Copper's new data- What do you all think?

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owlgal

owlgal

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Got another couple of days data on copper. My scheduled events are finally getting slower here at home, so can observe him a little more now. So decided to go up on dose and see what happens. Please look at his ss and let me know what you think.

THANKS!

lori
 
My Amps was @ 372. Not sure what happened overnight. Don't know what his low was because went to sleep. But don't feel he went too low, so not a warranted rebound. Maybe a unwarranted? Or maybe the 2.8 is just too much? It looked like the 2.6u got him to level out in the 200's. Which i guess is better than 300's, but still no nice nadiar. That's why wanted to go up. I guess i will see on this cycle, although a drop bubbled out of his skin after i pulled the needle out. Never has done this before. I waited 12seconds before i pulled. Dont know. So maybe only 2.5 got in. IIt Figures. The day I can watch him and now a fur shot. Just not having much luck at all these days with him. I'm so frustrated and drained because i just feel like i'm alone in this and have to guess which way to go and then i make him feel worse. I don't want my cat worse, just want him to be healing.

PLEASE, your thoughts and ideas are greatly appreciated!!!!!

lori
 
Lori, the 2.60 days looked decent. PZI needs a few days at a set dose, even a .20 up/down change can make a difference so changing the amount so quickly is not helping. I know a .10 change doesn't work for Mishka but a .20 change one way or the other does but I leave it at that for several days unless of course she decides to go too low for some unknown reason......just being a cat. Ignore the glucose urine readings.....you'll drive yourself crazy. Main thing is negative for ketones. Go by what your meter reads and hang with the dose for several day. Some cats, even with a small increase will go higher before settling in.
 
Thank you Hope! I thought i gave the 2.6u at least 3-4cycles and that really was all that was needed to see how they are going to react. I liked seeing all yellow's, but they were basically all flat-meaning not even insulin. Also he never went into the green after the first day on 2.6u. Do you think 2.8u is too much? How long should i stay on the dose before they "settle in"? Should i stay on the 2.8u for a couple of days(i.e., 6cycles) and see how he does? I hate seeing him in the high 300's all day because i know it is causing organ damage and he already has bad neuropathy.

THanks for responding! I really appreciate having someone to bounce ideas around with. Don't feel so alone and frustrated. Just want to make the right choices, but seems like I'm just not lately. I just hate seeing him hurting in anyway.

THanks!
lori
 
Well, he went down to 97 on 2.60 and I talk in days, not cycles. Say you increase the dose, he goes up for at least a day or two, then body adjusts to increase, then it starts working.....slowly.....then he starts showing what that dose is going to do. I have always given it at least 4 days whether it was Humulin U or PZI IDEXX.
Are you giving Copper Methyl for neuropathy? Patches(GA) was on Eli Lilly's PZI insulin but that was years before hometesting or FDMB was there to help so we winged it.
 
Thanks! So just stay on the 2.8u for about 4days and see how he is doing and reacting?

Yes, he is on Zobaline tablets for neuropathy 3x day. But his BG has been so high, that i think until that comes down his neuro will still be there. But i give the zobalin anyway, it can't hurt.

THANKS so much!!!

lori
 
Yes, unless you see him going too low. Also, never re-shoot if you think you got a fur shot. Just leave it for that cycle because you never know how much did go in.
 
Thanks! I will stay on the 2.8u and see how he reacts. Why do they go high the first cycle of a higer dose change? You would think they would go lower.

YEs, i know about not reshooting a fur shot. THanks for reminding though. I don't understand how a drop can come out of his skin after i took the needle out. I waited 12 seconds before i pulled back out. Don't think that has ever happened before. Is there a way to prevent this from happening?

Lori
 
Lori, I just tent and shoot and pull out. Never looked for a drop but would imagine a wee bit might be still in there like on any syringe, it doesn't ALL come out. You can't pull back on the plunger while it is in the body and to pull it out, pull up on the plunger and re-insert is a no-no.
 
Lori, I would stay with the 2.60 for now and give that a chance, not the 2.80. Because of the meter changes you've done it gets a little hard because a month ago Copper was looking good at the 1.25 dose.
 
The meter i was using before i changed was not working. It was 100pts lower compared with the alpha trac meter everytime tested. I have the alpha trac that i borrowed from the vet at the time and was using that to compare. I just wanted to go to a meter with cheaper strips than the alpha-too expensive. That's when i got the relion and compared with the alpha trac several times and it was comparable within 30pts everytime. So all those readings before the relion meter were all really 100pts higher. So really he didn't budge with the 1.25. Also, the first week i was consulting Dr. Lisa and she was helping me with the correct dosage, although i was very hesitant to be as agressive with the dosage as she reccomended. I really was fearful of going so high on insulin right away. She recommended to start higher and i whimped out and stayed lower than i was supposed to. I wish now i had been able to not be so fearful of the insulin and started with a higher dose. I see now he needs more. I don't want him to be drowning in glucose toxcity any longer. The damage is being done everyday he is in a high number. This is what frustrates me and not very patient with it all. Besides, my schedule is so hectic and most of the time not home enough to observe him. I'm on a 2wk break right now, so able to adjust and observe better now.

That all said, I'm still learning and trying to understand this disease. Very hard to understand still!!!! I think i start to understand a bit and then WHAM, does something else. Very confusing.

Oh well, i'm doing the best i can do. We shall see how he does. We are going to a new vet this afternoon for bloodwork. This shall be very stressful for us all. Not looking forward to it.

Thanks so much for your input.

lori
 
Lori
you are switching the dose too often. You only shot 2.5 for one day.
I would stay with the .25 increments like you had been doing all along. Stick with them for at least a couple of days. Go back and read all of the great advice that Dr. Lisa gave you and us about dosing and looking for repeatability...
Carl
 
Dr. Lisa suggested that you stay on dosage for 3 or 4cycles to see if reacting. She doesn't think that insulin takes that long to settle in a dose. That is why i did 3 or 4 cycles and then went up. Maybe i misunderstood her and she meant 3 or 4 days, not cycles. In that case, should i go down to the 2.6u again or just wait to see how he responds on the 2.8u? So far his number today are ok.

Lori
 
Stick with the 2.8 for 3 or 4 cycles. I'll post more later when I get off work.
Carl
 
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