Help with Elmo Hypo

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:bighug::bighug::bighug:
Just about to sign off.

A reading of 91 at +4 isn't very far above the Alphatrak hypo threshold level. Remember that the crystalline fraction of the Vetsulin is going to kick in - typically anywhere from about +7. If it were my cat I'd be looking to get numbers comfortably into the 100s before then and I'd keep testing until after +10 even if numbers are safe. The plus is that Vetsulin's an in-out but I'd be cautious about how much to give (if any) this evening; today's low might make Elmo more sensitive to the insulin.

:bighug:


Mogs
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Thank you, thank you Mogs....now please go take care of yourself
 
Been running around with some family issues so haven't been on the board as much as usual...was just checking in periodically but not posting much. :(
Love the cavalry pic! :D

@Beth 73 That +4 is looking encouraging but Elmo still needs to be watched. I'd test again in 30 minutes with no further food/syrup for now so we can see if he holding his own or if that number is food influence.
Will do...Gotta go feed rescue kitties but will take BG right after at about +4.5
 
Just now took +5 ....got a 137.....he has had no food in 2 3/4 hours since + 3.25..... is bummed that after I took last two BGs he looks at me like " what??? No treat ???"....advise as to how to proceed...keep taking BG every hour ? Ideas on what dose to give later at PM? The hypo back in Oct was human error as was the slight one last week but if my dear husband is correct he swears he only gave Elmo his 0.5 this morning ..... I had filled the syringe ....
 
I would say that Elmo will be fine for the rest of the cycle. It seems that he is fairly carb sensitive so the foods that you were using today work well with his low numbers. You could keep a few of the Fancy Feast or Friskies with gravy on hand for future use (anti-jinx) but he does respond well with the ones you were using today. If you normally give a small meal of regular food before the next shot you could continue with your normal pattern, but at this point he is still rising without any added help. Hopefully he won't jump up too high for the PMPS. You could do another test in a few hours just to see how the numbers are going, but I think you can take down the "911" now. ;)

Great catch and great job on steering Elmo back up :bighug:
 
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Looks like Elmo is staying/going up now although that could be some bounce due to the low number too. I'd check him again in a couple of hours (when the second volley of Vetsulin action should be clicking in at about +7). If you usually feed Elmo between shots and want to give me him anything more, I'd stick with his usual LC food.
As for tonight's shot, Elmo earned a reduction so I'd be inclined to give no more than 0.25u as long as the pre-shot number is high enough. Let's see where he goes the rest of the cycle and make tonight's shot decision once we see what he does the rest of this cycle.
 
Thank u so very much, Mary Ann...I am semi techy illeterate so could u please tell me how to remove the 911...saw ur fur babies are litter mates...I have two 13 yr old sibling brothers as well... litter mates are really extra special !
 
Thank u so very much, Mary Ann...I am semi techy illeterate so could u please tell me how to remove the 911...saw ur fur babies are litter mates...I have two 13 yr old sibling brothers as well... litter mates are really extra special !


At the top of this page on the right hand side you will see "Thread tools" If you click on it it has the option to edit the title. Just go to the title and use the drop down box where the 911 is and select the nothing ...no prefix...icon
 
.saw ur fur babies are litter mates...I have two 13 yr old sibling brothers as well... litter mates are really extra special !


Yes my two are brother and sister litter mates very bonded. I love the different personalities with the two of them. I DON'T love that they both decided to be diabetic. No real reason for either of them to be FD kitties, so there must be some genetics that came into play.
 
Yes my two are brother and sister litter mates very bonded. I love the different personalities with the two of them. I DON'T love that they both decided to be diabetic. No real reason for either of them to be FD kitties, so there must be some genetics that came into play.
And my boys are both FUS....I have switched them from Hills c/d to Core Wellness due to Elmo giving me heads up ab high carb food....
 
And my boys are both FUS....I have switched them from Hills c/d to Core Wellness due to Elmo giving me heads up ab high carb food....

Sorry you have to deal with an ongoing urinary problem. Good thing Elmo gave you "the talk" about a better diet for them ;) Again it sounds like there is some genetics going on there, although better food choices will help a lot with the FUS. Sometimes "sharing" is not such a good thing.

I remember when I brought my two home. My son was around 11 then and asked which one was my favourite. I just said BOTH. He never understoof that until about 9 years ago when he adopted two girlies. I asked him the same question once and he just laughed. :)
 
Sorry you have to deal with an ongoing urinary problem. Good thing Elmo gave you "the talk" about a better diet for them ;) Again it sounds like there is some genetics going on there, although better food choices will help a lot with the FUS. Sometimes "sharing" is not such a good thing.

I remember when I brought my two home. My son was around 11 then and asked which one was my favourite. I just said BOTH. He never understoof that until about 9 years ago when he adopted two girlies. I asked him the same question once and he just laughed. :)
:);)
 
Hi Beth et al,

Just checking in quickly. Good to see Elmo back in safe numbers.

Hopefully he won't jump up too high for the PMPS.
I'd like to share a little of my experience with Caninsulin/Vetsulin here.

When Saoirse started getting low nadirs on this insulin when it came to dosing I put most weight on the NADIR BG and not the preshot BG. At that stage a small dose might produce a relatively moderate drop from a mid-range preshot BG level but it could potentially produce a very big drop down to similar low numbers from a high preshot BG. Here's an example from Saoirse's data:

20.07.14 - Dose 0.5IU Caninsulin. PMPS: 265 / +3 139 (nadir) - Difference between preshot and nadir: 136 points.

21.07.14 - Dose 0.5IU Caninsulin. AMPS: 407 / +3 155 (nadir) - Difference between preshot and nadir: 252 points.

Saoirse's feeding was very well regimented and her activity levels were pretty constant at the time so it is reasonable to deduce that the insulin was the main factor responsible for the drops observed. On the second cycle above the same dose lowered her BG by c. 120 points more than it had the previous cycle.

Looking at Elmo's data he has been uncomfortably low for a Vetsulin cat on the 0.5IU BID dose many times in recent days. (If it were my cat and I were using Vetsulin I would not like to see it going into double digits at nadir as measured on an Alphatrak; it's safer to have a decent buffer in case numbers take an unexpected dip, e.g the pancreas decides to sputter and produce a little more insulin of its own.) Today's numbers were dangerously low and it took a fair bit of intervention to get Elmo back into safe numbers again. Also I note that Elmo seems to metabolise the Vetsulin quickly; his data shows that the Vetsulin's work is well on the way by +2, and his insulin needs seem to be reducing.

I would give serious consideration to reducing the dose for safety reasons; today's reading of 41 (Alphatrak) was dangerously low so the 0.5IU dose is too high. Even if numbers drift up a little bit on the reduced dose I'd still be inclined to stick to the lower dose (for reasons given above). Also for safety, I suggest you get a +2 or +3 before bed test every evening to see where the cycle's heading overnight so that you'll know whether or not to monitor Elmo more closely for that cycle.


Mogs
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Your insights from your own personal experiences are invaluable!! :bighug: :bighug:
I had a fair number of brown trouser moments when Saoirse was on Caninsulin. :oops: It didn't help being a complete FD numpty at the time. I'm just so glad I was home testing (and to this day I'm still cheesed off at the vet who refused to give me any help with it).


Mogs
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Much of our best education comes from experience rather than "instruction" or "book learning". Instructions and books give you base guidelines but experience is what really counts because our cats don't read the manuals and every one is so individual.
 
Much of our best education comes from experience rather than "instruction" or "book learning". Instructions and books give you base guidelines but experience is what really counts because our cats don't read the manuals and every one is so individual.
This.

.
 
Much of our best education comes from experience rather than "instruction" or "book learning". Instructions and books give you base guidelines but experience is what really counts because our cats don't read the manuals and every one is so individual.
Amen and amen !!! My friend who is a vet but also trained as a holistic vet says our kitties are more than their numbers...it's also what we know, what we sense about them that is just as important .
 
OMG! I was not aware at all that you guys were dealing with hypo. Very well done everybody, Mogs, as usual is AMAZING!
I'm glad that Elmo is OK.
I just had hypo with Rocky and was not really prepared for it as he dropped on quite a small dose which I assumed was very safe - how wrong I was! We are learning all the time.
Best regards to everybody and congrats to Beth for catching and dealing so well with scary hypo!
Marlena
 
Better summary: +2 ..60..1t high carb........+2 1/4...50...3t high carb"......+2.5...50..3t hi carb........+2.75..41...syrup on gums and he licked a little......+3...61...1t high carb...........+31/4....71....1/2 t high carb.......next reading will be his usual nadir at +4........advise ?????
+4..91......+5....137......+7.....147
 
Those are actually decent numbers, especially with the AT2 pet meter. If Elmo is a nice kitty
cat.gif
he will just surf the blues nicely. It will be interesting where he is at PMPS. But regardless a reduction is in order, or who knows. If the numbers are too low you may have to come up with another plan ;)
 
OMG! I was not aware at all that you guys were dealing with hypo. Very well done everybody, Mogs, as usual is AMAZING!
I'm glad that Elmo is OK.
I just had hypo with Rocky and was not really prepared for it as he dropped on quite a small dose which I assumed was very safe - how wrong I was! We are learning all the time.
Best regards to everybody and congrats to Beth for catching and dealing so well with scary hypo!
Marlena
Thank u, Marlena....could not do it without all of you !!!:bighug:
 
So much wisdom here!

Pssst ... U100s ... 'nuff said. ;)
You are a hoot :joyful:.... I was actually trying to order some this a.m. When this hypo distraction occurred....did U tell me that U100 come in half unit markings??? Guy at ADW could not find them...or did I misunderstand you ( probable more than possible o_O) .......
 
Beth, here are the ones I use as do many other folks here. There may be other options at less cost (although these look pretty reasonable to me given what they cost here in Canada!:mad::blackeye:)
 
Glad Elmo is doing okay now, you did a great job dealing with the hypo! Just be extra-vigilant tonight after his evening shot, even with the reduction! :bighug:
 
Great job today Beth.....and the kitty cavalry!!

All these are U100 with half unit markings and are available from ADW online:
UtiCare
Monoject
Carepoint
Sure Comfort
BD Ultra-Fine

They're also available at WalMart if you have one near you..Their Relion Brand 3/10ml, 3o or 31 gauge, 8mm insulin syringes all come with half unit markings and are only $12.58 for a box of 100 (although it seems a lot of WalMart employees don't realize that they DO come with half unit markings!!)
 
Great job today Beth.....and the kitty cavalry!!

All these are U100 with half unit markings and are available from ADW online:
UtiCare
Monoject
Carepoint
Sure Comfort
BD Ultra-Fine

They're also available at WalMart if you have one near you..Their Relion Brand 3/10ml, 3o or 31 gauge, 8mm insulin syringes all come with half unit markings and are only $12.58 for a box of 100 (although it seems a lot of WalMart employees don't realize that they DO come with half unit markings!!)
Hey Chris !! Hope all is well up in Versailles !! Thank u for needle info...after a good night's sleep I will order tomorrow !
 
You are a hoot :joyful:.... I was actually trying to order some this a.m. When this hypo distraction occurred....did U tell me that U100 come in half unit markings??? Guy at ADW could not find them...or did I misunderstand you ( probable more than possible o_O) .......
Yes, you need half unit markings on them.
 
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