Diabetic neuropathy and Methyl B12 questions

[purrdydolly]

Purrdy has bad back legs - no strength to jump up, walking on hocks when he does but not walking much at all. He does not seem to be in any pain.

The vet suspects that he's had two separate FCE (spinal strokes) in Sept and Nov of last year. In Sept he came back from the cattery with noticeable problems (walking knock kneed and lower) which seemed to stabalise and even improve a little (started giving him 1,500mcg twice a day not long after it happened, he also had physio and massage treatment and his BG was about 190 but was put down to stress). Then in about November, after a another stay at the cattery, he came home significantly worse and has not improved.

It is likely that these are FCE's from injuring himself at the cattery somehow. However he was also dx with FD in Dec. According to theory his numbers haven't really been high enough for the onset of diabetic neuropathy(270 is the highest reading we've had and that was an outlier).

Has anyone seen diabetic neuropathy occur in a cat with BG numbers that were sitting (pre insulin) at around 200-250?

At any rate, we see no harm in treating him as if it is diabetic related for now as if it's from FCEs then nothing can be done. My research suggests that you can't harm the cat with too much methyl B12 as any excess will just be excreted. Does anyone have any information to the contrary?

Last question - what dose? He weighs about 6kg with an ideal weight of about 5-5.5kg (176-194 ounces). We've been giving him 1,500 mcg twice daily. I'm thinking maybe we should be giving him more.

 

[phlika29]

Hi

Have a look at this recent thread and the other threads linked within it. They should be able to answer your questions I think

http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/treating-feline-neuropathy-with-methylcobalamin.130883/

My cat got weaker and weaker after he actually started insulin and I couldn't work out why until someone mentioned he may have low potassium levels. I am not saying that this is the case for your cat but maybe worth testing for as this can also cause weakness. Unlike the vitamin b12 you shouldn't supplement unless you get a low diagnosis first and then you need to monitor what the supplements are doing as cats can have too much

 

[BJM]

I believe the standard dose is 3 mg.

 

[Deb & Wink]

I'm going too answer the question from Purrdy's mom she sent me in a private conversation. That is so that other people can see this too.

Most people use the pill form of methylcobalamin (aka methyl b-12). The shelter that had me fostering Wink gave me liquid methyl-b12 to give by injection sub-q once a week, 0.25 ml. It was compounded at a pharmacy. Wink was a hard core dry food addict, so he wasn't used to eating wet food and it was easier for me at that time to give him an injection. Now, he absolutely can't wait to gobble up his wet food so it would be easy to mix the pill in with his food. I no longer need to give him any methyl b12 since he has been in remission. Wink weighed about 9.5 to 10.5 pounds when he was getting the methyl B12 injections. I don't remember the exact concentration of the liquid either. It was prescribed by the shelter vet.

I think the pills are easier to get than the liquid. The pills are sold over the counter and are fairly inexpensive. No prescription needed for the pills, where I did need a prescription for the liquid methyl b12. Pills are easy to crush and sprinkle on a little bit of wet food. Or some cats are easy to pill and/or you can get the kitty to gobble up a little treat of plain meat, with the pill wrapped in that tidbit of meat perhaps.

 

[Anna & Callie]

I answered you on your other post but I have been using methyl B12 that I got from Vitacost - 5000 mcg and I give the whole tablet in the food. You cant overdose B12 as its water soluble so anything they dont use they pee out. I have been using it for 6 weeks and my kitty's legs are much stronger already. Callie was crawling on the floor, not able to climb into her litter tray and unable to eat from the food dish without me propping it up. I am amazed at the difference!

My vet also gave me the liquid B12 (which is in fact cyanocobalamin and you dont want to use this). I used it for a month and there was no good result.

Numbers were in the 400+ range sometimes as high as 500 mmol/L pre insulin.

http://www.vitacost.com/vitacost-vitamin-b-12-methylcobalamin-5000-mcg-100-capsules-4

 

[Deb & Wink]

The methylcobalamine can be compounded into liquid form. What I used for Wink was the methyl b12, not the cyano b12 liquid.

 

[Hillary & Maui (GA)]

Not sure where you are located, but you should be able to go to any human pharmacy and buy the methylcobalamin version of B12 there. Read the ingredients, as you don't want any added sugar (most come with some form of sugar - to give it a cherry taste).

If you get capsule, just empty the capsule in the food. If you get pill form, melt it in a little water and add to food.

The standard daily dose is 3-5 mg or 3000-5000 mcg.

The vitacost version as shown is what I used for Maui and it worked well. The only "extra" ingredient was a little rice flour used as a binder and it didn't seem to affect her BG's at all.

I never bothered to split the dose, rather I just gave the full amount in one food serving. It has no discernible taste, just a pinkish color and Maui never noticed or cared. If my other cats ate her food, which often happened, it didn't affect them and with this and insulin regulation, the neuropathy eventually reversed itself.

 

[Anna & Callie]

The one above is perfectly safe and arrives the next day after ordering. I didnt even open the capsule....it disappears in the food unnoticed.

The ingredients are:

Gelatin (capsule), rice flour, stearic acid (vegetable source) and magnesium stearate (vegetable source).

 

[Lisa grossman]

I answered you on your other post but I have been using methyl B12 that I got from Vitacost - 5000 mcg and I give the whole tablet in the food. You cant overdose B12 as its water soluble so anything they dont use they pee out. I have been using it for 6 weeks and my kitty's legs are much stronger already. Callie was crawling on the floor, not able to climb into her litter tray and unable to eat from the food dish without me propping it up. I am amazed at the difference!

My vet also gave me the liquid B12 (which is in fact cyanocobalamin and you dont want to use this). I used it for a month and there was no good result.

Numbers were in the 400+ range sometimes as high as 500 mmol/L pre insulin.

http://www.vitacost.com/vitacost-vitamin-b-12-methylcobalamin-5000-mcg-100-capsules-4

Thanks so much for the info! I have started Spot on it 2 days ago. My question is, why worry about splitting the dose? Is there something bad about giving him the whole capsule in one meal? I thought the dosage was twice a day so I made that mistake- no problems from it.

 

[purrdydolly]

You don't need to worry about splitting the dose. Doesn't matter either way.

To update on Purrdy - we tried Dr's Best without success for about six weeks and then swapped to Zobaline - We started seeing results within a few weeks and Purrdy is now absolutely A1 in his back legs we kept him on the pills for about 3 months. So it turned out the vet had misdiagnosed the FCE and it was neuropathy after all. So glad I thought to give it a try!