Chloe -to shoot or not to shoot

Hi again, I double checked and I see your vet doesn’t suggest dosing under 200. Normally when we get a preshot number that is lower than expected, you would stall, not feed and see if the numbers are coming up on their own. This doesn’t necessarily help you directly but if others happen by who aren’t familiar with this aspect of our methods it may be helpful.
It sure was nice to see her coming down today.
 
Christie & Maverick said:
Hi again, I double checked and I see your vet doesn’t suggest dosing under 200. Normally when we get a preshot number that is lower than expected, you would stall, not feed and see if the numbers are coming up on their own. This doesn’t necessarily help you directly but if others happen by who aren’t familiar with this aspect of our methods it may be helpful.
It sure was nice to see her coming down today.
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oops didn't see this in time. She was hungry. I'm glad she ate. She's at 63 at +3. Or would that be +15? Actually, I don't think she ate much.
 
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I couldn't see very well on my iPhone, I thought maybe you had decided within the last few days to follow one of our methods, since you posted shoot or no shoot. The stall, don't feed and test in 20 Minutes to see if the numbers are rising is what we would do. Since you are still doing what vet is recommending, anything under 200 is a no shot, so it would be unlikely she'd come up to 200 in a short time to be able to give her the shot. Not impossible, I suppose. She really does seem to get good carryover, as is shown by her 63 at+3 after no shot.

Looks like she likes 0.25u, nice to see some greens again.
 
Christie & Maverick said:
I couldn't see very well on my iPhone, I thought maybe you had decided within the last few days to follow one of our methods, since you posted shoot or no shoot. The stall, don't feed and test in 20 Minutes to see if the numbers are rising is what we would do. Since you are still doing what vet is recommending, anything under 200 is a no shot, so it would be unlikely she'd come up to 200 in a short time to be able to give her the shot. Not impossible, I suppose. She really does seem to get good carryover, as is shown by her 63 at+3 after no shot.

Looks like she likes 0.25u, nice to see some greens again.
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Actually I'm following your suggestions more than my vet's. My vet starts at .5 over 200 and I've been sticking with .25.
 
I’m glad you opted to stay at 0.25u today and give it more time.

How is Chloe acting and feeling? The “whole cat report,” including the 5 P’s: purring playing, pooping, peeing, and preening?
 
JL and Chip said:
I’m glad you opted to stay at 0.25u today and give it more time.

How is Chloe acting and feeling? The “whole cat report,” including the 5 P’s: purring playing, pooping, peeing, and preening?
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Now I'm thinking I should have given her some insulin last night. She's over 300 this am but I refrained from giving her a higher dose. I'm thinking maybe this is a bounce. She seemed her usual self this morning. She even acted hungry with the other cats and tried to eat some dry food. Should I have given her insulin when she went up to 108 last night?
 
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My two cents ... last night’s skipped shot gave you valuable information because you tested and saw what happened after the skip. Capturing that data helps paint the picture of what’s happening and can be very valuable in your decisions going forward. (Note: once does not constitute a pattern, so I’d want to collect more data, but it does give a solid clue.)

Could you have shot when she hit 108? Probably, but that would have reset your shot schedule. Your next shot would have been 12 hours after that, and you’d then want to work slowly forward or back in time to get back to your regular shot times.

Sometimes it’s best to just tell ourselves that it’s a “data collection cycle” or equivalent to a “fur shot” and let it go. It’s hard to see 300 number at the next preshot, but the skipped shot kept Chloe safe from a potential life- threatening hypo AND it gave you the first tidbits of data to help you evaluate similar circumstances in the future.

And kudos for sticking with the 0.25u this morning. It can be really hard to “sit on one’s hands” and not react to a higher number by wanting to increase dose. I encourage you to stay the course. You’re getting valuable data, Chloe sounds like she’s feeling good. In short, you’re doing great!

For what it’s worth, I understand you’re forging your own path with the dosing, and that’s probably why you don’t get a lot of responses to your posts (it’s not that people don’t care, they just don’t necessarily know how to answer you questions outside of the structure of the standard dosing methods/protocols used around here).

You’re already taking baby steps toward using a conservative dosing plan and it seems very promising. When you feel up to it, I encourage you to read about about the “Start Low Go Slow” dosing method and the “Tight Regulation” protocol outlined in the Lantus Stickies (posts that have Stars next to them at the top of the Lantus board). I’m not pushing them, I just think they’re excellent food for thought.

The same goes for the post about getting data ready to shoot lower numbers. Although it’s in the context of the Tight Regulation protocol, I find some very worthwhile ideas and considerations in the post. Just please, please don’t consider shooting lower numbers until you have more data and a plan in place to monitor and react. And if you’re not officially following the TR protocol, please don’t shoot at the low numbers shown in that post.
https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB...y-to-shoot-handle-lower-pre-shot-numbers.147/
 
JL and Chip said:
My two cents ... last night’s skipped shot gave you valuable information because you tested and saw what happened after the skip. Capturing that data helps paint the picture of what’s happening and can be very valuable in your decisions going forward. (Note: once does not constitute a pattern, so I’d want to collect more data, but it does give a solid clue.)

Could you have shot when she hit 108? Probably, but that would have reset your shot schedule. Your next shot would have been 12 hours after that, and you’d then want to work slowly forward or back in time to get back to your regular shot times.

Sometimes it’s best to just tell ourselves that it’s a “data collection cycle” or equivalent to a “fur shot” and let it go. It’s hard to see 300 number at the next preshot, but the skipped shot kept Chloe safe from a potential life- threatening hypo AND it gave you the first tidbits of data to help you evaluate similar circumstances in the future.

And kudos for sticking with the 0.25u this morning. It can be really hard to “sit on one’s hands” and not react to a higher number by wanting to increase dose. I encourage you to stay the course. You’re getting valuable data, Chloe sounds like she’s feeling good. In short, you’re doing great!

For what it’s worth, I understand you’re forging your own path with the dosing, and that’s probably why you don’t get a lot of responses to your posts (it’s not that people don’t care, they just don’t necessarily know how to answer you questions outside of the structure of the standard dosing methods/protocols used around here).

You’re already taking baby steps toward using a conservative dosing plan and it seems very promising. When you feel up to it, I encourage you to read about about the “Start Low Go Slow” dosing method and the “Tight Regulation” protocol outlined in the Lantus Stickies (posts that have Stars next to them at the top of the Lantus board). I’m not pushing them, I just think they’re excellent food for thought.

The same goes for the post about getting data ready to shoot lower numbers. Although it’s in the context of the Tight Regulation protocol, I find some very worthwhile ideas and considerations in the post. Just please, please don’t consider shooting lower numbers until you have more data and a plan in place to monitor and react. And if you’re not officially following the TR protocol, please don’t shoot at the low numbers shown in that post.
https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB...y-to-shoot-handle-lower-pre-shot-numbers.147/
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Thank you so much for the feedback. I'd like to address you by name if that's alright. I'm going to test her now and expect blue.
 
@JL and Chip She's at 396 and I'm so tempted to raise her dose. Is this normal? Remember, she's had 4 DKA's and I actually worry more about higher numbers than low.
@Critter Mom,@Diane Tyler's Mom
I just read this: Shooting an hour or two early *could* act like a slight dose increase
No I don't want to get up at 4 or 5 am, so I'll wait until PMPS.
 
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Again, just my two cents, but yes I think this higher number is expected given that the depot was “drained” a bit by skipping last night’s shot.

Please keep in mind that Lantus is a depot insulin (dose accumulates) rather an in-and-out insulin (effects wear off by end of cycle), so it’s not surprising to see this temporary higher number.

If I recall, your vet suggested that she’d rather see Chloe too high for a day than too low — and she knows Chloe’s DKA history. I agree with that sentiment. If Chloe were my cat, I’d catch some urine for a ketone test (just to relieve my mind, not because I’d expect so see ketones), then assuming the ketones are negative and Chloe is acting well and eating well, I’d shoot 0.25u. My logic is that it’s probably a minor blip due to the skipped shot and things will likely re-stabilize at lower numbers soon. I asked earlier about the “whole cat report” and how Chloe is acting/feeling — all of those little details matter.

I don’t recommend trying to rush the process by shooting a higher dose.
 
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