Diabetic Cat Food

[joe3par]

Hi, Franky, my 12 year old male cat was diagnosed with diabetes in January 2011. I have been giving him Lantus insulin shots and have worked it down from 8 units twice a day to 1 unit once a day. I switched him from dry food only to prescription Hills R/D and that is why he has been doing so well. I want to find a good commercial cat food for him and take him off the prescription R/D and I came across Fussie Cat. It is low in carbs and posphorous . But one of the ingredients is something called "Oligo Sugar". Does anyone know what this is and is it OK for a diabetic cat?
-Joe3par

 

[Deb415andNikki]

Hi Joe3par (guessing a golfer...), and, of course, you too, sweet Franky,

Never heard of Oligo Sugar, but just Googled it. Here's Wiki's link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oligosaccharide

Personally, I'm guessing no sugar is good for a sugar cat...

Franky, my 12 year old male cat was diagnosed with diabetes in January 2011. I have been giving him Lantus insulin shots and have worked it down from 8 units twice a day to 1 unit once a day. I switched him from dry food only to prescription Hills R/D and that is why he has been doing so well.

Okay, let's talk about how the hell Franky was getting 8 units of Lantus twice a day. (Please forgive my cursing, I'm usually more polite...) And, let's also talk about how you reduced his dose to 1 unit once a day. (January wasn't all that long ago, after all...) Do you home test?

Although it's hard to believe that any furry creature that requires something like 16 hours of nap time per day, cats metabolize insulin about twice as fast as humans... Shooting once a day isn't probably going to cut it with Franky. Lantus should be shot every 12 hours, so Franky's insulin needs are missing out on 12 out of 24 hours...

Yes, switching from dry food to low carb wet food will help. And, no, you don't need prescription food -- unless Franky has some kind of specific medical issue requiring prescription food... And, no, diabetes doesn't qualify. Many of us feed Fancy Feast or Friskies. Here are some link's to Janet and Binky's Famous Food Charts to help you see what's commercially available:
New: http://binkyspage.tripod.com/CanFoodNew.html
Old: http://binkyspage.tripod.com/CanFoodOld.html

We're going to be needing more information, dear Joe3par, in order to help you help Franky...

Welcome to the place you never wanted to be; but, will be blessed for having found.

You can do this kind of hugs,
Deb and Nikki -- and, Giz, forever dancing in my heart...

 

[joe3par]

Deb, thanks for the info on the oligo sugar. You are right. No sugar is best.
As for Franky making the recovery from 8units to one unit, it started like this. At the end of December 2010 we noticed Franky was drinking water and uninating in excessive amounts. Took him to our Vet and after several tests was diagnosed as having diabetis with very high blood sugar (425+). He also stopped eating. Our Vet recommended force feeding with R/D and we also gave him appetite pills. It seemed to work as his blood sugar started down. The Vet also recommended W/D dry after he started eating on his own. ( Franky has been on dry food all his life and would not eat anything else.) He would also get very stressed each time we took him to the Vet for his blood test which would spike his test. In January, I bought a home test kit and started a log to record his test scores at home and converse with the Vet by phone so I would not over stress Franky. His blood sugar would not go down and would stay at 350 to 450. Each week the Vet would recommend I increase the dosage one more unit. We eventually got it up to 8 units. In frustration I got on the Web to research and came across Elizbeth Hodgkins, DVM and her book "Your Cat - Simple New Secrets to a Longer, Stronger Life" She also had a her own diabetic cat and wrote a protocol for treatment. I followed it. Number one on the list was NO dry food no matter what promises the manufacturer made. Feed only canned wet and/or raw meat. No grains, minimum veggies, high protein, moderate fat and using the formula she had, I read all labels and calculate the carbs in the canned food. Should be 15% or less. I started this in mid february and finally started to see a significant blood sugar drop. I started reducing the amount of insulin according to the protocol and as we speak, since April 1, Franky's blood sugar has been on average 75 to 100 in the morning test and 200 to 240 in the evenings. I give him 1 to 11/2 units in the evening. He looks great and acts like his old self now. I feel if I could find the right canned food for him I might be able to get him off insulin altogether. ----Joe

 

[SaraJaye]

I think Hill's Prescription kind of sucks, it's "weight-loss" food is actually 37% carbs I later found, and I blame that food for bringing on my cat's diabetes dx. The brands that have worked for my cat are Merrick and BG (aka Before Grain). There are lots of cheaper options - several Fancy Feast flavors fit the bill although others will know which ones are ok. If you check that link above you will be able to see which foods are low-carb and low-phosphorous...

 

[Blue]

Well done on getting your cat onto a decent low carb wet diet; it's likely the main reason for the big drop in his insulin needs. There are many cats who are diet controlled - keep the carbs below 10% and you may well have no need for insulin.
A list of foods from which to select is here:

Binky’s Food Lists
Feeding Your Cat: Know The Basics of Feline Nutrition


Now, the dose you are giving would work much better if you split it; cats need insulin twice a day, so that is the reason why you are seeing high and then low numbers. if you take that 1u and give .5u am and pm, you may well end up with a diet controlled kitty very soon.

 

[Deb415andNikki]

Hi Joe, and, of course, you too, sometimes sweet, sometimes not so sweet Franky,

since April 1, Franky's blood sugar has been on average 75 to 100 in the morning test and 200 to 240 in the evenings. I give him 1 to 1 1/2 units in the evening.

You are definitely making progress! And, yes, there is every chance Franky's pancreas could still be active, and with the proper diet, his diabetes could be diet controlled. God knows, it's what we all hope for! But, let's talk about that... Let's talk about Franky's pancreas, okay?

Right now, about 12 hours of each day (technically night since that's when you give him insulin), his pancreas gets a rest because insulin is on board. And, yes, I'm a wimp and wouldn't shoot at 75, although might consider a reduced dose at 100. (Nikki's on Levemir, similar to Lantus...) But, because you're not shooting anything in the morning, Franky's back in the 200 to 240 readings in the evening. I'm going with Gayle on this one. Since you are home testing (YAY!!!), why not split the dose and give Franky 0.5 unit morning and evening? That way he and his pancreas have 24 hours of coverage. Make sense?

He looks great and acts like his old self now.

I love this! It just makes my heart smile...

I feel if I could find the right canned food for him I might be able to get him off insulin altogether.

You just might... But, you're going to have a better chance giving his pancreas 24 hours of coverage...

Continued encouraging hugs for you and Franky,
Deb and Nikki -- and, Giz...

 

[joe3par]

Thanks for the tip on the insulin schedule. I will try that.
Some of you good folks have suggested Fancy Feast as a good canned food. One of the ingredients is Sodium Nitrite. Not a good thing for humans so I am thinking not good for cats. Any comments on this?
-Joe

 

[cjleo]

Have you looked at one of the premium wet foods like Wellness, Evo, or Natural Instincts. Merricks is another one. They may be a little more expensive, but if you are worried about Sodium Nitrate, they may fit your bill.

I use a combination of food to feed all of my diabetics. I have 2 that have gone into remission with a combination of Wellness (Turkey or Chicken), Merricks (Cowboy Cookout), Evo, and Friskies (the pate type).

And, you should have much better evening numbers if you switch to .5u of Lantus twice a day. Works good for me once a day, but not for my furbabies. Their metabolism is much faster than human's is.

Good luck

Claudia

 

[joe3par]

Hi Gang, I took Deb's advice and started giving Franky 1/2 unit morning and evening. It looks like it works. Since 4/19 to this morning 4/24 his morning blood readings have ranged from 83 to 108 and the evening blood readings have ranged from 135 to 161. What a wonderful source of info this forum has been. Thank you all very much. (My Vet is mad at me as she thinks I am playing at being a Vet. The truth of the matter is, with your help, we have done more good for Franky than she has.) I will keep you all posted on Franky's progress.
He is still on R/D wet. Even though I have tried some good canned food for him, he won't eat them.
-Joe

 

[Christie & Willie (GA)]

Congrats! Your vet sounds a lot like my prior vet, who wanted absolute control over all dosing decisions, but I quickly realized she had started prescribing lantus without fully understanding how it was different from prior insulins used by vets. Ultimately, you are the one responsible for your pet's health... not your vet. I commend you for standing up to her and doing what is best for Franky! Since he can't speak for himself, it is up to you to be the best possible advocate for his care. You're doing a great job, and his numbers show it!!

One thing that might help with the food switch is a product called Fortiflora. You can get it from your vet or you can also order it without a script from Amazon. It is a probiotic that contains animal digest, the same stuff used to flavor dry food. When Willie isn't enthusiastic about a food, I open the packet, waft it under his nose, then sprinkle a little on the food. It works almost every time!

 

[underdawg]

Great news! Be sure that when you change to another food, that you monitor the BG more closely and more often so that Franky does not hypo. A change in diet can cause the need for insulin to drop so just be watching for that since you are getting low numbers now.

 

[Deb415andNikki]

Hi Joe, and, of course, you too, not as sweet Frankie,

started giving Franky 1/2 unit morning and evening. It looks like it works. Since 4/19 to this morning 4/24 his morning blood readings have ranged from 83 to 108 and the evening blood readings have ranged from 135 to 161. What a wonderful source of info this forum has been. Thank you all very much.

YAY!!! You might need to look at your phone log to see if Franky is ordering pizza while you sleep... ;o)

Please thank Gayle too, as I was merely echoing her thoughts and what I've learned from being in the trenches. Most sugar cats need 24-hour coverage. Period. Then again, ECID, Every Cat Is Different...

(My Vet is mad at me as she thinks I am playing at being a Vet. The truth of the matter is, with your help, we have done more good for Franky than she has.)

Just tell Franky's vet that you're being a proactive parent. I'm not a vet basher, Joe, yet have trained two, who I adore and will always, always love...

He is still on R/D wet. Even though I have tried some good canned food for him, he won't eat them.

My humble suggestion is to simply feed Franky whatever he will eat for now. Hell, the only cat food Giz would actually eat was Purina DM -- canned for a little while and then only dry... (Oh crap, I cursed again, didn't I? My bad...) Giz had special dispensation here. She defined picky. And, I killed two George Foreman grills grilling for her... Then again, Giz sent me Nikki, who actually eats Fancy Feast! Who says God doesn't have a sense of humor? And, irony...

I will keep you all posted on Franky's progress.

You better!

Love and encouraging hugs,
Deb and Nikki -- and, Giz, forever the picky eater of my heart...

 

[joe3par]

Hi Deb,Gayle, Christie, Underdog and all the Gang.
Here is an update on Franky.
Since 4/24 through today, 5/3, his morning readings have been from a low of 74 to a high of 96 and the evening readings have been from a low of 88 to a high of 160. I started on 4/24 with 2 a day Lantus shots at 1/2u each. . I am still feeding him R/D wet. My next project is to wean him off the R/D and get him on something better. He looks and acts healthy. (I wish I could post his picture, but I don't know how.) Other than changing his food, I don't know what else to do now. Should I be slowly weaning him off the Lantus or continue doing the same thing? Since 4/24 I have skipped 6 morning shots because I thought his readings were too low. Any suggestions?
-Joe

 

[beggargirl]

Hi there!

There is another forum here specifically for Lantus users and it is very active. I recommend both taking a look, and reposting this question there. Chances are some experienced people will be able to talk with you and answer your questions in a more timely manner over there.

viewforum.php?f=9

It sounds like your cat is very lucky to have you! Good luck!

 

[joe3par]

Franky update. He is still doing great. He is averaging 70 to 90 in the morning and about 125 in the evening. I took your advice and rather than skip a shot I give him 1/4 to 1/2u twice a day. He is still on RD, but doing so well I will keep him on it a while longer. I am looking for a new Vet. There are plenty of good ones here but few that specialize in cats or are up on the diabetic info that all of us know now. My zip is 95946. If anyone knows of a good Vet within 50 miles or has a suggestion on how to find one I would be interested.
Thanks
-Joe

 

[Deb415andNikki]

Hi Joe, and, of course, you too, definitely not as sweet, Franky,

Franky update. He is still doing great. He is averaging 70 to 90 in the morning and about 125 in the evening. I took your advice and rather than skip a shot I give him 1/4 to 1/2u twice a day. He is still on RD, but doing so well I will keep him on it a while longer.

YAY!!! I am so in love with Franky's pancreas! YAY, again!!!!!

As for the RD? Do you know that old expression -- If it ain't broke, don't fix it? Whatever works, Joe...

I am looking for a new Vet. There are plenty of good ones here but few that specialize in cats or are up on the diabetic info that all of us know now. My zip is 95946. If anyone knows of a good Vet within 50 miles or has a suggestion on how to find one I would be interested.

There are several members here who live in CA. My humble suggestion is that you start a new post asking that question in your subject line. Or, you can start calling vets in your area and ask if they specialize in FD. You may find one or not. But (and, sometimes buts are good!), you can teach them... I personally know this to be true.


Thank you so very much for this update, Joe. Truly. You go, Franky!!!!

Love and happy hugs from Northern NJ,
Deb and Nikki -- and, Giz, who taught me just about everything there is to know about whatever works when dancing with a sugar cat...

 

[Deb415andNikki]

PS...

(I wish I could post his picture, but I don't know how.)

We'd all love to see Franky, too!

Look on the Tech Forum here as there's either a sticky or fairly recent post explaining how to do it. It's how I got Nikki's avatar up. Okay, it took me a few attempts...

If you need help resizing Franky's pic to the proper size, I can help. It's an upload attachment, probably browsing kind of deal... Just let me know, okay?

Continued love and hugs,
Deb and Nikki -- and, Giz, who told me how anything is possible...

PSS: Am going to attempt uploading Gizzie's pic... Don't be scared and wish me luck!

 

[joe3par]

Hi Gang, Update on Franky. He is doing great. I found a new canned cat food for him to take him off the R/D. . The name is "By Nature" The label says 95% Beef & Liver. No veggies, grains or fruit. For those of you who want to check it out for carbs, the analysis are Protein 10%, Fat 6%, Fiber 1.5%, Moisture 78% and Ash 3%. I have had Franky on it since 5/26 and his blood tests have been mostly below 100. I also found a new pet hospital that specializes in cats only. It is over an hour away but it will be worth it for the better treatment. My first appointment will be Thursday for consultation only and then we shall see.
I still don't know how to post his picture but I am working on it.
Regards to all - Joe

 

[Karen & Smokey(GA)]

Great to hear that Franky is doing better.

Just be sure the food says 'complete nutrition' somewhere. Some of those
95% foods are not complete nutrition and for supplemental feeding only...not long term
(just check, OK ?)

I used to take Smokey to a cats only vet an hour one way and it was very much worth it.

Good luck with the new vet !