Hello from Minnie & Katharine! We need some advice!

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MinnieWinnie920

MinnieWinnie920

Member Since 2024
Hi my name is Katharine. My cat's name is Minnie.

Minnie is 6 years old. I have had her since she was a kitten and we have lived everywhere from MO>IN - graduate school>NE first job I could get in 2020>CO dream job until something opened at home>MO returned home! She has had a great life, minus some of my jobs taking me on long travels that I trusted someone who did not listen to me and over fed her a lot of dry food. I am mortified of dry food now after that being her primary diet food. She did not eat wet food as a kitten, but she does now. I have blamed myself for her diagnosis, and my lack of knowledge into the pet food world.

Minnie was diagnosed in Sept 2023. We did not start insulin until October. I followed blindly the prescription food, and insulin adjustments. It was a nightmare for me as I was transitioning jobs and was trusting a vet I realize now is younger than me and I am not even 30. He had us do in vet blood testing curves that always failed, then we tried the libre twice. I realize now he had no idea what he was doing, and was following dog advice. We now have a new vet though she is better, is not much more help outside pushing Hills pet food at me.

I have a degree in Animal Sciences, but specifically I am specialized in swine and beef that feline diabetes has been new to me; costing me to trust my veterinarian as the stuff I found online were very conflicting. I love livestock! But diabetes is not a concern in swine and cattle, so I feel so upset and have learned so much!

Well flash forward to early March 2024, and I began to discover the flaw in Minnie's veterinary care by this month (April 2024). I accidentally stumbled upon the Feline Diabetes Support Group, and joined it and began to feel so conflicted. I am shocked and have been very upset at myself for not doing a deeper research into this. I want to go back in time to last Sept 2023, and fight for my dear Minnie!

So I will be starting blood testing as I see the change in her switching to wet Fancy Feast. It is hard for me to get Tiki cat wet food, but I am working on it. She has more energy! I have purchased a meter this week, and will try the directions which I got from this site and the FB group.

Minnie is at 2 units of Lantus. I am on time to 15 min late on shots every 12 hours. She is well trained to get a shot from me. I now use wet food, do not constrict food until 2 hours before a meal. I use Miralax minimally to prevent constipation. I now check her litterbox 2x daily as we had a constipation scare in March 2024.

Is it too late to decrease her dosage from 2 units? I understand now that doses should not change every day, and that it should not be more than a 0.5 unit. Please help.

Kathairine and Minnie
 
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I have tried searching this site for a similar situation, but cannot find it. Help would be appreciated for my situation!
 
I'm new here as well, so unfortunately can't help much, but Chewy has Tiki wet cat food, and they're super convenient to deal with.
I was curious about the "constipation scare", as I saw something along those lines today and it freaked me out! Is this a concern with the meds or the diabetes, or...? I'll start Merlin on Miralax too if this is something that's routinely recommended. Can anyone add to this?
 
Hi and welcome to the forum Katherine and Minnie.
I am sorry you have had problems with your vet. This is a very common story here. Unfortunately a lot of vets are either not up to date with feline diabetes or they have a lot on their plate with everything else they need to know.
I do not recommend the Feline Diabetes Support Group fb page. We do not agree with some of their methods and ideas. But we do have a great fb page attached to this site which has been going for many years and is very reputable.
You will find this forum very knowledgeable and supportive which is supervised by 3 very knowledgeable moderators.

About the food…a low carb wet diet is what we recommend. 10% or under carbs. HERE is a food link for you to look at.
We recommend feeding a good meal before each insulin dose and then 2 or 3 low carb food snacks during the first half of all the cycles. If you are not at home for these, you might like to look at getting an automatic timed feeder, which many of us have and are invaluable.

About the insulin…we test before every dose, then feed and then give the dose of insulin. If the BG is not high enough, you can stall, dont feed and then test again in 20 minutes to see if the BG is rising. You can also post and ask for help, changing your subject like to reflect the issue.

About the dose…we have two dosing methods here which we commend you look at and choose one to follow. It will guide you as to whether you stay with the same dose, go up in dose or go down in dose. Here are the 2 DOSING METHODS FOR LANTUS
We normally recommend going up and down in 1/4 unit increments. And yes you can decrease the dose from 2 units IF the BG numbers are telling you to.

I would suggest you set up our spreadsheet and I will put the link below, and add a couple of weeks data so we can see it. We can only help you with dosing if we can see BG data. And we are very happy to help you with dosing and help you to learn how to do it yourself over time.
Also if you could set up your signature which is very easy to do, and this will appear in small type below all your posts so we can see all about Minnie. We look at the SS and the signature before giving dosing advice.

HELP US HELP YOU has the links to the SS and the signature plus other useful information for new members.

Can you tell me what type of glucose meter you bought?
I hope I’ve answered your questions, if not let me know. If you have any trouble setting up the SS let me know and I will get help for you.
Bron
 
Your Minnie’s journey sounds very similar to my Minnie’s. I believe this forum and the guidance I found here saved her life so you’re in the best hands and welcome :bighug::bighug::bighug:

Bron already gave you all the info I can think of but let us know if you have questions.

TR is not for everyone but it’s the method with the beta rate of remission and it’s how I got Bobo into remission last year.
 
Welcome to FDMB! Our frequent tag line is that this is the best place you never wanted to be.

I'd encourage you to keep reading! One good place to start are the sticky notes at the top of the Lantus/Levemir/Biosimilars board. There is a huge volume of information in the sticky notes and the links in the notes including to the original research by Rand & Roomp on tight regulation with Lantus. There is also an even larger amount of information on the Health Links page.

As for this site, FDMB has been around for over 25 years. FDMB was founded by an MD who wasn't thrilled with the information available for treating diabetic cats.The site has evolved as more and more research on feline diabetes became available. We do our best to stay current with new methods and the current science as well as what we learn from each other. The members here are very generous with their knowledge and their time. Many of us have been here for quite some time paying forward the help we received with our diabetic kitties. Like Bron, I'd direct you to the FDMB Facebook page if you want a resource on FB. I'm not a fan of the other FB feline diabetes sites for a variety of reasons the first of which is the quality of the information that they provide.

Please let us know how we can help.
 
Hello! Thank you so much for reaching out. After lots of patience I was able to get Minnies blood tested by myself. That took me about 3 days to get to this point! She was at 206 mg before a meal. I don’t know if I will get another one done tonight as I don’t want to push her as this is how I trained her for a shot very slowly.

I set up my signature. I hope it appears as I am on mobile. I will set up my spreadsheet tomorrow on my computer. I included my meter type in my signature (relion premier).

I apologize if I missed something else but I will work on the links you have provided on where to start.
 
20Merlin24 said:
I'm new here as well, so unfortunately can't help much, but Chewy has Tiki wet cat food, and they're super convenient to deal with.
I was curious about the "constipation scare", as I saw something along those lines today and it freaked me out! Is this a concern with the meds or the diabetes, or...? I'll start Merlin on Miralax too if this is something that's routinely recommended. Can anyone add to this?[/QUOTE

I am new to this group but I bet someone on this site can answer this. I don’t know if Merlin has a similar situation but from what I learned the hard way is watch their litter box activity. For my Minnie, my vet said it was a combination of an unknown illness(?) and her diabetes. The vet didn’t know after checking for obstruction. I have read up on constipation being an issue in diabetics and for cats they can get mega colon quickly.
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@MinnieWinnie920
Hi Katherine, I don't know if you set up your spreadsheet yet ,only asking because it says spreadsheet in your signature, if you did we can't see it ,the word spreadsheet would have to appear in blue
If you need help setting it up just ask we have a member here who would be happy to contact you and set it up
For now if you are still feeding any dry at all you will have to follow the SLGS protocol :cat:
How to Create a Spreadsheet

How to Use the Spreadsheet
 
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Hi Diane, I planned on getting it set up today but found out I am out of space on my Google drive. I will get that worked on tonight.
 
MinnieWinnie920 said:
Hi Diane, I planned on getting it set up today but found out I am out of space on my Google drive. I will get that worked on tonight.
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Hi Katherine no problem at all :cat:
Minnie sure is a cutie :cat:
For now can you add dry food also to your signature since you are feeding dry food during the day and night .You would have to follow SLGS method then, can you add SLGS to your signature when you get a chance
@MinnieWinnie920
 
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Thank you @Bron and Sheba (GA) @Diane Tyler's Mom and everyone else. I now have my spreadsheet going, and will be doing a couple weeks test. I added SLGS as my dosing protocol too. I understand the preshot is before the insulin. Is it necessary to BG test before a meal? What I am understanding is test before insulin, +1 +2 after insulin etc. ?
 
MinnieWinnie920 said:
Thank you @Bron and Sheba (GA) @Diane Tyler's Mom and everyone else. I now have my spreadsheet going, and will be doing a couple weeks test. I added SLGS as my dosing protocol too. I understand the preshot is before the insulin. Is it necessary to BG test before a meal? What I am understanding is test before insulin, +1 +2 after insulin etc. ?
Click to expand...
Hi Katherine
We cannot see your spredsheet
To set spreadsheet sharing permission:
* At the top right of the spreadsheet screen click on Share.

* In the pop-up dialog box click on the Get Link section.

* Change link access from 'Restricted' to 'Anyone with the link' and make sure that the permission on the right hand side is set to 'Viewer'.

* Click Done to save the changes.

You need to withhold feeding Minnie 2 hours prior to test him first thing in the morning which is called the AMPS (AM Pre Shot) because you don't want Minnie's BG number to be influenced by food . After that you can feed Minnie small snacks around 2 teaspoons of her Fancy Feast Pate
Lantus/Glargine usually doesn't kick in until +2.
So you can get a test @+2 and @+4 and @+6 .
You want to try and catch her nadir ( lowest point in the cycle)
Some members feed a small snack @+2 and @+4 .
You really don't want to feed @+6 because that will shorten the duration of the insulin. Of course if she is dropping too low then you would have to feed her to bring her BG up to safe numbers

Same goes for the night cycle withold feeding 2 hours prior to taking her PMPS test ( PM Pre Shot )

Mix up the testing times such as testing @+3 and @+5 or @+4 and @+6
The more tests the better so you can see how the insulin is working for her

On a human meter, 50 is your “take action” number meaning it's time to intervene with food to bring the BG up whether you need to feed low carb, med carb or high carb food
If there is a big drop on BG numbers you would need to feed and keep testing.

What dry food are you feeding ?

Do you have a hypo kit set up in case you need to bring her BG up
Med and High Carb food



Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers Gourmet Beef Feast in Gravy 20% High Carbs

Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers Gourmet Chicken Feast in Gravy 15% Med Carbs

Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers Turkey Feast in Gravy 15% Med Carbs

Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers Chicken and Beef in Gravy 15% Med Carbs

Good idea to mark the cans with magic marker how many carbs

Or any on the food chart. Doesn't have to be Fancy Feast just an example about the med and high carb foods



https://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/dr-pierson-new-food-

10% and under is low carb
11% -15 is medium carbs.

16- 24 is high carb.

Do you have the U-100 syringes with the half unit markings, we increase or decrease the dose by 0.25 units at a time. These syringes make it easier to do that

https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/lantus-levemir-biosimilars-isg-slang-dictionary.1903/ and there is also a link there for FDMB Glossary
 
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