Corticosteroids - I think I'll HAVE to use them.

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Sgans and Eegie - GA

Sgans and Eegie - GA

Member Since 2015
So, I'm asking for your experience. YES, I do believe the use of corticosteroids in Eegie is what brought me to have to be on this site - I'm near certain it caused his diabetes. BUT, it also saved his life with the IBD - over and over again.

Lately, he was doing well with a more local steroid (budesonide) and up until we started this insulin dance, his IBD was pretty well-controled most of the time.

However, all these changes have brought back a serious IBD bout. Several days of liquid poops, a new need to regurgitate or vomit on pooping, extreme disinterest in food (the past 2 days).

Before he ever got to this point in the past (I wouldn't let it get this far), I got him a shot of Depo-Medrol or Ketalog or Vetalog, and it would give him the support to let the other meds get him well again. NOW, I'm concerned because of his diabetes.

Of course, I'm going for overall quality of life - which means I'll need to probably get this shot when my vet is in.
What I'm hoping to get an answer to here is - has anybody else had to do this while on insulin? How badly did it mess up your numbers? For how long? Did you increase insulin dosages at that time?

Hope someone can help me...
 
If he needs steroids, then that's what you do. Yes, you'll likely need to increase the insulin.
If it is daily dosing, the impact on the glucose will be more even. If it is alternate days, you may need to use a short acting insulin on days he is higher. Your home testing will show you how much it varies and if it is enough that you need to supplement. If so, several folks here can help you with that.
 
Any time there's another disease that REQUIRES the use of steroids to improve the QOL of the cat, you just adjust the insulin dose to compensate.

It's more important to treat the most severe problem with whatever works first and deal with the BG numbers later
 
Thank you, @BJM & @Chris & China ! This is going to be an injection, so I expect it'll be a significant and fast effect, that ebbs. But I'm monitoring a lot, so hopefully I can catch it. Thank you for making me feel better about having to do this!
 
The steroid injections my cats have gotten were depot injections, intended to slowly release over time. Do ask the vet. In that case, there is likely to be an initial surge in the glucose followed by slowly decreasing levels, depending on the dose, the anticipated duration, and how any residual function of the pancreas responds to it.
Some folks have found that fish oil has helped with inflammation. Discuss with the vet if it would be worth a trial.
 
Thank you @BJM. We've used depot injections almost all the time in the past. Most of the time they seem to work best to resolve the IBD although it takes a couple of days.

He didn't do great with fish oil. Gave him worse diarrhea (might've been reducing inflammation but smoothed things out too much). But he does get a lot of fish now especially salmon. Thank you for the idea.
 
@BJM , LOL! I don't see ME going for sour cherry juice!

I went to traditional route this time just because things of gotten so bad there's no time for me to try different more subtle methods. But I'll keep all of these in mind for when things start to go bad, before it gets as bad as it's been.

Thank you for the great suggestions!
 
I'm in the boat you describe.
Shadow has possible ibd/lymphoma by ultrasound dx.

She has started on cyclosporin ( gengraf) for anti-inflammation.
tomorrow we go from prednisolone every day, to every other day.

( budesonide was an alternative but we decided to try the pred for now as our vet didn't think we should do both at the same time)

I have Cerenia for vomiting and can give it every other day - I had it compounded into a oral liquid because the shot is painful.
she gets b-12 shots twice a week for absorption aid.
We had clay to help with the diarrhea but I also find offering more freeze dried options helps too.
she likes stellachewy's ticklin' tummy turkey.

and we also started on metrodiazanole in the beginning, but we have tapered off that now.
And when I remember to give it, pearls is what I've gone to for the probiotic. She used to do fortiflora but she won't eat it anymore.
Pearls is the next great one I know of ( it's for humans)

when we started all this, her diarrhea was really bad.... several times a day to the point of bleeding anus and hemorrhoids.
It made her cry in the litter box and then she discovered rugs were less painful than kitty litter.
That's stopped now.... thankfully and she's back to normal.

I have tried and tried to get her to eat raw but she just won't convert.
the stella/chewy's is the closet I've got and I think it has helped.

I wish you luck and I'll be watching to see if you get any suggestions that I can use.
 
@rhiannon and shadow , sounds like you're going through the same stuff we're going through! Our poor babies!

We gotten to less recent dosages of corticosteroids for a long time. He hasn't needed it for about a month, until this insulin stuff.

Are you doing the pred by mouth? I couldn't afford the injections that frequently. Since this shot is a build up for his system to be able to use the budesinode, we're sticking with the budesinode at the same time. Cutting down some of his other meds though.

I'm so glad you got your baby off of bleeding from the anus! We had that on occasion with a few pets and it's terrifying!

I've never would've pearls though. It's a replacement for Fortiflora? He won't eat Fortiflora anymore either. we have the syringe it. He misses some of the good stuff that way, too.

I'd love to know more about these pearls.

I did stolen S&c's raw frozen for quite some time. It changed the world! Still have some in the fridge. But now I mostly make my own raw. It's much less expensive and I can afford it from my other cats then too. Sometimes, it's hard to find proteins I want to use though.

Of course, today, first day of new shot, I think I missed one half of my dosage. I smelled it on my hands it actually felt it! First time I missed the shot, dammit! I think he got one half a shot though, so instead of one unit it's one half unit.

Guess I won't know for real numbers until the day after tomorrow.

Thank you for the wishes luck. Looks like I'm going to need it tomorrow.
 
Thank you @BJM ! I've being on that one on Facebook and yahoo and raw feeding for IBD cats on FB for almost a year. I don't think he would've survived this long without them. They're amazing!
 
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here's a link to show you the pearls
I find them easy to pill.... they are so little. Sienne and gabby turned me on to them.

the prednisolone is a pill. ( so was the budesonide)
fortunately, i win at pilling mine. I just take a breath, pose, and pop it in as far back as I can....
the one that stumps me are capsules because they stick. I just buttered those but now I've gotten rid of all gelatin capsules.

I've been trying raw.
Primal rabbit which she was accepting for a while.... as long as I put raw shrimp in with it ( so I do) but now she doesn't even want it with shrimp.
raw shrimp is her fav.
I also got kangaroo and squash from a U.S. company because kangaroo was the only novel protein that she hadn't been exposed to.
She ate that for a little while but now has an aversion and won't come near it.
 
@rhiannon and shadow , we're very lucky! My baby pills very well, too. I just get the steroid shot, because with the IBD, absorption isn't that terrific when he needs it. His budesonide IS a capsule, btw. I get it from this GREAT compounding pharmacy in Tennessee - only $25 shipped! (here, in LA, they wanted over $75 for 60 compounded capsules!)

The capsules do often stick and a lot of the tiny ones you have to cut in pieces. Or, with an enteric coating! UGH! But my boy is so chill... he lets me really push it back to his throat (at least, pretty often). Poor guy gets SO many pills - and I combine whenever I can into a capsule, just 'cause one bigger one is sometimes less annoying than small multiples.

Eegie started raw with Rabbit. It was all he would eat. I never did try Primal though... I NEVER thought of raw shrimp! I wonder if he'd like it! I can buy those tiny cocktail ones (I have to chop/grind all his food - very few teeth). Heck, if he doesn't eat it, I'd cook it up for myself!!! :)

KANGAROO?! THAT one I haven't seen in the US. On the Raw Feeding IBD Facebook page, I'd read about Aussies doing it, but here?! Y'know... I live in Northern Los Angeles - you'd think we have everything, right? Do you know I had to travel 10 miles just to find raw turkey breast today?! For those of you who're wondering why that's a big deal.... it's LOS ANGELES! 10 miles is like... 30 minutes if you're lucky enough to have no traffic! :eek:

So... where'd you find Kangaroo? I'll bet it's really expensive...

I'm lucky that Eegie's IBD isn't too protein specific. He can still do chicken, as long as it's not for too long. And, I can do multi-proteins in a day (I know, very unusual, but a godsend, considering his pickiness). Right now, I have raw turkey, raw salmon and raw tuna in the fridge, and some stuff in the freezer. The other cats are doing raw turkey for now. But in about 1.5 months, I have to change their protein too (don't want them to get what Eegie has, down the road). Always looking for a unique protein I can sustain for about 2 months at a time for them. Well... today I DID find Lamb testicles!!! That's one I'd never thought of!!! :D

I looked at the pearls - THANK YOU for the link... I'm concerned a little... in the past, Eegie didn't do great on acidophilus. I like the mix of probiotics in the Fortiflora 'cause I think it's THAT, that's helped him. But, I'd like to find an alternative - maybe different flavor - maybe none... I tried putting THAT in capsules - but geez! One packet makes 3x/#0 capsules! That's even a lot for my macho Eegie!!!

Guess I'll have to stick with syringing it for now.... I've come to rely on it. Just wish he wasn't sick of it.

Well... I'd probably get sick of even chocolate........... eventually! ;)
 
@rhiannon and shadow That is GREAT!

BTW, just looked at the Rayne site... that's $20 for 4 oz! I don't think I can afford that at all... but it's a great idea! I do love what they have to offer!

As for the Intelliflora, that's a great idea! He loves liver, and I do prefer it over animal digest! When I use up what I have left of the Fortiflora, that's next on my shopping list! Thank you!!!
 
check out diamondbackdrugs.com
so far , all my drugs have been much cheaper thru them....
they will happily give you a price check by email.
Their service has been great.

I get 10 mL oral bupenorphine for under $40. ( the vet charged me 110 for 3 mL)
I have to get the bupe from them because no where in NM can fill the prescription.
 
Hi

I just wanted to chime in here (a little late). My Remi became diabetic after usi steroids for a few years for his asthma and IBD. Whilst he was on insulin I managed to wean him off the steroid but his IBD just got worse and worse.

About two months ago I had to start him back on the prednicare at 1.25 eod. I also switched him over to a novel protein diet. I have been monitoring his blood glucose and whilst it has risen slightly it is still okay (anti jinx, touch wood, etc). His quality of life has greatly improved again and for now I am happy to keep him on this regime so that he has a good quality of life.
 
Hi. Thanks. Unfortunately, this is an old post. We did the corticosteroids. We have many many other problems right now. This may be the last day if we can't find a solution. Thank you for the input.
 
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