Breakthrough day for Kitten!!!!

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Catannc

Catannc

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Holy crap you guys, thank you Gayle for the tip about breaking the food up, it didn't make sense to me last night but I get it now! Huge response to PM insulin!
 
Catannc said:
Holy crap you guys, thank you Gayle for the tip about breaking the food up, it didn't make sense to me last night but I get it now! Huge response to PM insulin!
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I sure like today's cycle; you had a nice string of blues, but then it looks like you are running out of insulin and up she goes by shot time.

Because you are getting that big drop at the front of the cycle, be sure you are breaking up the meal that is usually at shot time into maybe 4 portions...... give 1/4 at shot time and then 1/4 once an hour after the shot..... you need to give bits of food so that you can slow down kitten from diving off a cliff after shots.

If you can slow down the drops, you will get a more steady reaction from kitten.
To me, it does not look like the insulin is lasting the full 12 hours.
 
I will, it pretty much mirrors her am drop today, 200 points. she got her second half of the meal with it, in the future I plan to feed her at +1 both shots to even her out, but based on her previous evening shots I wasnt expecting to see so much tonight.
 
You fed the rest at +2, right? Encouraging comments today. Nice to see him drinking and peeing less and playing more!
Carl
 
I sure like today's cycle; you had a nice string of blues, but then it looks like you are running out of insulin and up she goes by shot time.
...
If you can slow down the drops, you will get a more steady reaction from kitten.
To me, it does not look like the insulin is lasting the full 12 hours.
Click to expand...

Gayle,
That is the way a Prozinc curve is supposed to look like. On a "perfect curve", the AMPS and PMPS would be the exact same number. It is supposed to look like a smile. Up at both ends, down in the middle. It is intended to taper off between +6 and +12. Otherwise we would get overlap, which is not desirable with P's. P users never see a nice flat lantus curve, until kitty is OTJ anyway.

Carl
 
One more comment....you said you got about the same amount of drop on the pm cycle as the am cycle...about 200 points. Try to think of it in percentages, not points. This morning you had a 40 percent drop at +2 and tonight almost a 60 percent drop at +2--that is a 50 percent increase from the morning drop.

I use to think in points also, but it really does paint a clearer picture, if you can put it into percentages!

Edited for poor grammer!
 
I agree. I'm big on percentages when it comes to drops. 60-70% is a good drop, no matter what the numbers are.
 
Ok, of course you guys were right again, 86 +3. Feed again or check how often? She had about 1/6 cup raw ground chicken 1 hour ago.
 
I'd check in 30 minutes, and I'll be online for a while. Do you have any higher carb gravy kind of food, just in case you need it later. The chicken might keep her where she's at once it hits her system, which should happen soon.

Carl
 
Have high carb dry (wonderful hills w/d) and syrup, some other wet that I don't know carb content but a ingredient is sugar, so probably high carb
 
Ah, good. Carl will be on awhile. We tend to let one person handle low numbers during a cycle, so you don't get overloaded with advice and posts. I'll be watching from the sidelines.
 
Let's all use the new thread so everyone is in the same place.

Carl
 
Go to the other thread.....it will get confusing if you continue to post here.
 
Cathy,
That food you mentioned, the canned one. What brand and flavor is it? I can look it up.

carl
 
When you see extremes in the curves, you want to lessen those smiles to Mona Lisa grins, and if it can't be obtained on PZI, then what's wrong with considering a longer lasting insulin that will result in a smoother curve.

Gayle,
That is the way a Prozinc curve is supposed to look like. On a "perfect curve", the AMPS and PMPS would be the exact same number. It is supposed to look like a smile. Up at both ends, down in the middle. It is intended to taper off between +6 and +12. Otherwise we would get overlap, which is not desirable with P's. P users never see a nice flat lantus curve, until kitty is OTJ anyway.

Carl
Click to expand...

it seems that PZI works well for some cats, but others would need to switch to TID in order to get a "nice flat lantus curve". What are the percentage of cats on Ps that go OTJ? I don't think it would feel great for a cat to live a life of extreme curves on P when that cat may be better suited for an L insulin curve.

When a cat's ps is 443, drops to 171 by +4, then starts soaring up to 410 by +12, tells me this cat is on a scary rollercoaster. If you want to stick with this insulin, then you have to do some serious food manipulation to that cliff dive before you hit bottom by +4.
It can be done, but if the cat is still 'running outta gas' way too early in the cycle, maybe it's time to think of time consuming TID, or to switch to a longer lasting insulin.

If a curve has a 300 point range on many cycle, it may be pretty rough on the cat.
I would hope that with an autofeeder, set to give a mini meal hourly between +2 and +6, Kitten's deep curve can be calmed enough to flatten and make Kitten feel better.

By easing the drop, you may see nicer ps numbers and then won't feel a need to increase the dose at all.
 
Gayle,
You have said yourself that you have no experience with the insulin. It's Prozinc, not PZI. It's way too early in the treatment process to suggest a switch. I do not have percentages for kitties who have gone of the juice with the Ps. My Kitty did. Lots have lately. No idea how many.

If people switched insulin every month because it wasn't working perfectly, nobody would have a good remission rate.

Cathy, sorry your thread has gotten hijacked. Debating the pros and cons of the Ps and the Ls should be done in the think tank, not in a new member's thread in an ISG.

Let's take it a day or one cycle at a time, okay. Your kitty is on a really low dose right now, and the numbers look better to me than to other people apparently. You are doing a great job!

Carl
 
I am so sorry this is happening on your posts, Cathy

The protocol on FBMD is that people who have used or use the insulin post on that specific insulin forum. Gail has not used ProZinc as she has said. She obviously has a bias for another insulin. Carl has tried to politely correct her misconceptions so you could understand and not be confused.

We have no problem with people switching insulins, if ProZinc is not working for them. You changed the diet and started testing in earnest 5 days ago. We are very pleased with your progress and hope you are too.
 
Strongly agree with Sue, Cathy. Your baby is doing great and the dose is continuing to drop which is a great sign! There isn't a "quick fix" with diabetes. There's a large learning curve. My cat went OTJ in 10 weeks, and that was really fast. Don't worry about causing "fights". You just keep posting and we'll just keep advising how best for you to proceed. Sue said that if it looks like an insulin isn't working, we of course want you to do what is best for her. Another kitty and bean (Amy and Ruby) decided that they would try lantus last week, and we encouraged her to do that if she thought it was the best thing to do. Another lady, Barbara (and Thumper) also switched with all of us wishing her the best. She'd been here for a long time. No matter what, we all want what is best for you and for Kitten. I think things are going quite nicely on Prozinc so far.

Carl
 
Truthfully, I know nothing about insulin, period, besides I give it and it drops her BG. I do know that this is the insulin I have been given, and with all the changes I've put her through recently, I'd be an idiot to switch her insulin on her right now. It's way too early to tell anything, it will either work for her or not, but right now no one knows. Being that she responds strongly, I have a feeling that she is either stabilizing on her own due to the diet, or is just extremely sensitive to insulin, period. I don't blame/credit the prozinc exclusively,nor have any loyalty to it. All i know is a week ago my cat was regularly in the 500s, and now she's not. Good enough for me for now. Thanks for the support, I'm doing my best!
 
Cattanc, good for you!

Sorry so many of us are being a little testy here. It isn't aimed at you!

I would agree that changing insulins early in the game is poor advice. Just like Start Low, Go Slow (SLGS) is a prudent idea, so is given AT LEAST several weeks for adjustment (to insulin, cat, and caretaker) before switching insulins.

You might also want to look at Janet's excellent post in the announcement section: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=973

I'm impressed by your efforts and your calm nature!

_Rebecca
 
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