? Feeding times on Vetsulin

[Panic]

Kitty is newly diagnosed and we've been on Vetsulin since Monday (was on NPH for almost 2 months before). Neither insulins are working, vet and I are wanting to switch her to ProZinc very soon but until then I'm curious what the best way to give her meals are to help control her curve.

Here is her glucose curve from Monday:

8:30am - 470
?? (vet didn't write time) - 541
11:30am - 700
1:55pm - 623
4:30pm - 501

I assume my vet didn't free feed her during the curve, but obviously I can spread her meals/snacks out at home. I read that Vetsulin has a "double bounce" if I remember right and am just curious what times every else feeds their cats on Vetsulin.

I am aware of home testing and diet etc I'm just curious about feeding times at the moment. Do you feed 4 meals instead of 2? What times do you allow and pick up food?

 

[Elizabeth and Bertie]

I am aware of home testing and diet etc I'm just curious about feeding times at the moment. Do you feed 4 meals instead of 2? What times do you allow and pick up food?

Hi, many of us free-feed our kitties, or feed a number of small meals during the day. Some folks used timed feeders.

With Vetsulin it is helpful to ensure that the kitty has food on board before giving the insulin shot. Vetsulin can start acting quickly, and can drop the blood glucose fast in many kitties, so it's a sound idea (where possible) to feed 20 - 30 minutes before giving the shot. So the sequence is; Test, Feed, Wait, Shoot.
Some Vetsulin kitties also benefit from a snack an hour or two after the shot. This can help to slow down a fast drop in blood glucose.

It's also helpful (where possible) to remove the food a couple of hours prior to a preshot test. That is just so that the preshot test is not influenced by a recent meal.

When doing a glucose curve you're trying to see what happens on a typical day. So, you'd feed your kitty just as you do on any other day.

What are you feeding your kitty at the moment?

8:30am - 470
?? (vet didn't write time) - 541
11:30am - 700
1:55pm - 623
4:30pm - 501

That 700 looks really odd... It could be a bounce (rebound) from an earlier low number in the previous cycle. If that's what it is that could mean the insulin dose is too high...

What dose is your kitty on at the moment?
Are you doing any tests at home? Do you have any other data..?

I read that Vetsulin has a "double bounce" if I remember right..

Hmmm.... It doesn't have a "double bounce" but it is comprised of two different elements (amorphous and crystalline) that take effect at different times, one earlier, one later. In dogs this can be seen as two peaks of activity, but in cats, because of their faster metabolism, this is only occasionally seen.

Eliz

 

[Panic]

By previous cycle do you mean the day before?

This was our first time on Vetsulin so she was started at 2u, prior to that she was up to 5u on NPH and it just wasn't working, which is why I requested an insulin change. We had switched to Vetsulin and after her first curve on Monday after some research between the two of us we determined a longer-lasting insulin would suit her more, so that's where we're at right now. Here are her past glucose curves:

April 8th - 459 - 504 - 520 - 430 - 449 (0.5u NPH) - sent home on 1u 2x
April 15th - 556 - 662 - 608 - 640 - 617 (2u NPH) - sent home on 4u x2
April 30th - 348 - 528 - 638 - 630 - 523 (5u NPH) - sent home on 5u x2

And then last Monday on 2u Vetsulin:
470 - 541 - 700 - 623 - 501 (sent home on 3u x2)

I have the supplies but have not started home testing yet, I want to start when we start on ProZinc. We are also having a hard time because she's only 4.3 lbs, she should weigh about 8 or 9, so we are both fighting to get her weight back up (more calories) but her levels down. I believe when my vet does her curves that she feeds about a half hour before the first shot, if that's any help. At home I usually shoot as she eats, it's just easier and she's in the "starving" phase anyway so she's definitely going to eat enough each time. After her curve on Monday the vet put her on 3u. She is at the vet today for another curve still on the Vetsulin.

If it's any help, her last curve (on the Vetsulin) was with DM Savory Selects...I had a disagreement with the vet when I brought Fancy Feast to her curve and they fed her their food instead, but we are since on the same page (thanks catinfo.org!) and today she should be using the Fancy Feast and a bit of DM dry (reason being we are trying to get more calories in her, and then she will stick to wet). Prior to this she was on DM regular, and before that DM dry.

Thank you for the bit about the snacks an hour or so after, I will incorporate it into her meals. c:

Also want to mention her vet admitted to learning a lot when I sent her the catinfo chart and even went out of her way to phone a nutritionist and a couple other vets about my baby who confirmed Fancy Feast was appropriate for diabetic cats. In all her years she said she's only had one cat in remission so I don't think she's been completely up to date on FD, so if there's anything you think we need to alter in our steps to regulation, my vet has proven to being open to learning new things which I greatly appreciate <3

 

[Yong & Maury GA]

Always good to hear about a Vet being open to new things! I'm definitely going to advocate you stop wasting your money on curves done at the Vet but to put them towards you home supplies. Increasing by whole units is not the usual practice on the forum. Also, curves done at home are usually more accurate as she shouldn't be as stressed since she'll be at home in her area . We've found kitties respond better to tiny increases of 0.25U (1/4 of 1.0U). Also, when you jump whole units (it typically works for humans) and BG numbers are still staying high, too much insulin can look like too little.

For weight gain, she can get more than enough calories on just wet food BUT with your dose, gradually remove the DM dry since it's moderate carbs. I might be fought on this but when you switch to Prozinc, I think you'll want to start back at 1.0U twice a day as long as her numbers still permit it. Especially, if you're going to change her diet. When making changes, always do one thing at a time , otherwise you'll also go nuts if something works and you made multiple changes lol. Guess we'll find you on the Prozinc forum soon .

 

[Panic]

The part about the .25 units is interesting! Currently the U40 syringes I have now are only in full units, I know the U100 I was using has half-units, do they make quarter unit syringes or do you just use half-units and eyeball it?

Her last curve was MUCH better, vet attempted 5u and she finally dipped (to 73 so too much!) so she is now on 4u of Vetsulin. The vet doesn't want to put her on Prozinc now since Vetsulin is finally working which I agree with because it's been so long since she felt normal (she actually ate so little last Thursday night I couldn't shoot, but it was more like her typical eating habit of being a small muncher). Her appetite has increased some so she's back to acting a little demanding but not ravenous like before. I do wonder if/when we should switch to Prozinc anyway? I'm not sure.

As for the DM dry it's basically useless, she snubs her nose at it and won't touch it. Hasn't in days.

 

[Marianne M]

Hello I just joined today. My cat Mango just started on Vetsulin last week and our vet went out of town the next day. I've been on my own. He told me to start him off with 2 unit twice a day and if that didn't move the numbers enough go to 3 units twice a day. On another's vet's advice he is now getting 2.5 units in the morning and the 2 units in the evening. I was afraid the dosage would be too much to go right to an extra unit so I'd prefer to increase it slowly because I don't know what I am doing. I was told his sugar level was in the 400's and the lowest it has dropped is 249. Since the blood sugar should be between 200-250 it's doing it's job but today I tested before breakfast after withholding his free feeding and it was the high at 421. I am going back to letting him free feed. So after I blood test, feed and give his shot the Tiki Cat dry food (44% protein and low carb) is being put back out. I am feeding Fancy Feast pate and Friskie pate. Both are good for protein and low in carbs depending on which one you are feeding. Fish is the best. I tried the Tiki Cat foods but they are shredded and my cats do not like chunks, shredded or food in gravy. There are better wet foods off the shelf than the prescription food the vet's recommend. I think my cat know exactly what he needs and when he needs it He doesn't overeat and our other cat Natasha also doesn't overeat with the free feedings. He eats dry food after his wet meal then again in the morning and in the afternoon and during the night. I suck at the ear stick. Haven't found that sweet spot yet but thankful my cat is so forgiving! I have not done a curve yet (vet never mention doing that) so one day this week I will check his sugar every two hours for the first half of the day. Good luck to you and your kitty. So we are all in this adventure together.