? Did I Take Jack Out of Remission By Accidently Giving High Carb Food?

Discussion in 'Feline Health - (Welcome & Main Forum)' started by Daddy Jack's Mommy, Aug 8, 2020.

  1. Daddy Jack's Mommy

    Daddy Jack's Mommy Member

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    Feb 18, 2019
    Hello All.
    It's been a long time since I've been here. Jack went into remission in the beginning of June 2019, after only 4 months on insulin. He's been well, overall, and his BG has been very good. For a long time, I tested weekly, then monthly. However, I've become overconfident that he's doing great and have gotten lazy the last few times. I tested him this morning, before eating, and it was 136. He hasn't been that high since June 2019 when he first went into remission. (It took a little bit of time for his BG to stabilize w/o insulin.) Today, when I tested him again at +3, he was 172. I was floored. (There was one morning when his BG was high -- Christmas Eve -- because he was sick.)

    I'm wondering if it's high because I recently needed to change their canned food. (The old food changed formula and it was too high in phosphorus for my CKD old girl.) For the most part, they all eat (5 cats) EZ Complete raw, but I supplement with canned food. I recently spent HOURS researching which foods I can use (low carb and low phosphorus), and settled for a few more that I can try. I looked on the manufactures websites (if that info was provided), and called one company that I wasn't familiar with. However, I didn't call one company, after seeing that food listed on Lisa Pierson's list, to confirm that there were no changes in the formula. I DID look on their website, but apparently, I must not have checked the carbs (but I did confirm that phosphorus is low). So this morning, when Jack tested 172 @#3, I went back to the manufacturer's website and was extremely upset to see that I've been giving him food with almost 15% carbs. (I deliberately stay under 8%.)

    So here is my question: I haven't given Jack that food for several days now because it gave him very smelly stools. However, for 10 days-2 weeks prior, he ate a little everyday or nearly everyday. If his elevated BG is because of the food, shouldn't it be down to normal by now? If it could be from the higher carb food, how long could it take for his BG to normalize?

    I'm angry at myself for this. I can't believe that I've been giving him high carb food by accident, and that I went 7 weeks without testing him. I should know better. And... tomorrow we leave for vacation until Tuesday or Wednesday, so I won't be here to check his BG.

    I'd so appreciate any thoughts or feedback. Thank you.

    Edited to add: I want to include that Jack has been dong great since the addition of different canned foods recently. He's gained weight, he's not vomiiting at all, and he looks wonderful.
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2020
  2. jt and trouble (GA)

    jt and trouble (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    I am no expert but it would make sense that higher carb food would raise BG levels (Be glad they didnt skyrocket!) I'm not sure how to proceed. He may need a drop or two insulin???
    Heres a more experienced member with prozinc. ;)

    @JanetNJ
    @Critter Mom
     
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  3. Daddy Jack's Mommy

    Daddy Jack's Mommy Member

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    Feb 18, 2019
    I just love the quote in your signature!! Anyway... The only insulin I have is dated 4/20 expiration. Should I use that?
     
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  4. Red & Rover (GA)

    Red & Rover (GA) Well-Known Member

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    May 18, 2016
    Once a diabetic, always a diabetic. Daddy Jack should stay on a low carb diet.

    I'm not a Prozinc user but I'd cut out the higher carbs and see what difference that makes.
     
  5. Panic

    Panic Well-Known Member

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    Apr 10, 2019
    Hi Carolyn, I remember you and Jack!

    I don't know if I would start insulin just yet, especially with you leaving tomorrow. I think I've heard it recommended to test after eating to see if the pancreas is kicking in. I'm not sure if he would need a couple weeks on LC food to see if that will put him back down or not. Let's see what the experienced have to say about it. :)
     
  6. Daddy Jack's Mommy

    Daddy Jack's Mommy Member

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    Feb 18, 2019
    And I remember you too! You know, I agree with you. I'm leaving tomorrow, so I don't think I should give him any insulin. If he goes into hypo, that would be horrible! I'm going to try to relax and give this time, and I'll test him as soon as I get home. I'm just hoping this is because of the food.
    I'm sorry that Panic died. I was sad to see that.
     
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  7. jt and trouble (GA)

    jt and trouble (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    Well I wouldnt use expired insulin. I know its only a couple of months out but you will always wonder if the numbers arent what you expect to see.

    I agree with Elizabeth on the vacation deal. You have the opportunity to try and get his numbers back down just with food . Take it.
     
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  8. Daddy Jack's Mommy

    Daddy Jack's Mommy Member

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    Feb 18, 2019
    Yes, at this point I'm just going to wait until I come home. Of course I'll come home Tuesday instead of Wednesday because I'm going to be thinking about him the entire time. And I'll be so worried until I know he's okay.
     
  9. jt and trouble (GA)

    jt and trouble (GA) Well-Known Member

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    LOL You sound like me! I've missed vacations Races...just because I dont trust even the Vets!
     
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  10. Daddy Jack's Mommy

    Daddy Jack's Mommy Member

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    Feb 18, 2019
    Oh boy! He won't get that yummy food anymore! Giving him that high carb food was totally by accident.
     
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  11. Aleluia Grugru & Minnie

    Aleluia Grugru & Minnie Well-Known Member

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    Dec 21, 2019
    I just want to say your babies are gorgeous!! :bighug::bighug::bighug:
     
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  12. jt and trouble (GA)

    jt and trouble (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    very regal looking!
     
  13. Sienne and Gabby (GA)

    Sienne and Gabby (GA) Senior Member Moderator

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    Dec 28, 2009
    I tend to agree with not starting insulin if you're going to be gone. If Jack hasn't had a recent vet visit, if his numbers are still not what's typical when you get back, I think a vet visit is in order. First, get a fructosamine test. It will let you know if what you were seeing was a fluke or if his numbers have been elevated for a while. Second, the one issue that most often brings a cat out of remission is that they need a dental. So, get his teeth looked at.
     
  14. Daddy Jack's Mommy

    Daddy Jack's Mommy Member

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    Feb 18, 2019
    Thank you! That's Jack (sitting upright) and Joey, who is my female ginger. She adores Jack, and he always takes care of her - thus the nickname Daddy Jack.
     
  15. Daddy Jack's Mommy

    Daddy Jack's Mommy Member

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    Feb 18, 2019
    I've absolutely decided against the insulin. In addition to leaving tomorrow for a couple days, the insulin has expired. I'll contact my vet when I get back. I was simply wondering if anyone knew how long it could take for high carb food to leave his system.
     
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  16. Panic

    Panic Well-Known Member

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    Apr 10, 2019
    Thank you, this year has really been a hard one. :(

    Please let us know what happens next week when you get back with Jack! So nice to see you two again but not under these circumstances. :nailbiting:
     
  17. Daddy Jack's Mommy

    Daddy Jack's Mommy Member

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    Thanks Elizabeth. I'll let everyone know how he's doing...
     
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  18. jt and trouble (GA)

    jt and trouble (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Awwwwwwwwww:bighug:
     
  19. Sienne and Gabby (GA)

    Sienne and Gabby (GA) Senior Member Moderator

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    Dec 28, 2009
    Even with HC canned food like we would use to raise numbers if they get too low, at most, it can take 12 - 24 hours, excluding the effect from a bounce, for HC canned food to be out of a cat's system. Dry food can take substantially longer.

    Have a good trip.
     
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  20. Daddy Jack's Mommy

    Daddy Jack's Mommy Member

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    Thank you Sienne. I think that's what I'm afraid of here, and I was hoping to hear something different. I'm afraid that this elevated blood glucose isn't because of that food, because he hasn't had that in a good two or three days now. I'm hoping I didn't put him back into active diabetes by allowing him to eat that for a couple of weeks. I feel somewhat sick to my stomach over this right now.
     
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  21. Sienne and Gabby (GA)

    Sienne and Gabby (GA) Senior Member Moderator

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    Dec 28, 2009
    Honestly, I doubt that a couple of days of higher carb food tipped the scales. There are way too many cats that are in remission and who snarf down contraband at any opportunity. There have been photos and stories of kitties stealing waffles out of the toaster, learning how to open the toaster oven in order to munch on the rolls that were being stored there to keep them away from a carb craving cat, and any number of accounts of how the baby was throwing all sorts of thing off the highchair to an eagerly awaiting kitty.

    If you weren't testing all that often, you have no idea when the numbers started creeping up. Like I said, if you think it would be useful, a fructosamine level will give you some idea if this has been going on for a while. The most likely scenario is that Jack needs a dental.
     
  22. Daddy Jack's Mommy

    Daddy Jack's Mommy Member

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    That makes me feel so much better. I've been so angry at myself for giving him that high carb food, even though it was completely by accident. I've been so careful with his diet, and so happy that he's been in remission for so long. Thanks again Sienne.
     
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  23. Daddy Jack's Mommy

    Daddy Jack's Mommy Member

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    Feb 18, 2019
    It appears as though we're still on the honeymoon! Jack's numbers have been pretty good, although not consistent. He had a fructosamine test done on Tuesday and the results were 297. He hasn't lost an ounce. In fact, he has gained two since he was at the vets in October to have a canine tooth removed. He's playing and eating and looking fine. My vet feels very comfortable with the numbers that he's been having, including the slightly elevated ones. It's possible that his numbers may always fluctuate, but once he went off the juice I only tested weekly, then bi-weekly, then monthly, then really not enough in the last few months. And even as infrequently as I've been testing, I can see that his numbers are never always consistent and are not always in the green. And if it's true that they were slightly more elevated recently, it could have been because he knew we were packing up to go away for a few days and he could have been very stressed out.

    Or... He did this on purpose so he could be tested more and get his beloved dehydrated shrimps! He's back to standing in the bathroom, looking at me down the hallway, and summoning me to come test his BG.

    I appreciate all of the love and concern for Jack. :bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug:
     
  24. jt and trouble (GA)

    jt and trouble (GA) Well-Known Member

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    LMAO Thanks for the update! :bighug:;):coffee:

    He sure is a cutie!
     
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  25. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Jun 16, 2014
    No flies on Jack! :)

    Thank you very much for letting us know he's doing OK.


    Mogs
    .
     
  26. Panic

    Panic Well-Known Member

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    Apr 10, 2019
    I think Jack is doing it for the food. It's ALWAYS about the food. ;)

    Thanks for the update - I was wondering how he was doing! Keep it up Daddy Jack!
     
  27. jt and trouble (GA)

    jt and trouble (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Aaaaaamen
     
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  28. Daddy Jack's Mommy

    Daddy Jack's Mommy Member

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    Feb 18, 2019
    He is so food motivated!
     
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  29. Daddy Jack's Mommy

    Daddy Jack's Mommy Member

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    You're welcome. I'm so glad that I had good news to share!
     
  30. Daddy Jack's Mommy

    Daddy Jack's Mommy Member

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    Feb 18, 2019
    This little boy really adores being tested. It's the only time he ever gets freeze dried shrimp, and I absolutely know it's his very favorite snack. I test him in the bathroom because I have four other cats, and they would torture us the entire time. I bring everything that I need into the bathroom, and he trots down the hallway right after me. I use an empty pill bottle to warm his ear. While I fill that up with very hot water and set everything up on the toilet seat, Jack purrs his little heart out. I talk to him the entire time, then I sit on the floor to test him. He loves the ear warming part, and the fact that he gets my undivided attention. He continues to purr, although sometimes he stops during the ear poking part and resumes it immediately after. Then he can barely contain his excitement when he knows that I'm about to open up that cabinet under the sink and pull out his beloved shrimp!

    My oldest fur baby, who will be 16 next month, has chronic kidney disease. She takes her food extremely serious which is why she's doing so well despite her illness. Some mornings, while I'm testing Jack in the bathroom, she stands outside the bathroom door and cries. It's a very upsetting sound. It occurred to me that I could probably just go ahead and feed all of them, as Jack would more than likely be willing to still follow me down the hallway. I tried out this theory this morning. I put all their food down, at which point Jack immediately started eating. I picked up the glucometer bag, gave it a shake, and walked down the hallway. Jack could not get down that hallway fast enough! His bowl of food meant absolutely nothing compared to what was awaiting him in that bathroom.

    Be still my heart. ❤
     
  31. jt and trouble (GA)

    jt and trouble (GA) Well-Known Member

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    OMG Heaven~~~~~ I'm in heaven~~~~
     
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  32. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Heart flutters going on here as well! (((Jack)))

    :cat:


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