Fuji.......new pictures

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LynnLee + Mousie

LynnLee + Mousie

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background: i recently discovered 2 kittens living in our trees in the backyard. i've been feeding them, etc...

over the weekend we noticed the littlest one was breathing funny.

caught it last night and took it to vet this morning.

vet update: enlarged heart. some fluid. reeeeeal bad heart murmur. slightly constipated. kidneys questionable (urine real light and not real concentrated). lungs are clear at this time.

i have to make a decision and i think it's already made really but need confirmation.

help?
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten

I think with the heart problems you know what the answer is. no professional opinion here but I would think with this many problems so young even on medications I do not think it would have a long happy life
sorry
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten

that's what i'm thinking dian.

she did agree with me he's not real adoptable in this condition and probably wouldn't live a long life
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten

I am so sorry cindy. sometimes life is so unfair. thank you for taking care of this little one
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten

for now i'm reminding myself that at least he's not out in the wild dying a slow death. it's awful i might have to do this but at least he will go peacefully and without pain
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten

What has the vet recommended? Could the heart problem be related to some sort of infection, treatable with abs?

Young kitten, medical intervention by you, probably future household cat.

My thought would be to provide medical care and see what how kitten responds.

Thank you for caring and good luck, whatever the decision.

Lisa & Spooky(GA)

P.S. Seventeen years ago this July, I found a very young kitten in the middle of downtown S.A. on I-10. Cuts, knocked out teeth, prolapsed rectum, ringworm, brain swelling from some injury. Vet recommended PTS. My husband (of all people!) said treatment to see what happened. Frankie is now my senior kitty, hyperthyroid, arthritic, heart murmer, but still going strong.
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten

Without pain and suffering, that is probably best. It's sad, but if there's no real option other than to let him suffer, what can you do other than release him to the bridge. What about the other one, should that kitten be checked out?
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten

i'm already thinking about that actually jen. when i call the vet back i'm gonna ask her about the other one. that one is real skittish so i hope i can catch it.
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten

Oh Cindy, I feel for you. It is so hard to see them suffer so young.

A real bad heart murmur that young does not sound good. My rescue rushed one to an emergency clinic recently whose time had come. We had been fostering her with meds even though we knew she didn't have much time. She played and purred and was loved till her time came - about 4 months.

But, Cindy, you will be kind to her, I know even though it breaks your heart.

Hugs Cindy,

Claudia
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten

(((Cindy)))) Such a tough position to be in. Peaceful and painfree is a gift given the circumstances. :YMHUG:
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten

I wouldn't rush the decision to PTS. I had one with a heart murmur who lived for 10 years. He was happy and loved being part of our home and he passed peacefully in his sleep. Why not opt for treatment, give it some time and see how it goes?

Patricia (GAs Fluffy, Mr QT, Murphy, Jonathan, Flannel, Speedy, Angel, Rusty, Bobby, Ash & Moseley) Cory, Zak, Suzy, Corky, Oreo, Rufus & Kobe
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten

the problem is i can't take him in myself and what are the chances that a shelter or rescue group would take him?
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten

(((Cindy))) I agree - peaceful, painless and provided by the only people your little tree dweller knows and can count on. It is very sad but it sounds like the very best that you can do for him.
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten

Dear Cindy, My heart goes out to you. Treating for heart disease in an older cat is difficult. A young kitten could be trained that all the meds are a normal life. BUT If you cant keep him. What kind of life would he have in a shelter??? With just a "chance" of finding the right home???

Again my heart goes out to you because I KNOW how much you love them all.

Jeanne
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten

(((Cindy))) please don't do this to yourself - if you decide to let him go you don't need to "prove" anything to us. Your little tree dweller couldn't possibly be in better hands.
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten

(((Cindy))) I have had to make the tough decisions on strays myself. It is NEVER easy, but I agree with your gut that this little baby is beyond saving.. To have so many problems so young, he is very unlikely to ever have a quality life...
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten

Cindy...

I am so sorry, but I think the kindest thing to do would be to let him go and not suffer. I don't think a rescue or shelter would give him the care he needs. You are an amazing care giver and I know that you will make the right decision. It is about quality of life.... Sending prayers your way. Hugs!
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten--UPDATE at bottom

ok, update: called vet with a couple questions and got some new info......no fluid in belly, FULL of poop though. she's concerned that he is eating but nothing's coming out the other end.

USG is good! yeahhhhh

he's pink so that's good she said. his capillary refill(?) is 1 second and she said that's good

oh, and it's definitely a boy. he's 2.5lbs

fiance is wobbling big big time. you would be surprised at how big. i have to admit it's a bit frustrating as i was ready to make the call and then he starts in with all his questions, etc.....

sooooooo, we're going to let them clean all that poop out of the little guy, do some bloodwork, and we'll do some talking tonight, and see how he is tomorrow.
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten--UPDATE at bottom

well, in that case, the boy ought to have his chance at life. does not sound as dire as you first posted. hang tough little guy
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten--UPDATE at bottom

i hate this. i hate this. i hate this.

i mean here i am ready to make the decision.

then fiance starts asking questions.

i ask the vet the questions.

and while she did say it doesn't mean things are that good for him, it's not a decision we have to make within hours. she's really concerned though that no matter what someone's heart is going to be hurt, whether now or later is the question and that it most likely will be mine since it would be hard to find him another home. but to be honest, that's part of owning a pet and while yes, it hurts like hell, i know i have to go thru it as well as anyone who chooses to have a pet.

we talked about the strain on his heart later when he does start growing and the bigger he gets the more strain there will be and at the same time she's telling me she knows it's a hard thing to have to think about what with "his cute face looking at me right now" she said.

so basically i'm at his kidneys are good apparently (pro), he's not pooping for some reason (con) and the biggest factor is the heart (con)......so, once away from work and customers and delivery people, etc....i guess fiance & i will talk about it some more
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten--UPDATE at bottom

Oh, goodness, I should not have looked at those videos, that kitty is so precious! What a face he's got eh. I can see how your are being pulled into several different directions, Cindy and I don't envy you one bit. It's a very hard decision, but whichever one you make, will be one made with your heart. Whatever you decide, We are all her to support you.
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten--UPDATE at bottom

I'm sorry to hear this Cindy. I wonder if my post is too late to be helpful.

Is the fluid in the chest? Or she wasn't sure if there was fluid at all? Is the kitten still breathing abnormally? If the cat is dehydrated, that might be why she's constipated. The last foundling I had was backed up quite a bit, and that can happen to cats who are outside and lack clean water to drink. Regarding the heart murmur, loud murmurs (have the vet tell you the "grade" -- I'm thinking more than 3 on a scale of 6) are usually associated with bad disease. There are exceptions to this, but in a very young kitten I'm thinking of congential (born-with) disease. She'll need to see a cardiologist, no question. Do you want to email me the radiographs tonight or tomorrow morning, if they are digital, if it will help? I will send you my work email addy.

I can't tell you that she's a sure goner, but I can tell you that if her heart murmur is severe, her heart is already enlarged, and her breathing is labored, the chances are very high that she has congenital heart disease and that it is going to significantly shorten her lifespan. For sure she'll need a cardiologist and perhaps medication. There is about zero chance that any well-informed rescue group will agree to undertake this expense and effort in a kitten with no prospects of a future home. It's very sad and I hope I'm not being too blunt.

Having trouble breathing is a form of suffering. For sure, I think that in cats who are in heart failure and can be treated, the suffering can be withstood while the cat is stabilized, but in a kitten who was dealt a bad hand (heart?) from the getgo, you may be looking at a suffering without a meaningful recovery. It is NOT wrong to euthanize a kitty whose body is not supporting normal life, esp if there is no hope of a cure. (There are no surgical cardiac interventions for cats right now.) You can let her go, and wish her godspeed back here, if she wishes, in a body that will let her play and eat and be as happy as she deserves.

PS I agree, have the vet listen to the other one's chest for a heart murmur.
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten--UPDATE at bottom

Latest Update: I love my vet. :) Just because she cares so much. She called to give me an end of day update and then we discussed insulins, economy, business ownership, etc....:)

anyhow, they wormed T.D. (which I'm gonna steal that name because I like it), did whatever they had to do to empty his colon and it worked. he also subsequently pee'd at that point. they examined the feces and found no parasites at this time.

she said his breathing is still fast but suspects some of it may be due to the anxiety of being there and being handled. she said they'll check his respiration rate early in the morning. he's not open mouth breathing or anything like that

she said he's been a real good cooperative boy but that could be because he hasn't the strength to fight them but i saw him playing with the other kitty saturday and he still had some strength to play at that point. :)

so for now we're keeping on i guess and she'll call me in the morning with an update

Jess, the latest check had no fluid at all, just poop backup so that's good. and she did say they did some sub-q's so that could be dehydration. i'll ask about the grade on the heart murmur in the morning. and thank you for replying. i'm going to make fiance read this whole post tonight and it will help to have this information.
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten--UPDATE at bottom

I'm glad to hear things are looking more stable. Do you know if your vet has digital x=rays?

Cindy + Mousie said:
Jess, the latest check had no fluid at all, just poop backup so that's good. and she did say they did some sub-q's so that could be dehydration.
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Um, well that could send him sailing into congestive heart failure, if he's right on the edge of it, or rapidly make things worse if he's in CHF, so I guess we'll know soon enough :roll: Slight exasperation on my part because I have seen this a lot, a vet worries about the heart but gives SQ fluids (adding to the heart's burden) anyway ... Oh well, we'll see.
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten--UPDATE at bottom

i wondered about that as i was typing it actually.

maybe they didn't do too many, just enough to get some excretions out of him. for instance, she said they did a 1/2 enema and she explained that she was calling it that because of his size he didn't need or take as much as a "regular" cat would need or take???

you're giving me some really good info for sure and i'm jotting down my questions for in the morning
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten--UPDATE at bottom

gosh i feel for you, cindy. those kittens are total cuties too.
my first question would be whether the heart is enlarged for another reason not to do with heart disease and if whatever he has can be fixed will heart likely be normal (i mean, could it be enlarged because of constipation)? murmurs i hear of all the time from stress or from being sick, and they go away when cat is better.
guess i'd be relying on the experts but this is not your kitten yet so the expense has to be an important factor. it's one thing if you figure the money will fix him. but if all it does is buy him time i wouldn't do it.
wishing you luck and hoping this is just an "incident" and kitten will get better right away.
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten--UPDATE 4/27/10 pm

we brought him home for now as it seems fiance is wavering on what to do. i was ready to make the call yesterday and then got some more info and fiance started asking questions and he wanted one last picture of him blah blah blah so we let the vet clean him out (full of poop) and do some bloodwork and stuff.

today things look somewhat better as far as coronavirus was negative, usg was 1.032 so kidneys are ok, etc.....only concern is really the heart.

vet said we didn't have to make an immediate decision so we brought him home for now.

next step is ultrasound and she recommends just going straight to cardio for that soooooooooooo that's where we are.

he was 2.5lbs yesterday before enema and 2.07lbs after :) wow! his testicles haven't descended and conclusion is the little boy has been dealt a bad hand. now we have to decide if we want to find out how bad a hand it is i guess.

and fiance has named the little guy.................Fuji
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten--UPDATE 4/27/10 pm

Agree with going to a cardiologist......at least to find out just how good/bad it is........love the name and those two are so darn cute. Is he back with his sibling?
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten--UPDATE 4/27/10 pm

no. the other one was here this morning but as soon as it would spot me it would scurry back into the trees.

i'm thinking what i'll do is go rent the trap from the shelter again this weekend and see if i can catch him that way. i would think surely i can. these little guys value their food that's for sure. the vet commented several times about Fuji having a really good appetite, eating everything they gave him, even raw. :)
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten--UPDATE 4/27/10 pm

Cindy + Mousie said:
he was 2.5lbs yesterday before enema and 2.07lbs after :) wow! his testicles haven't descended and conclusion is the little boy has been dealt a bad hand. now we have to decide if we want to find out how bad a hand it is i guess.
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They may still descend ...

I forget where you are in CA exactly. Are you near LA-ish? I know that Phil took Lionel to Dr. Yuhas here http://www.advancedveterinarycarecenter ... asp?tid=19 and had nothing but great things to say about her. She's a third-year resident. A coworker of mine knows Dr. Russell, another cardio there, and says he's brilliant. If you want to PM me your location or tell me what cardiologists you're near, I can tell you if I've heard of any of them. Glad to hear the little guy is going to get thoroughly checked out. Is he breathing normally?
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten--UPDATE 4/27/10 pm

Patticass & Tyler (GA) said:
Is he still breathing really hard and fast?
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yeah his breathing is still rapid. it's gotten a little better from first exam yesterday to today's exam. and she still says some of it is from being scared. she said he was fine in the cage there, just laying around, watching them work and then going potty and eating, etc....but everytime they approached the cage he'd get tense and scared and you could see the breathing increase.

when i went to get him she had me go in the back back to see him, etc.....and sure enough as we approached and for the first few seconds of standing there, it got faster.

she did do a real small dose of lasix too just before we left to see if that would help him at all andddddddd went over with me how to count respirations so i can get a few readings here at home if he relaxes some. and get this, he's definitely not too scared of me. i've been able to hold him now for extended periods and he likes for me to stick my finger in his ear and rub :) and he cuddled up in my neck/chin area and started purring
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten--UPDATE 4/27/10 pm

Jess & Earl said:
Cindy + Mousie said:
he was 2.5lbs yesterday before enema and 2.07lbs after :) wow! his testicles haven't descended and conclusion is the little boy has been dealt a bad hand. now we have to decide if we want to find out how bad a hand it is i guess.
Click to expand...


They may still descend ...

I forget where you are in CA exactly. Are you near LA-ish? I know that Phil took Lionel to Dr. Yuhas here http://www.advancedveterinarycarecenter ... asp?tid=19 and had nothing but great things to say about her. She's a third-year resident. A coworker of mine knows Dr. Russell, another cardio there, and says he's brilliant. If you want to PM me your location or tell me what cardiologists you're near, I can tell you if I've heard of any of them. Glad to hear the little guy is going to get thoroughly checked out. Is he breathing normally?
Click to expand...

most of my time is spent in Orange County, south of LA actually butttttttttttt, she gave me info on that care center actually. one of the cardiologists has an office down here in Tustin too I guess and is here part time during the week so more than likely I'll hook up with him down here. His name is Dr. Michael Lesser and he apparently works with Dr. Yuhas and Dr. Russell up there as their names are on this info she gave me under Staff Directory.

after talking to fiance tonight, if we decide to move forward, i'll probably be calling him tomorrow.
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten--UPDATE 4/27/10 pm

(((Cindy))), I've been wondering today about you guys and little TD - oops I mean Fuji. You just gotta love a guy who wants to give the kid a shot. I do hope that there is a better outcome for little Fuji for his sake, yours, and especially Raul's if you decide to go the route with the cardiologist.
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten--UPDATE 4/27/10 pm

welllllll, it's 11:15 pm and i decided to check on the baby in the bathroom. he's officially pee'd at home now. only problem is he's a bit confused as to what is the litterbox. apparently he prefers big boxes. shhhhhhhhh, fiance will never know there was pee running down the shower drain tonight if we all don't say anything. LOL!!!!

btw, he has also eaten dinner too sooooooooooo

i was holding him for a bit and he's definitely a snuggler. i took a couple pics that i'll upload tomorrow probably.

edited 12:12a.m. (yes, i'm up. Mousie's BG is low so I'm still up)
okaaaaayyyyy! Fuji has had a substantial bowel movement now. also in the bathtub!! LOL!! now that would have been seriously funny though to hear fiance's reaction in the morning when he got in the shower. i need sleep. but seriously, at least some of his body is functioning better now.
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten--UPDATE 4/27/10 pm

Awww, the little guy is just trying to help you save on litter :-D Glad to know all systems are functioning well.
 
Re: I need quick advice re: stray kitten--UPDATE 4/27/10 pm

what a difference a few hours makes. the little guy couldn't get enough rubbing this morning, walking in circles rubbing on me, then flipping over for belly rubs and then he wanted to play so i let him bat my fingers around a little (didn't want him to get too excited)

went potty again, both functions, somewhere from 1am to 5 am this morning..............in the shower again. LOL!!!! silly kitty!

i gotta say, whatever time he has on this earth, he certainly is going to enjoy it.
 
we were up late due to Mousie's numbers so Fuji got to hang out on my chest and help me on the computer. little guy was tired.
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i wanted to get a video of him this morning as he was wide awake for sure, wanting all that attention but no time. will get some tonight if he's not too tired
 
Oh my...too cute. Have you put the litter box in the shower yet? Not sure if that will help. I am glad he seems to be doing better. Keep us posted!
 
LOL! actually jill we did that this morning.

i fessed up to fiance that Fuji was confused about what was the litterbox and that he had pee'd & pooped in there now twice each and he said to just put the box in the shower. so that's what i did. hope that works. LOL!!
 
Cindy, he's beautiful. I hope he continues to improve and am glad that he can enjoy however much time he has.
 
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