Clyde amps 406, 2 wks on 3u

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Richie & Clyde

Member Since 2011
Hi folks, a little update on Clyde. It's been 2 weeks now on 3u of Lantus & he's seems to be hanging around the 3 hundreds, w/ an occasional 4 hundred reading. There are some 2 hundred readings also. His lowest was a 155. The testing is starting to become a Little easier for me, but not Clyde. I've noticed he is not hanging out at the water dish, plus his urine output seems to be normal size clumps , not those "rock of Gilbralters" when his #'s were up in the high 4's & 5 hundreds. He seems to be a happy kitty, purring away, chasing his sister, just all around silliness. Should I increase his dose from 3u to ? Any advise would be helpful. Still on a all wet diet, Frisky's classic or Fancy Feast classic, he & bro & sister eats twice a day[morning before I go to work, afternoon when I come home].
 
Hi Richie,

I don't have any dosing advice, I'm sure more experienced people will help you on that.

It's great that Clyde is doing well. Those happy kitty behaviors are priceless after they have been sick.
 
Hi Richie,
There is one thing that really sticks out on your ss; your increases are in full units and you may find Clyde's numbers are better if you increase according to the protocol most people are following here...
If you think about your increases..... you started at 1u which is great, but then you DOUBLED the dose by going right up to 2u. It is only one number but it's double the amount of insulin. Your next increase was another full unit which was a 50% increase, and another big amount .... because of the shed.

With Lantus and Lev, you have a spare tank of insulin hanging out just under the skin, and that shed has to equal your dose. While you are topping up the shed, Clyde is not getting the full dose because some has to go to the shed.

Also, you are holding each dose longer than you need to hold it..... 3days or 6 cycles is usually good enough to see if it's a good dose for Clyde. If you don't have U100 syringes with 1/2 unit markings, you will need to get some.
Here's the gist of the protocol for dosing decisions...
"General" Guidelines:
--- Hold the initial starting dose for 5 - 7 days (10 - 14 cycles) unless the numbers tell you otherwise. Kitties experiencing high flat curves or prone to ketones may want to increase the starting dose after 3 days (6 cycles).
--- Each subsequent dose is held for a minimum of 3 days (6 cycles) unless kitty earns a reduction (See: Reducing the dose...).
--- Adjustments to dose are based on nadirs with only some consideration given to preshot numbers.

Increasing the dose...
--- Hold the dose for 3 - 5 days (6 - 10 cycles) if nadirs are less than 200 before increasing the dose.
--- After 3 consecutive days (6 cycles)... if nadirs are greater than 200, but less than 300 increase the dose by 0.25 unit.
--- After 3 consecutive days (6 cycles)... if nadirs are greater than 300 increase the dose by 0.5 unit.

Reducing the dose...
--- If kitty drops below 40 (long term diabetic) or 50 (newly diagnosed diabetic) reduce the dose by 0.25 unit. If kitty has a history of not holding reductions well or if reductions are close together... sneak the dose down by shaving the dose rather than reducing by a full quarter unit. Alternatively, at each newly reduced dose... try to make sure kitty maintains numbers in the normal range for seven days before reducing the dose further.

--- If an attempted reduction fails, go right back up to the last good dose.
--- Try to go from 0.25u to 0.1u before stopping insulin completely.

Random Notes...
Because of the cumulative nature of Lantus and Levemir:
An early shot = a dose increase.
A late shot = a dose reduction.

A "cycle" refers to the period of time between shots. There are 2 cycles in one day when shooting twice a day.

Sometimes a dose will need to be "fine tuned" by adding some "fat" or "skinny-ing up" the dose.


I don't know what links for info you have been given but here are some that you can read, print out to have handy and refer to as needed.

Tight Regulation Protocol
Lantus & Levemir – Insulin Depot –AKA- Storage Shed
Lantus & Levemir – Data Ready to Shoot Low Numbers
Lantus & Levemir: Info, Proper Handling & Storage has picture of syringe and insulin pens.

Here are some links to info on how to handle really low numbers in case Clyde drops to a low BG
List of Hypo symptoms
How to treat HYPOS-They can kill! Print this out!
Jojo’s HYPO TOOLKIT

With high BG numbers, and even not so high, it's good to be testing for ketones.
Ketones

Feeding Your Cat: Know The Basics of Feline Nutrition
As you are away at work, it may be an idea if you could get an autofeeder for Clyde as his numbers may be more steady if he were to eat more frequently while you are away. I know it's an issue with more than one cat, so see if you can set up in a way that only Clyde can reach.
Petsafe 5-meal Auto Feeder
 
I have to agree with Gayle. I'd encourage you to read through the Tight Regulation Protocol sticky. Typically, we hold doses for 3 days. We also increase the dose in increments of 0.25u. The risk of increasing by 1.0u is that you may miss what is a good dose for Clyde.
 
Thanks for the replys!.That full dose increase was per Clyde's Vet. So you're thinking little meals in between may stablize his #'s? I was wondering that myself. I'll increase to .25 & monitor, yes? Let me add, which I never mentioned, Clyde has never been a sick kitty, never hospitalized, always happy & healthy looking. A little over weigh yes, but I do believe his diabetes was brought on by Steroids given to him for an eye goop allergy condition. 2 days after on that med, I noticed him drinking constantly, also weakness in his hind quarters. We immediately took him to the vet & his BG was over 600. The vet then put him on Gliberide & it brought his BG back down to normal levels. Vet called it "Transite Diabetes". Almost a yr later he now has Diabetes.
 
Hi guys .. no advice from me, but it sounds like you got your questions answered by gayle and sienne .. I hope the extra bit of juice does the job for clyde and brings him down into some lower numbers .. have a great day guys!
 
IMHO I would not increase right now. I think by increasing in 1u increments you may have passed a good dose.

Before another increase I would focus on getting some mid cycle data for the next 2-3 cycles. Try and get some +2 and +6 and +7 data, AM and PM .
Lantus dosing is determined by nadir, not pre-shot numbers.

:?: Why do all your PM+10 numbers match your AMPS numbers?
 
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