Boris Conjestive Heart Failure

Status
Not open for further replies.
Sandy and Boris

Sandy and Boris

Member
Some of you may already know Boris, he has been on FDMB for over 3 yrs. Boris would be 15 this April, but very unlikely that will happen. He is on Levimer only 1.5 units and doing very well as far as his diabetes goes. We had a vet visit yesterday because he has been having difficulty breathing for some time now. Last Thanksgiving he was very sick and since then I changed his food in case it was the fancy feast. Put him on Friskies and reduced amount gradually in hopes he would lose some weight.
The vet said he is in Congestive Heart Failure, the weight gain is not from food, it is fluid. He said that it would be risky to stick a needle in and drain some of the fluid, in fact that kind of scared the crap out of us so we chose not to.

We brought him home with lasix pills, the vet did give him lasix injection as well. Increased his Atenolo to 2x a day, Lasix 2x a day. He is also Hyper T and that has been under control. I give him Mirilax everyday, he is having a problem pooping. In fact I hoping for that today.
I can see that the Lasix is helping a little and he is very alert today and interested in seeing what we are doing and what Little Kitty does.

The way he looks at me I can see that he is not ready to go yet and the vet thinks he is going to be slow about it. Eugene seems to think that somehow he is going to slip by easily at home. I hope that happens but I’m terrified that I will see him suffer. I know Eugene doesn’t want him to have any pain and I know neither of us wants to see him go. I’m so heart broken. Sitting here looking at his bg notebook and his things. I lost MisMew (his mother) last Feb. and I still have her bed in my bed and so many things that I just can’t move. My Boris notebook is always front and center on my desk, today it’s making me cry.

If anyone has any experience with CHF I would welcome any thing you would care to share.
Thank you
Sandy
 
(((((Sandy))))) (((((Boris)))))

I'm so sorry Boris isn't well. I don't know anything about CHF, but I am sending many healing vines. I know whatever happens, Boris knows he is loved.
 
Sandy --

How about sending a PM to Jess/Earl? Jess specializes in cardiology.

I know that humans can manage CHF for some time with restricting salt and fluids and the proper medications. Is is possible for your vet (or you) to get a consult with a cardiologist at U of Wisconsin vet school? I know there is a board certified vet cardiologist in suburban Chicago I just don't know what's nearest to you.
 
(((Sandy))) I want you to give a great big smooch to Boris from me. You are such a wonderful cat mom and he is so fortunate to have found you. I can only imagine what you are going through. He is so much like Oshi that it is breaking my heart too. But I am sure that you will treasure the gift of this time and he will be in no hurry to leave. Be good to your momma bean, ((Boris)) and stay out of mischief.
 
i would like to pm Jess but I can't figure out how to do it. If anyone else can give her a heads up I sure would appreciate it.
(((Johanna))) Oshi, remember we used to say it was like they were brothers.
 
((((Sandy)))) ((((Boris))))

I have no advice, but you're in my thoughts. Boris is a good boy and I know you will do the right things for him.
 
Sandy, I'm so sorry to hear this. Did your vet take x-rays today? I'm concerned that perhaps there might be more to do for Boris, if he was diagnosed more specifically in terms of his heart. Sienne mentioned a specialist -- are you near any specialty/critical care facilities?

Cats can have heart failure fluid in three main areas, plus around the heart itself (the heart sac, the pericardium). The fluid around the heart sac is usually scant, though. The other places are around the lungs (pleural effusion), in the lungs (pulmonary edema), and in the belly (ascites). The location depends on what side of the heart is affected, and also on the cat himself. If the fluid is around the lungs or in the belly, it can be tapped with a needle. This is by far the easiest and quickest way to relieve the fluid. In most cases, however, the fluid sits right in the lungs and can't be pulled out except by oral drugs. Heart failure can be difficult to diagnose and treat in cats and that's why I mention a specialist.

You can add to your Boris notebook, "RR". THis is respiration rate, how many breaths he's taking per minute. Watch him for 10 seconds when he's at rest (not moving, and hasn't just laid down) and mulitply by 6. It should be ~30 or less. If his Lasix is helping him, his RR should start improving if it is higher than 30-35 now.

Please feel free to post back here any questions you might have, I'll check the thread later. You can also search here on my name and CHF, I've written a lot of posts to answer other people's specific questions.

Please keep us posted.
 
Thank you Jess.
he has fluid around his heart and his abdomen, x-rays showed it right and left, there is also what he called "something suspicious near his heart." This also showed on the right and left x-ray. We live in a small town, my vet doesn't even have a us machine. So no to specialists. I don't think he like the idea of tapping the fluid, he kept saying it's risky and he might hit a intestine or something. Scared us.
I'm not sure where your saying I could read some of your posts to others specific questions. I haven't used the board much since it changed.
I am wondering if there is any certain food that should be avoided. I also was wondering what if any bad effects lasix could have on him. So far I can see some improvement with it, his belly isn't as hard as it was. Still away to go though.
Thanks again

Thanks to everyone that pm'd Jess for me. I guess brain isn't working at full speed today.
 
Sandy and Boris said:
I'm not sure where your saying I could read some of your posts to others specific questions. I haven't used the board much since it changed.
Click to expand...
Sandy, if you go back to Jess' response, a little below her signature there is a profile button. click on it and it'll bring you to Jess' profile. on the right side, below total posts, there is a link for search user's posts. click on that link, and then on the right, on top of the results, search these results: try typing in CHF.

Repeat all of the above, this time type in congestive heart failure. that should bring up a bunch of Jess' posts to others.
 
just wanted you to know i'm thinking of you.
harry has pleural effusion and that is pretty easily tapped. but lasix helps heart kitties pretty well. just have to watch the kidneys. but wish we could know more about the mass. just give him a lot of lovin. he'll appreciate that the most.
 
Hi Sandy

Well I'll be honest with you ...

Sandy and Boris said:
he has fluid around his heart and his abdomen, x-rays showed it right and left, there is also what he called "something suspicious near his heart."
Click to expand...

This doesn't sound like typical heart failure--to have it in the chest and abdomen together. It's possible, but just less likely. You will know soon enough because Lasix will work for heart failure but not for fluid that is not heart failure.
I don't think he like the idea of tapping the fluid, he kept saying it's risky and he might hit a intestine or something. Scared us.
Click to expand...

I'm sorry to hear that. All small animal vets should be comfortable getting a fluid sample, at least from the abdomen, so it can be sent to the lab and tested. If Boris continues to have problems, I would consider seeking out another vet for this purpose.

I am wondering if there is any certain food that should be avoided. I also was wondering what if any bad effects lasix could have on him.
Click to expand...

At the moment I wouldn't worry about changing food. When cats are in heart failure, they can lose their appetite and it's most important to keep them eating. Lasix also forces them to pee out some electrolytes and eating replenishes these. Lasix can be dehydrating, so cats and dogs on Lasix need to drink fresh water and eat well. In the long-term, cats with advanced heart disease can benefit from diets that are lower in sodium: 0.5% on a dry-matter basis. Dry foods and cheaper cat foods tend to have higher levels of sodium for whatever reason. I would keep him eating now, though, whatever he wants to eat.
 
Thanks again Jess and all my friends here for your support and help. It's a comfort to have you all with us.
He isn't drinking much but he does get water from his food because I always add it. I bought him some of his favorites today, going to keep him eating with what ever he wants.
I don't know how accurate I am with rr, I came p with 42, will try again later. I don't have a clock with a second hand so I'm setting the microwave for 10 seconds.
We do see a difference in him today, belly is not so hard.
I think my vet would do a tap if I asked, I don't know what was up with him yesterday, he just seemed reluctant.
 
((sandy))
this is jess's area of expertise so i didn't want to butt into thread but i also didn't want you to think that i have not been following every word that you've written around net. so many ((hugs))!
i also find it strange your vet didn't want to tap, at least for sample to send to lab. seriously it is not technically hard to do (heck i've done it way more than once). so if you're in that situation again some day don't be scared, there is plenty of room in an abdomen no one is going to hit and destroy some vital organ, k?
i'm glad he has perked up since starting the lasix. just a quick piece of advice, with his mega-colon issues and the dehydrating factor of lasix, be careful of constipation (something heart kitties are prone to anyways) and do try to get as much oral water in as possible and keep close eye on litter box. and i would also suggest keeping close eye on BG's, with all the changes there might be times you'll need to shoot lightly.
i wish hooterville had more options on vet care, getting an echo and abdominal u/s would be next step here. what does local vet do when a pet needs an u/s~ refer them to a place far far away or is there by chance (we have that here, not a cardio vet, IM vet, but better than nothing) a vet that makes the rounds of the rural vet hospitals w/ an u/s machine?

i wish there was more i could do, feel so helpless.
however one thing i can help with: "Eugene seems to think that somehow he is going to slip by easily at home", hmm... we need to have a discussion about what to expect and what to do. call me when you are ready. i'm here. (((hugs))
~jojo
 
Sending many many cyber hugs (((((((((((((((((((((((((((SANDY)))))))))))))))))))))))))

Merlyn had CHF. He was on lasix, he had pleural effusion. He also tended to constipation, and that was how his was diagnosed. ( He couldnt poop and we had to go to ER where xrays were taken) I do believe that for Merlyn anyway, it was hard for him to push out the poop because he was more tired. So agreeing with Jojo that keeping him pooping is important. When Merlyn was constipated he wouldnt eat. Merlyn did manage with it, and lived 2.5 yrs post diagnosis.

Crossing all paws for Boris.
 
Sending hugs!

My dog has CHF and lasix is a miracle drug for her. She doesn't have fluid around her heart/lungs, just fluid in her lungs. Do arm yourself with info. Like whether enapril would be a supplemental treatment also (if no kidney issues). Make sure with lasix she has access to water all the time.

I know nothing about feline CHF. But on the CHF dog forum, lots of animals do go on to improve and outlive expectations, some by years.

Keeping you and Boris in my thoughts.
 
No worries Jojo, I always know your here with me.
I'm regretting not letting him do the tap, I didn't push it because of the fear in Eugenes face and Roger sounded so reluctant to do it. I'm going to talk to him about that again, hopefully today.
He did say that Boris does not have megacolon. I sure wish he would poop, just a small ball yesterday.
His numbers have been great and I did give him a reduction as of last night. I felt it was time, I'm making sure he is eating before I shoot him, so far so good. Gravy foods and even laxatone are not affecting his bg's.
Was on the phone with Jenn last night and she counted the seconds for me I came up with 35 on his rr, we did it twice.
He actually walked about 8 feet away from the table today, big move. Although to get him back there to test I had to pick him up.
If I get to talk to vet today I might be able to get him to stop over in the am just to take a look see at him.
thanks for all the well wish's everyone. Now say it with me "Boris, this is not the day". That is what I'm telling him everyday. :)
 
Sending prayers for Boris. You sure are out there in the middle of nowhere.....I checked and no where are there any cardiologists near you.
 
Sorry to see your Boris is sick. Lasix can be very hard on the kidneys so you want to encourage water and maybe have the kidney values tested frequently. The foods that are better for the kidneys are higher in carbs/lower in protein so I don't think a diet change would be good with the diabetes unless the kidneys did show problems.
I would echo the sentiments of finding a specialist or high end animal hospital within driving distance and find out what is really going on. The answers might not be wanted, but at least you'd know more on how to proceed and treat. I am surprised that your vet could diagnose CHF based on just Xrays. Mine could only narrow it down to a handful of things when we found fluid and we went on for ultrsounds and ultimately an echocardiogram and only then were we able to find the real answers.
 
So, sorry...I lost Cecil to CHF. And then my poor Jessie to tumor in front of her heart, so I know what you are going through. Just cherish the time you have with Boris, I know how hard it is :sad: .


:YMHUG: Sandy - Dottie, Tilly & Jeter
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top