Buddys SS up and going 3rd part about dosing

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Djamila said:
Hi @wolfey! I'm just recently back here on the forum since my cat started showing higher numbers again. It looks like your sugar kitty has a lot going on! And you've been busy taking good care of him! While you're working on figuring out his food, I hope you'll forgive me for interjecting my story: when Sam was first diagnosed, our vet gave us the Royal Canin Glycobalance as well. It turns out that the main ingredients for that are pork by-products, chicken liver, chicken, wheat gluten, powdered cellulose, gelatin, wheat flour, modified corn starch. Sam is one of those cats that is pretty carb sensitive and he can't have anything with wheat or corn at all. The Royal Canin turned out to be a big part of the problem with his high numbers. Since you're still figuring out the best food for your kitty, I thought I'd toss that out there as something to consider. Every cat responds differently to different foods, so it may be fine for Buddy, but thought I'd mention it just in case that food might be impacting the numbers you're seeing.
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What do you feed your kitty. Teresa & Buddy Wolfe
 
Checking in, Teresa. How did it go? I've just been to the main health forum to see if you put up a 911 last night. That's the way to get help ASAP.
 
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Pati said:
How did your night go Teresa?
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I was up until almost 3:00 a.m, he never got a chance to crash because when he started getting into the 80s, I started giving him FF grilled with gravy. He was a little high this morning but we are staying @3u.
 
Kris & Teasel said:
Checking in, Teresa. How did it go? I've just been to the main health forum to see if you put up a 911 last night. That's the way to get help ASAP.
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I did
Kris & Teasel said:
Checking in, Teresa. How did it go? I've just been to the main health forum to see if you put up a 911 last night. That's the way to get help ASAP.
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I did not not put up a 911 call. When he started getting into the 80s I started feeding him FF grilled with gravy. He is a little high but for now we are @ 3u.
 
wolfey said:
What do you feed your kitty. Teresa & Buddy Wolfe
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Teresa - I feel like I run a little kitty restaurant here! Their main food is Nature's Variety Instinct Raw either rabbit or chicken. They also eat some Fancy Feast classic - but they don't love it. Sometimes they get a little ziwi peak lamb. Sam was quite the kibble addict when we started this whole process and that seems to help when he gets a craving for something crunchier. And Stella and Chewy's chicken. I am sparing on that one since I don't have good information about the actual values.

Both cats are rather picky, but I've found that sprinkling a little Fortiflora on top will get them to try just about anything. I don't know what it is about that stuff, but they both go crazy for it. It really helped in getting Sam off the kibble, and onto wet food.

Do you already have the food chart? http://catinfo.org/docs/FoodChartPublic9-22-12.pdf That's a good place to start in looking at some of the values, and figuring out what Buddy can tolerate. I found figuring out the right food to be one of the most challenging (and one of the most important) parts of this whole process.

Sorry to see you were up so late/early last night. I hope you can get some rest today!
 
wolfey said:
I was up until almost 3:00 a.m, he never got a chance to crash because when he started getting into the 80s, I started giving him FF grilled with gravy. He was a little high this morning but we are staying @3u.
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You'll need a nap today. :)
I'm envious you are able to get green numbers so easily. :) I know it is scary because you don't know how low he would go if you didn't intervene. You've had a crash course in such a short time - how to steer with food if needed and not panicking over a single high number. I think if I recall you've also experienced the wonky strip situation - if the number doesn't seem right take it again.
And you are your mom's caregiver? That and Buddy can be a lot of stress. How are you holding up?
 
Djamila said:
Teresa - I feel like I run a little kitty restaurant here! Their main food is Nature's Variety Instinct Raw either rabbit or chicken. They also eat some Fancy Feast classic - but they don't love it. Sometimes they get a little ziwi peak lamb. Sam was quite the kibble addict when we started this whole process and that seems to help when he gets a craving for something crunchier. And Stella and Chewy's chicken. I am sparing on that one since I don't have good information about the actual values.

Both cats are rather picky, but I've found that sprinkling a little Fortiflora on top will get them to try just about anything. I don't know what it is about that stuff, but they both go crazy for it. It really helped in getting Sam off the kibble, and onto wet food.

Do you already have the food chart? http://catinfo.org/docs/FoodChartPublic9-22-12.pdf That's a good place to start in looking at some of the values, and figuring out what Buddy can tolerate. I found figuring out the right food to be one of the most challenging (and one of the most important) parts of this whole process.

Sorry to see you were up so late/early last night. I hope you can get some rest today!
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Buddy loves kibble. I bought some YA for him but it increased his BG. He was eating FF classic before his surgery. He had started out with RC when we 1st found out he had diabetes, because that is what the vet wanted him to eat. When I found out about the FF classic I managed to get him off the RC and on the FF classic. Then when he came home after his surgery, he would not eat any of the food I could give him except for the RC. I want him to get well from his surgery, then I will change his food. His surgery was last Friday 2/3/17 and a pretty serious surgery.
 
Pati said:
You'll need a nap today. :)
I'm envious you are able to get green numbers so easily. :) I know it is scary because you don't know how low he would go if you didn't intervene. You've had a crash course in such a short time - how to steer with food if needed and not panicking over a single high number. I think if I recall you've also experienced the wonky strip situation - if the number doesn't seem right take it again.
And you are your mom's caregiver? That and Buddy can be a lot of stress. How are you holding up?
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My Mother is 95 years old and lives with me. I have 4 other cats and 2 of them are on medication also.
 
Pati said:
I was my mother's caregiver too. You are so lucky to have more time with your mom. I miss mine.
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My Mother has lived with me since my husband passed away in 2008. In the beginning I did not want to be by myself, so she stayed with me. At my Mother's age 8yrs is a long time and things change a lot.
 
wolfey said:
My Mother has lived with me since my husband passed away in 2008. In the beginning I did not want to be by myself, so she stayed with me. At my Mother's age 8yrs is a long time and things change a lot.
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Do any of you leave your house and leave your diabetic cat home alone. What precautions do you take for the safety of your diabetic kitty if you should leave your house.
 
Hi Teresa,
I live alone and leave Teasel on his own almost every day. I rely on my knowledge of his responses for peace of mind while I'm out. I have almost 6 months of data on his SS to go by. Once in a while I've missed an outing because he threw me a low number but those are rare occurrences.
 
wolfey said:
Do any of you leave your house and leave your diabetic cat home alone. What precautions do you take for the safety of your diabetic kitty if you should leave your house.
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In reading many different threads I frequently see the phrase "if you can monitor" in terms of how aggressive one might be with dosing. If you can't be home a particular day then you wouldn't choose that day to increase the dose, make a diet change, or shoot a dose that previously dropped BG (too) low.

When we travel for our work we have a live in sitter. When we first adopted Morris she wasn't able to test him. We made any changes to his insulin the days we were here (and were conservative even then). I can test him the easiest so we still stick to making changes when we're home. Our sitter does AMPS, +6, and PMPS.
 
I used to leave Gypsy every day for work. My kitties are free feeders so there was food available. As Pati says, generally speaking, we try to make changes only when we can monitor, though I sometimes did it when I couldn't, but I was trying to get Gypsy's numbers down and it was more important to do that then wait for over a week usually. BUT...that was with lots of data and because of high numbers.
 
Kris & Teasel said:
Hi Teresa,
I live alone and leave Teasel on his own almost every day. I rely on my knowledge of his responses for peace of mind while I'm out. I have almost 6 months of data on his SS to go by. Once in a while I've missed an outing because he threw me a low number but those are rare occurrences.
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It scares me to go anywhere and Buddy be home alone.
 
Kris & Teasel said:
Hi Teresa,
I live alone and leave Teasel on his own almost every day. I rely on my knowledge of his responses for peace of mind while I'm out. I have almost 6 months of data on his SS to go by. Once in a while I've missed an outing because he threw me a low number but those are rare occurrences.
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I just took PM reading for Buddy he is @306 does anyone think I should give 3u or less.
 
Pati said:
In reading many different threads I frequently see the phrase "if you can monitor" in terms of how aggressive one might be with dosing. If you can't be home a particular day then you wouldn't choose that day to increase the dose, make a diet change, or shoot a dose that previously dropped BG (too) low.

When we travel for our work we have a live in sitter. When we first adopted Morris she wasn't able to test him. We made any changes to his insulin the days we were here (and were conservative even then). I can test him the easiest so we still stick to making changes when we're home. Our sitter does AMPS, +6, and PMPS.
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I just took Pm reading for Buddy and he is eating right now, he is @306 and I have been giving him 3u do you think that is right or do you think he should have lower dose.
 
Rachel said:
I used to leave Gypsy every day for work. My kitties are free feeders so there was food available. As Pati says, generally speaking, we try to make changes only when we can monitor, though I sometimes did it when I couldn't, but I was trying to get Gypsy's numbers down and it was more important to do that then wait for over a week usually. BUT...that was with lots of data and because of high numbers.
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Buddy's PM reading is 306, do you think 3u would be too much
 
I think 3 would be all right, as long as you can monitor. He's had that dose recently at a preshot of 331 which is basically the same as today.

If you feel uncomfortable with that, you can go down a bit.
 
Rachel said:
I think 3 would be all right, as long as you can monitor. He's had that dose recently at a preshot of 331 which is basically the same as today.
Tonight would not be a good night to monitor, since I slept very little last night and did not take a nap today. I am asking opinion's because after I have problems like last night, I get scared.
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I agree with Rachel. Give him 2.75 u so you can rest tonight, Teresa. A dose of 3 u would probably be OK but you can save it for tomorrow AM. I think when you've accumulated a lot more data and have learned more about how he responds you'll be able to leave him home alone for short periods without worrying.
 
Kris & Teasel said:
I agree with Rachel. Give him 2.75 u so you can rest tonight, Teresa. A dose of 3 u would probably be OK but you can save it for tomorrow AM. I think when you've accumulated a lot more data and have learned more about how he responds you'll be able to leave him home alone for short periods without worrying.
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Did not see post until this a.m., I gave him 2.5 which was not enough, this AMPS was 478. I am going to try and go to church today and so is my Mother. Send Buddy prayers that he will be OK while I am gone to church, and later afternoon when I go to birthday party.
 
wolfey said:
Did not see post until this a.m., I gave him 2.5 which was not enough, this AMPS was 478. I am going to try and go to church today and so is my Mother. Send Buddy prayers that he will be OK while I am gone to church, and later afternoon when I go to birthday party.
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He'll be OK, Teresa. You could give 2.75 u this AM. You need the experience of going out and coming home to find him in one piece to build your confidence. :)

Oops! I see that you gave 3 u. No problem. Test him when you're back from church - mid day-ish?
 
Kris & Teasel said:
He'll be OK, Teresa. You could give 2.75 u this AM. You need the experience of going out and coming home to find him in one piece to build your confidence. :)

Oops! I see that you gave 3 u. No problem. Test him when you're back from church - mid day-ish?
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I am leaving in 1/2 hr., but I was wondering if anyone has any ideas on this. At amps Buddy was @478 @+3 he was @402 and I gave him 3u. Hopefully he doesn't all of a sudden drop, should I leave out some RC wet.
 
Yes, leave out some food. He should be fine. He has gotten some nice blues lately. If you are home between church and birthday, check his levels.
 
I think he should be just fine, Teresa. 2.5 wasn't enough last night, BUT...you got some sleep right? We have to take care of ourselves too or else how can we care for our precious sugar cats? I think you made a good decision last night and he should be fine today. Just relax and enjoy yourself while you're out.
 
Rachel said:
I think he should be just fine, Teresa. 2.5 wasn't enough last night, BUT...you got some sleep right? We have to take care of ourselves too or else how can we care for our precious sugar cats? I think you made a good decision last night and he should be fine today. Just relax and enjoy yourself while you're out.
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Thank you he was just fine.
 
I wanted to ask because I really do not know. What number am I trying to achieve, and when do I reach this number because with this insulin you go down then up. When Buddy was first diagnosed with diabetes the doctor said she would be happy when he was at 250, I don't want to ask her what she meant because she gave him 5u when he was in on a curve. When he got home he was @41. At what number do you intervene and start trying to bring numbers back up. I should have been trying to find these things out a long time ago.
 
We generally think of a kitty as regulated if they are in the lower 200s at preshot and in double digits at nadir (but above 50 which is near hypo range). These numbers are for human meters. Once in those ranges, you can fine tune to get him lower. We consider a cat in remission when they range from 40-120 without insulin for 2 weeks.

If he gets to 50, you would want to feed a little snack of regular food and retest in 20 minutes. If he continues to go down, then give a little of the gravy off higher carb food, retesting in 20 minutes. This is called steering with food. You can relax once he starts to go up and has 3 rising tests. Again those are human meter values.
 
Sue and Oliver (GA) said:
We generally think of a kitty as regulated if they are in the lower 200s at preshot and in double digits at nadir (but above 50 which is near hypo range). These numbers are for human meters. Once in those ranges, you can fine tune to get him lower. We consider a cat in remission when they range from 40-120 without insulin for 2 weeks.

If he gets to 50, you would want to feed a little snack of regular food and retest in 20 minutes. If he continues to go down, then give a little of the gravy off higher carb food, retesting in 20 minutes. This is called steering with food. You can relax once he starts to go up and has 3 rising tests. Again those are human meter values.
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I have a human meter.
 
I think what your vet meant was 250 for a fructosamine, which is an average of BG numbers over several weeks. Since we home test, which is much safer and more accurate, Sue's numbers are what you are shooting for.
 
This morning I just took Buddy's BG he was @130, I did not give food. I am going to wait and retake I can't remember whether I should wait 10 or 20 min. Does anyone have any suggestions.
 
I'm going to run and get ready for work, but I'll check back in before I leave, which will be within that time frame.
 
Wow! Okay, well it doesn't look like he's going up. You can stall up to 60 min with no food and see if he does go up, but if you want to go ahead and feed him now, you can. However, I wouldn't shoot. I hate to say don't give him anything, but he's so prone to drop and I can't really advise shooting at that number...especially when he hasn't risen at all.

It's up to you. You can wait for a bit and try to retest, or go ahead and feed and skip. If you do that, he might be high tonight, but that's okay.
 
If Rachel doesn't get back to advise and since Kris and Sue don't get here until a little later... you can go ahead and feed if you want and give no insulin this morning. You can also stall and check in 20 more minutes and see if he has risen to a shootable number. I find it hard to stall a hungry cat. :) If you skip his shot this am it may be that he has a higher PMPS so don't be upset by that.
 
I'm heading out the door in just a sec. As Pati said, you have options to stall for a little bit longer and see if he has risen. But stalling a hungry cat is difficult, and kind of nerve wracking for you I imagine! So if you skip, don't feel bad...we'll get him back on track.

I'll check back in on you in half and hourish when I get to work, though Kris might be around by then. :)
 
Rachel said:
I'm heading out the door in just a sec. As Pati said, you have options to stall for a little bit longer and see if he has risen. But stalling a hungry cat is difficult, and kind of nerve wracking for you I imagine! So if you skip, don't feel bad...we'll get him back on track.

I'll check back in on you in half and hourish when I get to work, though Kris might be around by then. :)
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Thank you.
 
Pati said:
If Rachel doesn't get back to advise and since Kris and Sue don't get here until a little later... you can go ahead and feed if you want and give no insulin this morning. You can also stall and check in 20 more minutes and see if he has risen to a shootable number. I find it hard to stall a hungry cat. :) If you skip his shot this am it may be that he has a higher PMPS so don't be upset by that.
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Thank you
 
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