He's not improving at all

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Karen & Rudy

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At my last vet appointment, they upped his shot from 1unit 2 X's a day to 2 units 2 X's a day. I know we don't check very often, but his numbers don't seem to be improving at all. I have another appointment on friday and I am not sure what she will say, but I know they will do a fructosamine again to see what's going on. I feel like I am doing this all wrong and not understanding the process at all. We are going to do a curve on Saturday, which will give us more information. What should I expect for a curve on Prozinc? It seems like most people are on other insiluns and have different numbers, different lows and highs? I'm not even sure the difference from between all of these :-( I have read all of the sticky posts, but it left me more confused and overwhelmed. I am so scared to screw this up- I love my fur baby so much! Thanks to all of you for the help so far and in the future, you really are keeping me grounded.
 
May I ask what you are feeding? Also have all other health issues been ruled out.....infection, teeth, etc? I know teeth were a problem with Hidey.

Also I would try to get more A.M. pre shot tests in to make sure he's not bouncing.

Don't get discouraged, these things can take some time. Every cat is different.
 
He is still eating .25 cup of dry food a day- wysong epigen, along with .25-.5 ounces of can food- we keep swtiching, so I'm not sure which kind. I don't think he is eating enough either, but I can't get him to eat anymore than that. he is 14.4lbs since september (was over 15 lbs before that) and just went down to 14.2 lbs yesterday.
 
Sorry- forgot to answer the other questions- he has been to the vet every other week for the past month and a half- no infections or dental problems :-)
 
Getting rid of even that little bit of dry will help his numbers greatly. My most recent guy to come off insulin was eating low carb dry and was up to 11u bid when I adopted him, took his crunchies away and switched him over to all canned Friskies Pate and 9 months later his was in remission. Of course Cassanova was also 37lbs when I adopted him from all that dry food.

Also I can't stress how important testing at home is. If you don't know how low a dose is taking them, then especially in the beginning you spend a lot of time scratching your head wondering where all those high numbers come from. My Autumn is a bouncy little girl right now, but she can drop easily from 300s to double digits in a matter of hours. Which will send her racing right back up. So if you aren't catching those lows or fast drops then it makes it hard to figure out if he is bouncing or just not enough insulin to pull the numbers down.

Also remember while numbers are important in this dance, they aren't the only thing that is important. Many times you see improvement in the whole cat before it is shows up in the numbers. Things like coat in better condition, eating and drinking less ravenously, peeing more normal, increased energy, able to jump up again etc.

On the forum that I normally hang out on and advise on I will often ask folks to give me a whole cat and P report. The 5Ps are Preening, Pooping, Peeing, Playing and Purring. Those are usually the first signs of recovery, when they start doing all those things normally again.

Mel and The Fur Gang
 
Thank you so much! The link is very helpful - I really think doing a curve this weekend will help me a TON.

Wysong Epigen is carb free- another board member recommended it to me.

We have noticed in the past two weeks that he actually is bathing himself again, playing again, being more social, etc. He wasn't pooping much before and not he is on a much better schedule! His peeing is still more than before his diagnosis, but improving slowly. I put that information on the second tab of his chart. It isn't updated daily, more like weekly- I keep the written log at home an input it on the weekends.

Thank you for repsonding- I feel calmer already. I was getting very panic stricken for a while there :oops:
 
Doing a curve can give some great info! Help you see how low he goes on the insulin. Looking forward to seeing it!
 
Not sure if this is going to be helpful or not, but I did a little web-surfing last night and found the ingredients list for the Wysong dry you are feeding him. It is grain-free and starch free but I wouldn't call it carb free, there is still a lot of things in there besides grains and starches that could make it problematic, because of the hidden sugar as well as some of the flavors have ingredients that I know spike mine to the stars and back...like dried eggs. But some flavors lists things like Tomatoes, Blue berries, Apples etc.

If anyone is good at figuring out this kind of stuff, I'm not here is the link to the ingredients list

And well it is still dry, and honestly with 16 cats I can confidently tell you no dry is good for a cat, the improvement in my civies alone after we had our first sugarcat and made the switch (yes all 16 eat canned Friskies pate) has been remarkable. And my 3 kittens that have joined the family since having a couple extra sweet cats and never had a mouthful of dry are STUNNING!

Mel and The Fur Gang
 
MommaOfMuse said:
Also remember while numbers are important in this dance, they aren't the only thing that is important. Many times you see improvement in the whole cat before it is shows up in the numbers. Things like coat in better condition, eating and drinking less ravenously, peeing more normal, increased energy, able to jump up again etc.

On the forum that I normally hang out on and advise on I will often ask folks to give me a whole cat and P report. The 5Ps are Preening, Pooping, Peeing, Playing and Purring. Those are usually the first signs of recovery, when they start doing all those things normally again.

Mel and The Fur Gang

Mel is so right. You can drive yourself crazy (and I have) concentrating on just the numbers. Bouncing Ben's been all over with the numbers and the dosages. If i just focused on what his spreadsheet said, I'd cry everyday. Instead I look at a cat that isn't losing weight anymore and purrs in my lap and I accept that. The lower numbers will happen eventually (I hope).
 
I agree with everyone. I think we beans tend to get too focused on numbers. Numbers are super important and helpful but they are not everything. There's a cat behind those numbers! It took me a long time to find a good balance between numbers and Gypsy's behavior. You'll get there too!
 
Here is a thread about dry food with several comments about epigen. I don't know the poster zzyyxx (Jenni) but she seems to be the only advocate for it. There is no place anyone broke it down and suggested a possible carb content (other than the manufacturer)
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=123120&hilit=wysong+epigen

Will he eat wet at all? If so, it really would be worth your while to get him to eat more wet and less dry until he is only on wet low carb. It isn't only the carbs in dry; it is the potential for dehydration. (www.catinfo.org)
 
ugh...just when i think i am doing the right thing- i feel like i am failing my poor little guy. I did find this reveiw, but I have no idea what the guy is actually talking about?
http://www.dogfoodadvisor.com/dog-food- ... ng-epigen/

he seems to like the wysong, but i think i can switch him to something else if is better, i'm just not sure what would be better. i can see that i am going to have to make a slow transition for him.
 
No, you are NOT failing him. You are working really hard to get him the right amount of insulin and the best food and you are keeping him safe by testing him at home. Lots of bean get the diagnosis and worst case, they have the kitty put to sleep as it sounds like too much work or they agree to give shots blindly. You are busy trying to do the best you can for him, so take time to give yourself credit.

If he will eat any wet, I think I would try transitioning him over from the dry. Yes, it can be a very slow process. That same vet has a great plan for transitioning slow converts :mrgreen: (www.catinfo.org) You might start with giving him the wet pate, chopped up so it is easy to eat, with some dry food crumbled up on top. Then gradually increase the wet and decrease the dry.

My non diabetic cat didn't like the texture of the wet pate. He would eat the gravy food and the shreds. So I started with putting a little warm water in the pate and mixing it up to make a gravy, at the same time making it less hard and stiff. After a while, he decided it wasn't so bad….

There is also a probiotic called FortiFlora that works fantastic for some cats, but not for all. It has the animal digest that makes dry food so irrestible. You sprinkle a little on top of the wet. It is available on line or sometimes through the vet.

You just keep doing the best you can, and remember that you are doing! Not throwing up your hands and giving up.
 
Ditto what Sue said!!! As a fact the reason I have 3 diabetic cats is because other people gave up on them...Maxwell as 24 hours away from death after surviving Hurricane Katrina, Autumn was literally starving to death for 10+ months after she was dxed because her previous owner couldn't or wouldn't treat and Cassanova was also about to be put down because his first mom went into a nursing home and her DIL was shooting 11u bid of Levemir BLIND! My original sugarcat has been gone a long time now, but because of this board 3 more are living wonderful lives with me and two are in remission. But yes, it is a process, it takes awhile to convert them over to what they should be eating and it takes us awhile to figure out what they will and won't eat that is actually good for them.

I've cracked 17 hardcore dry food addicts so if you need any tips or tricks and I'm not lurking around here, shoot me a PM. I'm always happy to share what I know and what worked for us.

Remember this is a marathon. You're doing great Hon, because you are doing! Rome wasn't built in a day so just keep taking baby steps forward and you both will get there.

Mel and The Fur Gang
 
Thank you so much for the encouragement, it actually made me cry- in a good way! I have been having some personal issues as well as Rudy's diagnosis, so I think I am just very overwhelmed with everything right now. I will NEVER give up on my kitty- my Rudy has been with me through so much, he really is my longest relationship ;-) That tends to make my husband and four kids a little jealous- but it's true! lol

Keep pushing on- I guess I need to gather a list of questions for the vet appointment tomorrow. I am really hoping that his fructosamine is lower than in the past. fingers crossed.
 
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