015
I think too soon or too late can be very hard....i think we are just too hard on ourselves...we arent perfect and we cant read the future..we can only make the best decision at the time. <3I know it is difficult, but you are making the right decision. I am not sure if you read any of my posts, but I waited too long - Frosty didn’t make it to his euthanasia appointment and passed the morning of the appt, on his own and I felt that he suffered unnecessarily. He was in distress and although I rushed him to the ED he passed before they were able to give him any meds. I felt a lot of guilt about it, and I know there are others who feel the same way. It’s fair to give it a few days, but I told myself if Frosty does poorly for 3 days straight, it was a sign that it was time. I really wish I made the decision just a day earlier. I don’t know if that helps.
Keep us posted. Many of us have lost our babies recently, and we are here and understand your pain.
mirnta
Member Since 2015
If it's so easily treatable why did he say it was not?
PussCatPrince - GA
Member Since 2017
I'd go along with that one. We cannot always control the pace of life or the arrival of death can we. Sometimes we must just work hard to accept.
mirnta said:
No treatment or change is easy really but I don't know Mirnta. Maybe there is something else going on.
CKD stage II can be managed . That's about low phos in the diet.
Hopefully some of the guru's will be along soon for you with their experience and practical thoughts.
Jill & Alex (GA)
Member Since 2009
@mirnta
@PussCatPrince - GA
@PussCatPrince - GA
I've sent Marje both a PM and an email. I have no idea if she's available at the moment, but I'm sure she'll stop by when she can. She may be able to help put things in perspective.
Veronica & Babu-chiri
Member Since 2016
I would ask the vet why is he giving this prognosis and if there's something else besides the CKD stage 2 , because stage 2 is really something they can live with and have a very good quality of life
HCT is the ratio of the volume of red blood cells to the total volume of blood which in his case is a low but not terribly low still in a treatable range if you act soon, so I would also ask the vet why is he saying he has severe anemia
Basically I think you need to ask the vet to clarify the prognosis a bit more
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