Grayson 3/13; Question for those w/ ketone experience

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Grayson & Lu

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An okay day, actually, pretty uneventful... although it seems we're going back to the flats. Time to cut him off - no more trips to IHOP!

AMPS 356 Shot 3.4u
+3.5 317
+4.5 330
+9.75 364

Question for those w/ ketone experience...

Did you keep your kitty at the same (increased) amt of insulin?
Did you gradually back it down some?
How long before the ketones in the urine clear? (I'm still giving him 100 mL SubQs once a day.
How long did you continue the fluids?

Thanks in advance!

Lu-Ann
 
sorry I have no input on Ketones,
but I wanted to tell you that you are doing an awesome job with Grayson!!
Hang in there... :mrgreen:
 
I never did (or the vet didn't option) the sub-q fluids, so I don't know about that.

Sneakers has had ketones since 1-30 when I bought the sticks and meter. But it was probably because I had dropped her insulin from 3u to 1u and it kind of freaked out her insides, apparently. I have slowly raised the insulin looking for her 'dose' and have only just now, for the two cycles- not seen any trace amount on the sticks. I haven't had a chance to drop down- time wise or number-wise.

You are doing a good job- don't know if Sneakers would sit still for sub-q fluids- even at feeding time :lol: . She doesn't even like me to test or give her shot while she's eating.
 
Fortunately, Grayson IS distracted by the food, and only sometimes wiggles. Without food, I've held him in my lap between me & the table. He seems okay with head & chin scratches most of the time

The other thing I used to do was to roll a beach towel out. He got tested on that, and if need be, wrapped it over him & used my stomach to keep it taut against the table. Not too much wiggling then.

In extreme cases, there's always the option of a straight jacket... or duct tape! :lol:
 
Okay, I know you and like you so I am going to just be blunt! :lol:

Why are you wanting to drop the insulin dose? Why is that a concern? Your numbers do not indicate an reduction in insulin is needed. If anything they appear, to me, that you need more! One of the biggest mistakes that I made when I started this dance, was trying to keep Kitty at as little of dose of insulin as possible. Because, everyone else was dosing 3 units or less, I thought that if Kitty needed more than that......it must be a sin???!!! So, I ask once more...why are you concerned with reducing the dose? You reduce doses when the nadirs are too low-- that is not happening!

Maybe I am wrong, but I see nothing in Grayson's numbers that support that he needs less. The curves are flat, not inverse and when they do curve-- the curve is very shallow. It reminds me of Kitty's early curves...flat and pink!

I do admit that his numbers looked better on 2.2--but, on that dose the curve indicates that he needs more...and you have stepped him up slowly. Maybe I am wrong, but I just don't think he needs less!

Also, Grayson had ketones on the lower doses...now he has few to none. If for no other reason, that would be enough to make me NOT want to lower the dose. Remember, one of the key factors in the develpment of ketones is too little or insufficent insulin--and in my opinion (which means nothing!) it is the first and main component in ketone development.

Now to the other questions!

Once you are comfortable that the ketones are gone, I would start reducing the fluids and test for ketones vigilantly. If you see the ketones come back--start back giving the fluids more frequently. I think it is a test and see thing-- slowly reduce and see what happens. I did give them to Kitty every other day at one time, reduced to twice a week, then once a week, and then stopped.

Are you still concerned with lowering the dose?!!! :lol:

Good Luck! You are doing Great!
 
I agree with everything Kim has said, it is too early to think about reducing, especially in light of the ketones. I think I said in an earlier post that my biggest mistake in the beginning was trying to get Payne's dose as low as possible, not give her what she needs! I believe all the DKA's were because of too little insulin.

We are an extreme case going into DKA so often but each time we did I had dropped her dose down, saw ketones and DIDN'T raise the dose ..... fell off that cliff! It is extremely important now not to give too little insulin. I believe ketones are very different with each kitty. In Payne they would cycle and we could go from trace to large in 12 hours and then back again.

As long as you don't see ketones I would do 100ml SQ fluids every other day for awhile. If you see them I prefer 50ml 2x a day. And I would continue SQ for awhile and need to be ketone free for a time before you stop. I have been ultra cautious with Payne and just stopped SQ fluids last month after 10 months of no ketones.

And I also agree you might need to raise dose just a tad but you are doing great!
Nancy .....
 
Thank you all for your input. Lately it seems like most of PZI has been in the hypo mode... not many people that have had the ketones. Good for the kitties, but not as good for those of us that are looking for some direction. Fortunately I've got some of the most experienced eyes & voices watching over me! Thank you all!

Not only do we get good advice for our kitties here, but we also get a whole team of cheerleaders and arms to hold us up! What a great place to be!
 
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