Did I miss something?

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Bobbie And Bubba

Bobbie And Bubba

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Good Morning ~ I have been rereading The Start Low Go Slow Approach and I think I might have missed something on 8/12. Bubba's AMPS was 280 and from +6- +9, he was under 150. Should I have reduced him by .5 u? Even his PMPS was 162 and I had to stall him to shoot. I am wondering if he's just been in a giant bounce since then. I'm not beating myself up, I just want to learn. Any and all feedback would be appreciated.
 
Are you talking about the SLGS protocol for Lantus and Levemir? I don't think anyone follows that protocol for ProZinc (though I could be wrong). You've seen the protocol for us right? It's in a sticky at the top of the forum.

From what I remember of that day, we were just trying to see if holding one specific dose for a time would help. ProZinc's protocol is one we established here, so it's not able to be as specific as Lantus possibly...but it allows us to see what works for each kitty. Some kitties need to hold a dose for several cycles before settling in. Some need to change daily.

I do think you've had some bouncing. Remember, kitties bounce until they don't. And you have been getting lower and lower preshot numbers. I know it's discouraging, but it probably feels better to have the numbers drop more slowly...plus it helps reduce the chance of bouncing more in the future. You had that lovely blue preshot recently also.

I know it can be frustrating. Lantus and Lev tend to be dosed on a different protocol because they are both depot insulins. With ProZinc being in and out...it is handled differently. I think you've done the right thing so far. As you collect more and more data (and you're already fabulous at that!) you'll be able to do dose adjustments with a better understanding of how they affect Bubba specifically.
 
Thanks Rachel for you reply. I thought the SLGS applied to ProZinc as well. I am just a bit confused as to when nadir drops less than 50% of PreShot what to do. According to the ProZinc protocol if that happens, "any increases in doses should be tiny and monitored carefully." I would think that an increase would cause yet even more bouncing. I did not increase on the 8/12 when he was experiencing those lower blue numbers. Should I have? Still just tying to wrap my mind around this.
 
The 50% drop is sort of a standard to look for. A 50% drop is a good drop and encouraging. If he was at 400 and dropped to 200, you'd know the insulin is working and the preshot is most likely a bounce, so there would be less concern about the 400. But, with ProZinc, it isn't a signal to do anything different. A change downward should be made if you get a nadir under 50 or pre shots too low to shoot. Otherwise, holding a dose that is working well is usually the best thing to do.
 
Bouncing is the hardest part of this sugar dance. And it is so different for every cat. Some cats bounce a few times, settle into the insulin and stay pretty flat, dropping slowly. Some cats bounce for a long time. I think the record is 2 years with a Lantus cat. We had a kitty, Cassie, on ProZinc, who bounced for a year, then calmed down for a year and finally, after 2 years, started dropping regularly and went off the juice. Talk about a ride for the beans!

Cassie's patterns are much flatter than that. Yes, he bounces but not every cycle like some cats. I am guessing it won't be a matter of your ever really "figuring him out". I am guessing you will just need to react to the patterns as you see them, make sure he doesn't drop too low and eventually, he will start giving flatter, lower cycles more consistently. With some kitties, it is just slow and steady wins the race.

Check out Luanne's SS this am. He threw her another curve. In his case, it's looking like he was just getting too much insulin (which can look like too little). Once she reduced from the 3 units, he has started to respond. With Bubba, you have slowly and carefully increased. I think eventually you'll reach a time when he starts to respond and then drop. But, as always, it's at his own pace.
 
Bobbie And Bubba said:
Thanks Rachel and Sue, I feel like I am taking giant steps into stupidness while Bubba is bouncing around......
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Aww, Bobbie ... I think you're doing so well! You've jumped right onto this steep learning curve and you've kept right on climbing up, watching Bubba so carefully all along the way. (The bouncy-bounce still makes my head spin, too, btw!:confused:)
(Wish the hug icon was a bigger one...):bighug::bighug::bighug: - R
 
Robin&BB said:
Aww, Bobbie ... I think you're doing so well! You've jumped right onto this steep learning curve and you've kept right on climbing up, watching Bubba so carefully all along the way. (The bouncy-bounce still makes my head spin, too, btw!:confused:)
(Wish the hug icon was a bigger one...):bighug::bighug::bighug: - R
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Awwwww Thanks Robin! It is quite a learning curve. I'm in this game! Thanks for all the encouragement.
And hugs right back to you and BB! :bighug:
 
Hi Guys,

Thanks for the great explanation about the Prozinc protocol. I am also trying to wrap my head around it and Nicky is not making it any easier. Hopefully soon, I will know what I am doing and be able to give advice to start paying back all that I have gotten from this forum.

Sincerely,

-Luann
 
Luann and Nicky said:
Hi Guys,

Thanks for the great explanation about the Prozinc protocol. I am also trying to wrap my head around it and Nicky is not making it any easier. Hopefully soon, I will know what I am doing and be able to give advice to start paying back all that I have gotten from this forum.

Sincerely,

-Luann
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I hear you Luanne, me too. Looks like you are making some progress with Nicky! That's great! We can do this, because we've got some really great peeps helping us. How lucky is that???
 
It's all a learning curve, guys! Honestly, I learned a ton even after Gypsy went to the Bridge by just reading other people's threads and seeing what people said to them. I still learn today! Reading other people's threads will help you figure out how to work with your kitty and how to pay it forward one day. :)
 
Rachel said:
It's all a learning curve, guys! Honestly, I learned a ton even after Gypsy went to the Bridge by just reading other people's threads and seeing what people said to them. I still learn today! Reading other people's threads will help you figure out how to work with your kitty and how to pay it forward one day. :)
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I think you are right about that.
 
I know how you are feeling Bobbie, it is hard to figure out the correct dosage, especially with bouncing. I think maybe I am too cautious sometimes, but I try to remember to GO SLOW. Not always easy, eh? lol You are doing great! How will Bubba take being an inside cat only? :bighug:
 
CatX4 said:
I know how you are feeling Bobbie, it is hard to figure out the correct dosage, especially with bouncing. I think maybe I am too cautious sometimes, but I try to remember to GO SLOW. Not always easy, eh? lol You are doing great! How will Bubba take being an inside cat only? :bighug:
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Good Morning Lynn ~ Well, I am going back and forth on the inside cat only thing. And as I type this, at 6:21 Am EST, Bubba is enjoying his morning stroll on the property and field behind our house looking for some poor unsuspecting mouse or other small game. He loves it so much and as my husband says, it is "exercise". Otherwise he would lay around and do nothing. One member here told me that she did not see any difference in her indoor/outdoor cat BG wise. So, I am letting him out for 2 hours after breakfast and dinner and he's inside with me the rest of the day. Then he is handy for me to get a test. He is starting to hate me poking him. He swats at me and this morning bit me. So I am going to pull back and just do Preshoots and nadirs for a while. The only problem for the nadir is he seems to be different all the time. Sigh.... What were you doing up at 1 AM? How is Rupert doing?
 
Hi Bobbie, that seems like a good compromise with the outdoor vs indoor issue. I used to live in the country and had outside/inside kitties and they really thrived. My cats I have now have always been inside, since I moved and could not let them out due to traffic and other issues. Bubba would probably be very unhappy with being inside all the time and drive you crazy whining to get out! I would cut back on the testing for now too, luckily Rupert has not minded it too much, but protests sometimes by an angry sounding meow! :mad: I feel for you with his numbers, I can't seem to get Rupert regulated either. :( Guess we just have to keep trying and be patient, not always easy, huh? We just want our kitties to feel better! :( By the way, Bubba is a very cool looking cat, I bet the mice don't stand a chance against the mighty hunter! :smuggrin: I am always up late, a regular night owl here! Makes the PMPS testing harder,since I give him his shot pretty late. I have to set the alarm to do a +4 and up. Hang in there and let's hope Bubba and Rupert start having more consistent and better numbers soon! :bighug:
 
CatX4 said:
Hi Bobbie, that seems like a good compromise with the outdoor vs indoor issue. I used to live in the country and had outside/inside kitties and they really thrived. My cats I have now have always been inside, since I moved and could not let them out due to traffic and other issues. Bubba would probably be very unhappy with being inside all the time and drive you crazy whining to get out! I would cut back on the testing for now too, luckily Rupert has not minded it too much, but protests sometimes by an angry sounding meow! :mad: I feel for you with his numbers, I can't seem to get Rupert regulated either. :( Guess we just have to keep trying and be patient, not always easy, huh? We just want our kitties to feel better! :( By the way, Bubba is a very cool looking cat, I bet the mice don't stand a chance against the mighty hunter! :smuggrin: I am always up late, a regular night owl here! Makes the PMPS testing harder,since I give him his shot pretty late. I have to set the alarm to do a +4 and up. Hang in there and let's hope Bubba and Rupert start having more consistent and better numbers soon! :bighug:
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Yep, the patience pants!
 
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