Help! Shoot without test?

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Michelle & Jetson

Michelle & Jetson

Member Since 2011
Hi,
I'm on a trip and hubby hasn't tried testing. Baby Jetson is due for shot @ 8a, 4u.
Do I tell him to give shot without test?
Thanks!
Michelle and Jetson
 
Hi and Welcome to LL.

  • If I am reading your previous posts, you are on 4u of Lantus?
    And you are both new to testing,
    And you have changed foods to low carb


My first inclination is to tell you to have hubby skip the dose if it is just this morning. Lantus is not dosed based on pre-shots, but on the nadirs. There just isn't enough information and the new diet could mean a big change in dose amount. I am sure you have already been told 4u is a huge amount to start on. We usuually recommend 1u as the starting point.

How long are you going to be gone?

Perhaps some others will be along to provide advice too.
 
Numbers so far:
8/29:
AMPS @ 7:45a 169
3u @ 8:12a

PMPS @ 7:21p 191
3u @ 8:20p

8/30:
AMPS @ 8:15a 171 but was taken after breakfast
3u @ 8:17a

Got call back from vet on food question - she was insisting on purina dm and I was insisting not. She said ok to my list.
Told her test numbers, she was skeptical I did them right, as am I. She said up to 4 based on tests and last week's curve
(lowest number was @ +4, 348 all others over 440) so...

PMPS @ 7:31p 210
Gave 3.5u @ 7:55p to not shock him with a big jump.

BG @ +3 was 166

AMPS @ 8:00a. 170 Again after breakfast
4u @ 8:05a

PMPS @ 8:01p. 208 After dinner
4u @ 8:10p
Click to expand...
http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=51264&p=551871#p551999


based on your four posts since joining the board and the numbers listed above, the dose should never have been increased to 4 units. jetson was throwing preshot numbers in the 100s on 3 units. we don't know how low he dropped on 3 units. lantus dosing is based on nadirs, not preshot numbers. doses should never be increased on the basis of a single curve.

since then he's had 1 dose of 3.5u and 2 doses of 4 units. because of the cumulative action of lantus, shooting even 3u could end up being too much insulin.

i'm sorry, but in the interest of jetson's safety, there's simply not enough data for any of us to recommend shooting any amount of insulin blindly this morning especially if he will not be monitored throughout the day. as soon as you get a chance, please read the starred posts marked "STICKY" near the top of this forum.

when will you be back home?

i'm sure we'll be able to help you sort things out once we have more information, but we need to talk...
 
Hi,
Just landed. Thanks for the advice. I'll only be gone today, back home around 10p. But that will be about 2hrs late for the PM shot. After reading posts here, I see 4u is very high - that's why I'm so nervous.
I've instructed hubby on hypo signs and where the sugary/high carb stuff is. But still I worry!

I'm off tomorrow and will try to get a proper curve.
So, skip shot this am?

Thanks!
Michelle and Jetson
 
michelle, skipping a single shot is not the end of the world. however, there's also circumstances such as a recent bout with ketones/DKA where we would not recommend skipping a shot. we have no history and limited data... makes it almost impossible to make any suggestions.

with little to go on, i would suggest skipping the shot this morning. if you won't be around tonight, dh will have to try testing jetson. here's a link to all sorts of tips and tricks (including videos) for hometesting: http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=287#p1665.
 
Yikes! Hubby gave shot before I called him back.
He will try to test in a bit.
I'll post results if he's successful.

Thanks again for the advice.
Michelle and Jetson
 
Welcome Michelle!

Jill always gives good recommendations. There are any number of cats that get 4.0u of Lantus or even more. However, the dose is systematically worked up so you're sure you've not missed what is a good dose and, more importantly, you know your cat isn't receiving more insulin than is necessary and thereby dropping numbers into an unsafe range.

When you have a change, please look over the sticky notes, as Jill recommended. We're happy to help you with dosing and how to best used Lantus. Here's an overview of what the notes contain:
  • Tight Regulation Protocol: This sticky contains the dosing protocol that we use here. There are also links to the more formal versions -- the Tilly Protocol developed by the counterpart of this group in Germany and the Queensland/Rand protocol developed by Jacqui Rand, DVM and published in one of the top vet journals.
  • New to the Group: Everything you wanted to know about this forum and more. Info on our slang, FAQs, links to sites on feline nutrition and to food charts containing carb counts, how to do a curve and the components to look for, important aspects of diabetes such as ketones, DKA, and neuropathy, and most important, info on hypoglycemia.
  • Handling Lantus: how to get the maximum use from your insulin and what to not do with it!
  • Lantus depot/shed: This is an important concept for understanding how Lantus works.
  • Lantus & Levemir: Shooting & Handling Low Numbers: What data you need in order to be able to work toward remission or tight regulation as well as information if you have a low pre-shot number or a drop into low numbers during the cycle.
 
Michelle & Jetson said:
Yikes! Hubby gave shot before I called him back.
He will try to test in a bit.
I'll post results if he's successful.

Thanks again for the advice.
Michelle and Jetson
Click to expand...
did he shoot 4 units?
 
and will dh be home today or is jetson alone all day long?



edited to add: michelle, i have to work and it appears you've left the board. please post for help if you need it. others will be around throughout the day. you can also post on the Health forum.
i'll catch up to you late tonight...
 
Sorry. Was no signal on phone.
Hubby gave 4u and will be home today.
Ugh! Worries!
Will post later with test results if he can get it.
Thanks
Michelle and Jetson
 
Michelle --

If your DH isn't able to test, it might be a good idea to feed small amounts of food every hour or two throughout the day. (About a teaspoon or so of food should be fine.) It's a way to keep your cat's blood sugar up just a bit if your husband can't get a test.
 
Hi Michelle, I'm glad you found us!

I'm looking at your numbers from the past few days, and if you won't be able to test at shot time tonight then my recommendation would be to skip this shot. I would drop the dose back to 3u or maybe 2.5 to keep Jetson safe, then spend the next few days collecting data on that dose. On the surface his numbers on 3u don't look bad, but we do need to find out how low the dose is taking him before we can really tell if that dose is ok or not. A few days on a consistent dose with some mid-cycle testing will tell us a lot. I don't think you should shoot 4u again tonight, though. Thoughts?
 
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