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don & chubby & gus

don & chubby & gus

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One of my cats became diadetic about 2 months ago. My vet said that his bg was 489 & started him on 2 units of lantus twice a day. One week later he was down to 176. One week later he was down to 65. I asked if this was a bit low and, was told it is but to continue with the same dosing and to now come back in two weeks. That was on a tuesday, by thursday mid-mourn he was throwing up everything. I gave him some karo syrup and about an hour later he was better. I gave him another dose karo the next day and stopped the lantus. When I went back to the vets in two weeks he was at 227. His diet is purina DM but, during the 2 week interval I feed him purina complete for about 5 days then went back to the DM. My vet now said to reduce his units to one, twice a day and come back in a week. On our next visit he was at 89. my vet said that was ok and to continue for another week. This again was on a tuesday. By saturday 7-10-10 after his meds, probably a couple 3 hours, he was throwing up again. This time he did not recieve any karo and is doing fine. It is obvious that even one unit twice a day is to much. We go back to the vets on tuesday 7-13-10. Being that I am brand new to this, I would appreciate any advice. I have not done anything other at home because I am still trying to gather more info so I can be more certain with any action taken on my part. My vet is really confusing me though.

Thank you for any info

donva & chubby
 
Hello Donva and welcome to the board! I am sorry your kitty is sick, but it will get better. My kitty squishy is not on lantus, he used PZI, but I do have a couple of questions for you.

Are you home testing yet?
if not it is very highly recommend here on this site. i have to tell you when i first started home testing it was not easy, but it gets easier i promise!(and it could save you kitty's life!) also...
What kind of food are you feeding your kitty? I know you said purina DM I am not familiar with this food. is it a wet food or a dry food. The reason I ask is because a Low carb wet food diet is very good for a diabetic cat. Is high in protein and low in carbs.

Again welcome to the board! There are so many people here that can help you. Did you read the Newly Diagnosed on the main page yet? That will give you lots of information until you get more responses from others on here. My kitty squishy has not needed insulin for the past 12 days, and that is all thanks to the help and info I got from this site!! Others will recommend you get a Spreadsheet up and running so they can help you better with dosing info. It is not required for the site, but it is very helpful for people to help you and it helped me with keeping everything organized. Did you post this in the Lantus forum also? i will cross post it for you so the lantus group knows you are here and new to this. keep posting and reading away..
 
Hi Donva

welcome to the FDMB.
I'm hoping you can come back and update and provide a bit more info, especially the one about home testing.

I get the feeling you are not home testing - I will add, that home testing is very important and helps you track your kitties numbers...going to the vet to check BG numbers once a week not only will it get expensive, but it is something you CAN do yourself at home. Also, BG numbers change constantly.
As you learn to home test, you will learn how your kitty is doing on Lantus.

I'm going to add the home-testing link with lots of info on home testing.
Home Testing Links Consider it ok?

Others will be by to offer help, and they will ask questions that only you can answer.

Hang in there! Feline diabetes is manageable!
 
Hi Donva, and welcome.
Did the vet do a fructosamine test or did he rely on the bloodtest in the office? The stress from the vet trip can raise the glucose substancially and give "false" readings. Unfortunately, many vets start insulin without the fructosamine test, which can make a difference. It did for me and my Sweety.
The vet BG reading was considered diabetic and the vet wanted to start insulin. But I had learned so much here that I asked for the fructosamine test and it came back borderline. I chose to change her diet from dry to wet and that did it for us. I hometested though, to be sure, along with urine tests for glucose and ketones.
The low carb food is very important. If you hometest, and feed low carb foods from Janet & Binky's list (as I did) you may find that you don't need insulin at all.
It sounds like (and I am not an expert) that if you had to give karo, after insulin, it's going too low - that can be dangerous, as I'm sure you know.

Do your reading here on the health links and learn everything you can for chubby.
Think about hometesting, it really isn't hard. You can get a real, non-stressed reading at home much better.
 
Hi Donva, and welcome --

I completely agree with the others that you should start home-testing your cat's blood sugar levels. You can find some helpful videos and information on that here.

Also, I have some reading for you to do. First off, you really need to read Melissa and Popcorn's post on hypoglycemia, it's symptoms and treatment. And you'll also want to read Jojo and Bunny's post on stocking your hypo toolkit.

Also, a caveat on the following: I am not, nor ever have been, a Lantus user. So if you get different feedback from actual Lantus users, please give more credence to what they say.

Regarding your vet and the way your cat is responding to his insulin: several of the older insulins have been discontinued in recent years, and new insulins are taking their place. Lantus is definitely one of the insulins that folks here on the board have been having good experiences with, but it sounds to me as if your vet is administering and measuring Lantus as if it was one of the other insulins s/he probably has lots of experience with. Unfortunately, Lantus does really work in quite the same way as other insulins.

Please head over to the Lantus forum. You'll want to read several of the stickies at the top of the forum. "New to the Group - Please read" gives you the basic organisation of the board, terminology, info on syringes, curves -- lots of really good introductory stuff. The sticky on "Proper Handling and Storage" gives you information on the different ways Lantus can be dispensed and how to best handle it to preserve its efficacy; reading the stuff in that thread will help save you money, and you may want to share it with your vet so they'll know the info and options for their other clients. And the sticky labelled "Insulin Depot AKA Storage Shed" is a guide (in layman's terms) of how Lantus works differently from other insulins. You'll definitely want to review that, and I'd strongly recommend that you print it out for your vet as well so they'll be able to adjust their processes for any other diabetic cats on Lantus that may come their way.


Also, until your cat is regulated on insulin (or, even better, off insulin entirely!), I'd suggest checking periodically for ketones. Ketones are a not-common but still possible side effect of unregulated / under-regulated diabetes, and they may indicate the start of diabetic ketoacidosis (DKA). Low levels of ketones may be treatable at home, and high levels of ketones may require hospitalisation at a 24-hour care facility for several days, so (if they occur at all) it's better to catch them when they're low.

To test for ketones, please stop by the diabetes aisle of your local pharmacy and pick up some ketostix (I've always found them in the aisle, but some folks report that their pharmacy keeps them behind the counter). Ketostix are little plastic strips that you stick in fresh urine; if ketones are present, the strip changes color.

Some other folks will be by and you'll get more encouragement to home-test blood sugar levels, and also encouragement to switch to a low-carb diet. *Please* do *NOT* switch to a low-carb diet until you're home-testing BG levels and almost certainly switching to a lower dose of insulin. Your cat's already experiencing hypoglycemia and switching to a low-carb diet without lowering insulin and home-testing could be ... well, Very Not Good. You *do* want to switch diets, but not quite yet, okay?

In the meantime, read up. You'll undoubtedly have a bunch of questions; please feel free to ask. We've all been where you are and we know what you're goine through -- and we're here to help you and your cat. Welcome --

Jean and her Gwyn
 
To be blunt, your vet is being reckless to the point of endangering your cat's life. He obviously does not understand insulin and its potential to cause hypoglycemia.

please, read through the info given you; immediately take control by learning to test at home (it REALLY is doable) and I would suggest cutting the dose even further for a day or so while you get this organized.

And further, I'd consider posting your location in case one of us lives nearby and can a. help teach you to test and b. can recommend a better vet.....

Jen
 
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