Hank Condo Rental- PMBG 100- Day after Dental UPDATE

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bettyandhank

Member Since 2010
Yesterday: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=105543


Hank is finally seeming a bit better..though It has not been that way. Rough stretch since we got home. But thank so much for all your support, wisdom, advice. It helped so much. We were both exhausted and as suggested when I went to lay down nearby, he finally began to relax a little around 10PM...still loopy, droopy eyes, but at least finally laid down on his side and stretched out. Last night his bupe was 7:30PM. Woke me around 6:15 AM walking around..was hungry, tried eating but did that same frustrated vocalization..ate a small few bites but not much. His poor little jaw/chin was swollen and bruised looking like he'd been punched. Where his canine was removed it is just kind of droopy, his little pouch and everything hanging a little. You can see a peek of the inner (lip?- the pink inside part) rolled back a bit there. His eyes still didn't look normal. I wasn't sure what to do about the Bupe. I only have enough for once every 12 hours as instructed. But we were up early and I wondered if I shouldn't dose a little early so to be able to give 3 doses 8 hours apart today instead based on yesterday. But ended up doing it at 8AM to stick with the BID instructions. He was somewhat better but could tell he was still having a hard time. Mostly he was just sleeping, but was fussy and did not want to be touched, and wanted me nowhere near his mouth. I do think he hurt but also just seemed to be agitated. So he slept in the baby scale and barely moved. I got a call from vet office late morning, told the about last night and that he had a rough time of it. He was somewhat better but still not himself. So vet has said to dose every 12 hours but thought about giving bupe 3 times today to try and stay in front of the pain...but if so, would run out before the 3 post op days were up. Also with him not wanting me near his mouth, dreaded dealing with the AB tonight. The vet had said to resume for 2 more days after giving reprieve last night assuming his mouth would be too sore and not to bother it. And it was still the case. I think they thought he would be better today than he was. So I am realizing this will be miserable for both of us and is it absolutely necessary. We had been on ABs for 12 days pre-procedure. There were some other questions but said she would check with vet on these 2 things and email me back. Well mid day came and I heard nothing. Hank had basically not moved from the baby scale except a time or two for some bites of food. So i punted and gave him a bupe dose about 4:25PM. This would have been 8 hours, 25 minutes from the previous dose. I knew it was safe. Just tricky to figure out a 3rd dose in the wee hours of the morning, and/or running out if he still needs if past Saturday morning (an unknown)

SO i dosed him then got busy doing things, realized the vet office was about to close and still hadn't heard back from them. At that point I email the vet directly but follow up with call to the clinic. The unfriendly receptionist answers and so I ask for the other one who I'd spoken to this morning about all this and was informed she is on her way out the door, vet has already left for day. She will tell her what I said. So I get an email after the fact from first receptionist -He wants you to give bupe 12 hours apart and give the clindamycin tonight and tomorrow night. IT WASN'T THAT I DIDN'T UNDERSTAND THE INSTRUCTIONS! :YMSIGH: its that he wasn't doing well as they thought, things had changed..what to adjust or do t factor for that? By then I had punted already, and now I hadn't minded the vet. I followed up my first email to the vet to say unfortunately the communication had not come in time so I punted and it was done already.
I go downstairs to check on Hank around 7PM and he is up and around, more alert, suddenly seeming more himself!.. Not 100% but a turn for the better, eyes look clearer. Ate a little dinner -but so FINICKY...had to offer 3 different things. still eating small amounts. After this he came to sit with me on the bed.. was purry, more lovey. cat_pet_icon Then came the dreaded clindamycin. There went the love session. I hated having to give it. I know he is so so sore..but thankfully we got it done.
Before I was giving probiotic several hours ahead of the AB since I was giving AB so late at night. Tonight will be a few hours after. Whatever we gave/did was not helping much at all. His GI issues were horrid and he was miserable. Sienne recommended RenewLife but since it has to be split in doses will probably have to do either pearls or Fortiflora tonight. Should I do both or is that too much?
Only one more AB dose to go. What to do tonight?

Also, what to do about the Bupe for tonight? He really did seem to suddenly start coming around. I am not sure if due to the bupe- he was 3 hours in at that point, or what. I don't think that that he's back this is all over..he had a big procedure and took a toll on him. I am sure he is still hurting and has some adapting to do. will need some time yet to be back to normal.
SO what should I do about the Bupe for tonight? 12 hours later would be 4:30 AM. Sure don't want to be on THAT 12 hour schedule.
I gave the one +8.5 hours today because he seemed to be in pain. And I think it was the correct decision. I couldn't make him wait 4 more hours.
He was better and I may not need to do the next one at 8 hours.
But if I don't want to do a 4:30 schedule (I don't). ..should I wait past that and make him go longer than 12 hours? 7AM would be + 14.5.
I am really not a morning person. Our shot schedule had been closer to 10/10. We have gotten off schedule with this the last couple days.
They gave his bupe at 8AM yesterday, so wanted me to give it last night at that time. He was doing terribly so I'd given it 1/2 hour early.

Lastly (i have been writing this so long I forgot what I came up to say...lol.
I tested him and he was 100! I know I know this is in range, But this is high for him. I have only tested 2 blues in 2 years+...might have been others I didn't catch. He had eaten within an hour, and this was maybe 20 minutes after I had to put that nasty evil AB down his very sore mouth..so could be food or stress spikey. I will check again in a few days ..but nailbite_smile
Also this was my contour next meter which is not the main one we used..but the only one I have current strips for. Most our SS number are using another meter.

This is all ridiculously wordy- Still out of it and not enough sleep yet around here.

Gotta figure out when to give next bupe dose, do right by him, still get some sleep, and try to get back on a better schedule...and not run out.


OK wise ones...


thanks again for all the love and support- and smartness
 
Re: Hank- Condo Rental- Day after Dental UPDATE- PMBG 100

...an update to my update. So I was up here typing thinking he is now coming around and for advice with what to do about our bupe dosing schedule dilemma. Go back down to check on him and not so much anymore. He had been more alert and himself earlier..purry, all those things I said. He was at the door to bedroom, kind of vacant. would not come across threshold. I wanted him to eat so I could get Fortiflora down him. He hid somewhere, then came out but would not leave that room..I had to bring it to the bedroom. Would only eat (well practically drink with all the water in it) a little bit. SO I was not able to get a full dose of probiotic. Seemed spacy again. He looks strange..I don't know how to explain it. Is this just how he looks now without a bunch of teeth? His face is different..has this droop I mentioned.maybe he is just still swollen and that will settle.
When we got back yesterday I brought him in his carrier into my bedroom, and the carrier is still there on the floor. All that has ever been to him is the thing you go to cars and bad places in. Until 2 weeks ago when we went for the pre-exam/bloodwork, he had not left the house in over 3 years. So tonite after I came up to report he was finally turning a corner, and then go back to feed him, etc..he disappears again. And yes, is hiding in the carrier. Right by my bed on the floor. He stayed in there for 1/2 hour. then got on bed half meatloaf in a ball with front paws curled under and his face down. My poor boy. I may have spoken to soon.

I want to do all the right things. Now I really don't know what to do about the bupe. I did not want to get up at 4Am..but can he make it longer?
that is just not a functional 12 hour schedule. Giving this mid day dose today has us screwed up...
i am fading fast. I either have to give it again in 1/2 hour..meaning 8 hours from last dose (and before I collapse) or wait and if I wait i think it will be closer to +14 or so.



:(
 
Re: Hank- Condo Rental- Day after Dental UPDATE- PMBG 100

I'm glad Hank perked up a little today. He has been thru a lot.
Each day will hopefully have him feeling a little better.



I know that with bupe, the higher the dose, the longer it lasts vs. providing more pain relief. I've read that you can give a lesser dose more frequently.

You are the one with him, so you are the best judge of how much pain he is in.

I know you hate opening a bunch of cans for naught, but I'd continue hunting for one he'll eat. Eating will help him heal. Hopefully his appy will catch up
in the next day or so.
 
Re: Hank- Condo Rental- Day after Dental UPDATE- PMBG 100

Well you posted more, after I posted.
They do change a bit in appearance. In your case it should really be only the one side, not both. A little swelling is normal, but it shouldn't be a lot.
Meatloafing is definitely a sign of pain.

Tomorrow is Friday. Do you know another vet to consult tomorrow?
I would have thought your vet would have at least gotten back to you since he's doing a little worse than they were expecting.
 
Re: Hank- Condo Rental- Day after Dental UPDATE- PMBG 100

he had since emailed while I was typing the first post but I hadn't realized until coming to check the second. Said he told deb (client service person) to get back to me. She had, but it was after they closed and I had emailed him already having not heard back from anyone. Said she had begun email to me earlier but had been so busy she could never finish. Doesn't matter anyway..bottom line is there was no communication in time for that decision so I made it.
His response was that bupe last 12 hours..you don't need to give it sooner but he does not think if i gave at 8 hours it will be a problem..
and basically not to worry we will be ok. He also said if we need more bupe we could get it. The stuff costs like gold. .
And said that he works 12 hour days and often doesn't check his email after leaving. I really did not mean to bother him after hours. It was 5:40 or so when I realized they would be closing soon and no one had gotten back. He just didn't read it until 9 something. Crossed communication.

And no, we were vetless for 3+ years...no one to call. He is nice. Just fragmented there with the different players

well I am crashing. Have no idea what to do.
this is our first time using bupe...

this would mean 4 more 4:30's..2 of which are AMs..
unless some wise and less sleepy person can tell me what else to do
 
Re: Hank- Condo Rental- Day after Dental UPDATE- PMBG 100

Hi Betty, so sorry Hank is having a rough time of it and also you with trying to get thru the Vet. I remember a few times when I used Bupe, it made my kitties loopy, but it sure was effective for the pain. Sending Hank healing vines and prayers.
If you click on the ? icon in the subject line and add "Questions" in the subject line, it will help the experts see you need some help.
I hope Hank is feeling better today.
 
Re: Hank- Condo Rental- Day after Dental UPDATE- PMBG 100

I gave J.D. Bupe at 6:00am 2:00pm and 10:00pm both recently when he had a bout of pancreatitis, and when he had his dental in January. I would think if he seems to be in pain, maybe you could give 2/3 of the dose 3 times a day.
Sending feel better today vines to Hank.
 
Re: Hank- Condo Rental- Day after Dental UPDATE- PMBG 100

Healing /feel better vines to Hank. Less stress vines for you!

Jane
 
Re: Hank- Condo Rental- Day after Dental UPDATE- PMBG 100

Bupe can be dosed every 8 - 12 hours. Your vet likes to prescribe it every 12 hours. My advice -- give Hank what he needs and get more bupe. Sometimes, I swear vets think we're going to sell the stuff to addicts! It is a narcotic and it's probably why Hank seems spacey. (As an aside, Gabby had a dental and was getting bupe afterward. She will not allow anyone except me to pick her up. She was so spaced, a friend of mine picked her up and was carrying her around. No reaction. A few days later when she was feeling better and I'd stopped the bupe, he tried the same thing. Gabby was not amused. He will never try that again!)

Have you tried feeding Hank baby food? (Gerber or Beechnut Stage 2 -- just meat and broth, no veggies)

There is a slight change in appearance when a kitty loses his canine teeth.
 
Re: Hank- Condo Rental- Day after Dental UPDATE- PMBG 100

OMG- who entered my body and wrote all that? I was half awake on fumes and barely remember.

Giving the extra dose yesterday really threw the schedule out of whack. If I had known we could have timed it better. I just knew looking at him late day day I could not make him wait another 4 hours. So after it appeared things were on the up and up, and he seemed more himself I wasn't sure what to do about dosing. Then he went other way again and of course it was the wee hours and I was having to try to figure it all out- I needed toothpicks for my eyeballs. He was trying to sleep but meatloafed. Civvie has been really restless with everything going on, and unusually vocal. Also think he feels neglected. Hank has now retreated to the carrier for 1/2 hour. I separate civvie and set alarm planning to get up to dose him in another hour, but was crashing so hard and worried i might not wake up or be functional. I had to wake him to give him his bupe dose a couple hours early around 2:20AM..what a terrible 12/12 to be on. He was not happy. This morning at dawn I hear them up and around. Elvis is screaming for (who knows what) for extended period. Then suddenly growling and discord between them. Not normal- they love each other. I had to get up to separate again- put Elvis in garage. Offered hank food and back to bed! Woke up late and Hank was sweet, seemed comfortable...purred and let me rub his belly. He ate some breffis...better this time. The Hank then retreated back to the carrier- strangely his new favorite spot..where he slept for nearly 4 hours. I had to wake him and take the lid off to get him out to give his next bupe dose.
Vet office called and we are going to pick up a few more doses to have if we need it. The schedule is now so messed up.
So Hank did leave the carrier and resumed his sleep on the cat tree perch by the window.
I do think he's better. But definitely agree some of what ya'll said may be going on aside from just pain (which I also think is going on) To anthropomorphize...I think he is: frustrated, agitated, sore, depressed, confused, mad. He makes a frustrated sound when he swirls his tongue to try to groom, swallow, eat, etc.. It does seem to agitate him or make him mad...not just hurt. But I know he will adjust and be ok.
I had not planned on Elvis being upset , but think he is...i hope they can get back in sync soon.
Got a pearls down him since he is not eating enough reliably to rely on Fortiflora. I wrapped it in cheese. He has a difficult time taking it into his mouth- he just kept licking around it. I think this may be part of what the canine does..is helps scoop it up. It also didn't help that this took place form a lying down position cause he would not get up. lol.
Oh, and Sienne reminded me I had bought a jar of gerber baby food. I forgot all about it. it was a hit! He ate 1/2 jar so I will go get another.

Hopefully we are on the upside from here. He just seems to need a little extra time more than expected. They also had to cut his gums and other things, aside from the extractions, so I guess I would probably feel the same way.

BTW, they are charging $20 for 4 more bupe syringes. (giving me a break) Because these have been prescribed incrementally, we have just picked them up and been charged x each time. It was substantially more for each syringe the other times. I discovered I could have had an entire bottle compounded for a fraction of these amounts. But at this point assuming these last doses will be all we need, It is sort of too late. They make a small fortune marking this stuff up apparently. What are your vets charging for this?
I considered even today getting the bottle ...(which they say has a 1 month or so shelf life- so whatever we didn't need would go to waste) thinking I could sell the rest on Craigslist :lol:

Off to the grocery store. Maybe I will get lucky and they will be wine tasting! I can have my Friday thimble-full. Doesn't take much for me!

thanks again for all the great advice
 
Re: Hank- Condo Rental- Day after Dental UPDATE- PMBG 100

I would get a few jars of baby food. He might like it warmed to mouse temperature, too. My J.D. does.

I think I paid $20 for 2ml in a plastic bottle that seemed to evaporate, and $42 for 6.5ml in a glass vial with a stopper.

Sending healing vines and eating your baby food vines to Hank. I'm sure it is hard to get used to his scooping teeth being missing. I know J.D. only lost one canine and tends to eat differently with that one missing.
 
Re: Hank- Condo Rental- Day after Dental UPDATE- PMBG 100

I like that.
Scooping teeth. :-D ... that's what they were .....definitely.
Mine was never one to eat with her tongue, at least she wasn't one to stick it out of her mouth....
It was hard without all 4 scooping teeth.
Hopefully Hank will just learn to scoop with his good side.
 
Re: Hank- Condo Rental- Day after Dental UPDATE- PMBG 100

Dyana are you saying you paid $20 and $42.50 for bupe at vet office or compounding pharmacy?

If vet we are getting ripped off. They charged $73 and change for the first 8 doses. $140 for 22 doses. Now $20 for 4 more doses.
I just did not think on my feet. I got the Ab compounded because we wanted the fish flavor.
But I didn't think to ask for RX for the bupe...and they sure didn't offer. It just ends up on the tab.

On baby food do you put leftovers in fridge or leave it out?

Hank was still on perch when I got back from the store. He has been sleeping all day. Only changed locations twice.
I just gave the LAST dose of the evil AB, YAY!! SO happy that is out of the way.

After that, he retreated back into the carrier. It is so strange that being his new spot. He started way in the back,just like when they are at vet and scared.
He then laid down sort of meatloaf, but not as tight as last night.

I guess I shouldn't worry yet..but at 2.5 days I had hoped he'd be feeling better by now.
 
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