Bob at the vet - rutrow....UPDATE. Bob is too sweet.

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Carl & Polly & Bob (GA)

So Bob has been out of sorts lately. Last visit, the vet suggested he may need dental work. Right now, I'm hoping that's still the case.

For the last couple of weeks, his appetite has been crappy. My first thought was "flavor burn out" so I've been altering the menu. All low carb, just different choices. But some days he eats OK, other days, not well at all.

He had been eating more than two cans of FF a day and gained weight, so a little less was fine by me. But the past few days, getting one can in him has been a challenge.

He's also been drinking out of the water bowl, something he hasn't done in two years. And peeing more often, but not "buckets" like he did when he was dx'd.

So my thinking has been - his teeth are bothering him, so he isn't eating. And he's drinking water because his tummy is hungry.

Today, he didn't touch breakfast. So rather than wait till Monday, I took time off and brought him to the vet. She's going to do a blood panel and I will go back before closing to pick him up and find more out.

Six weeks ago, I tested him and his BG was 80.

More drinking....more peeing....see where I'm going with this?
I poked his ear just before leaving for the vet this morning. Both ears in fact since I didn't like what the first test said.

Fasting BG, four hours after barely touching breffis.

382, then 385.

Rut row.

I'll be back to ask for help once I have his lab results.
 
Re: Bob at the vet - rutrow....

Oh carp! Bob, I pray, this is 'just' a dental problem, and not what you're thinking. Hmmm, I'm a mind reader now? :roll:
I know it's odd to hope for an infection, but please Lord, something nice and easy to fix with AB's, would be nice. :smile:

Oops, I was talking to Carl, not Bob :oops:
 
Re: Bob at the vet - rutrow....

Well, I hope that the BG is reflective of the need for a dental. But, if not, does this mean you're going to become a Lantus Lander?
 
Re: Bob at the vet - rutrow....

Bob! Please be okay, and just need a dental or something (that ABs can fix, like Barbara said). Wishing you luck with the vet visit.
 
Re: Bob at the vet - rutrow....

Sienne's jumping the gun. Sending vines to get Mr. Bob back to the lagoon where he belongs.
Liz
 
Re: Bob at the vet - rutrow....

Sienne and Gabby said:
Well, I hope that the BG is reflective of the need for a dental. But, if not, does this mean you're going to become a Lantus Lander?
Click to expand...
I might post here, but he'll be on PZI. ;-) Honestly, my work schedule would make TR impossible for me. I couldn't shoot 12 hours apart or be home to monitor lows that lasted any length of time.
 
Re: Bob at the vet - rutrow....

Oh Carl...I am sorry.
I'm sorry Bob is not feeling well and sorry for you cause it's scary. Hope they get to the bottom of whatever it is soon so things can get back in check.

I just had a long overdue dental done on Hank and turns out he had all kinds of issues I had not realized that had gone untended far too long.
So hard to know what is going on with them. I say it again..it would be SO helpful if they could talk. :?

I'd feel rutrow too..but hang in there. Hopefully if it is tooth or infection he will get taken care of and bounce back quickly.

No matter what you will know what to do. let us hear when you know more. Vines to you and Bob.
 
Re: Bob at the vet - rutrow....

I hope it turns out to be something simple that can be easily treated. Sending good test results prayers.
 
Re: Bob at the vet - rutrow....

Carl

Boy do I hope this is a blip and just the need for a dental and not anything else. You know no matter what insulin you use if you need to give him some support for a bit, we got your back!

Sending healing vines, prayers, etc. Please let it just be a dental he needs.
 
Re: Bob at the vet - rutrow....

Carl - oh no!! All paws crossed here that all Bob needs is something "simple" like a dental. We'll all be watching for Bob's results.

And you know that no matter which way things turn out - you are more than welcome to hang out with us.
 
Re: Bob at the vet - rutrow....

Ugh! I hope it's something quick and easy. Sending good vetty vines your way. Feel better soon, Bob!
 
Re: Bob at the vet - rutrow....

Dammit....

OK, looks like Bob is back on the dance floor.

Not dental.
I got -
1000ml lactated ringers laced with Potassium.
6 syringes pre-filled with .2 whatevers of Bupe.
Clavamox for 7 days.
Fortiflora
Insulin in the mail. (compounded PZI just like last time)

Here are the numbers that were outside of "normal" ranges.

BG 522 (screw the vet's AT and the vet stress - his SS is going to say "385".
Potassium (low) 2.5
BUN (high) 41
ALT (high) 141

Everything else is in the normal range.

100 ml of sub-q fluids daily
2 clavamox per day
.2 Bupe as needed
1 can of A/D to see if I can manage to get him to eat. If not, he gets syringe fed, yay!

I'm very sad. For him. I can do this, but I hate that he has to go through all this crap again.

I'm going to spot check his BG for the next 3 days, and he'll be getting his first shot Tuesday evening after the PZI gets here in the mail. Dose will depend on his PMPS, but my plan is 1u. I have to establish a baseline somewhere.

That gives me 3 days to create his SS, something I never did the last time. My true hope is that this is just a blip from a P-titis flare up, which is what the vet is hoping as well.

So yeah, not the greatest of days but it is what it is.

Thank you all. I am so so happy that this place exists. Your support is priceless.
 
Well shoot Carl!! We were all hoping for another report!!

You're an excellent caretaker though and we know you'll get him back on the road to the Falls soon.

Feel better soon Bob!!
 
O Carl - major bummer. At least you have the LL family and you know what to do. Bob couldn't be in better hands. Fingers, paws and tails crossed it's short-lived. :YMHUG:
 
From your other condo today:
Carl & Bob said:
Couple of questions -

How much fortiflora do you put in or on the food?

Are there any vids showing how to give Bupe? How do I know I'm getting it in the right place?


Never had the opportunity to use these before.
Click to expand...

The directions on the FortiFlora say to give 1 packet per day, so I just sprinkle half a packet on in the morning and the other half at night, or a little on top of each meal.

If you can get him to keep his head still, you actually can feel a "pouch" area along the outside of the bottom molars.
A lot of vets prescribe a higher dose than needed of Bupe, so if he acts too loopy, you can try to lower the dose.

You are NOT a Newbie :smile: but I know how you feel :-|
 
Carl, watch the potassium going forward. You may remember Tucker was OTJ for a while before going back on the juice and he had started losing weight for months before we finally figured out he was Hypokalemic. I could not get his potassium into healthy ranges easily, he needed K pills daily and still had two crashes. From researching online it looked like about 40% of senior kitty can become lowK kitties, but it was google searches, I didn't read medical journals or anything like that. His low K was not the cause of his needing insulin again, he also had a brain tumor and had to take steroids.

I'm really sorry you and Bob are going through this, if there's anything we can do to help, please let us know.
 
Hoping he got into some Halloween candy and this is short lived! Oh, Bob! How I wish it were one of your tothies - for you and your Dad's sake! At least your Dad isn't a fumbling newbie so you will be lucky to bypass that step. Hang in there!

B
 
Dyana, is .2 bupe high?

Jennifer,
Thank you. Yes, I know I have watch his K more closely. He suffered from low K way back when too. I got him into the low-normal range then, but haven't had it checked in over a year. I'll go with the laced fluids for now and then most likely switch to powder/tabs afterwards.

Thanks everyone. Bob says thanks too.
 
Oh darn! I love when you post, Carl, but not when it's for Bob. *sigh*. I prefer to be optimistic, and hope it's temporary.

I assume you are going to use the Fortiflora because of the Clav, so I don't know if there is a preferred dose. I just sprinkled it on Checkers' food, when he had tum troubles. He loved the stuff, so I also used it as an app stimulant.

Bupe has to be put on mucus membrane. If Bob won't let you put it under his tongue, the easiest is to put it in the cheek pouch.
It's flavorless, so he shouldn't mind. Checks came to accept it readily. I think he knew it made him feel better.

Checkers' dose was .1....for back pain.
 
Aw Carl. I'm so sorry that you and Bob gotta go through this junk again. Hopefully it will be a quick trip, in and out in no time flat. My fingers and Twice's paws are crossed. Sending hugs and positive energy your way :YMHUG: cat_pet_icon
 
You can try the 0.2 and see how he does and if he is too wobbily and acting way out there, then halve it and see how that does. What is he on bupe for?
 
So sorry about this news CARL...but as has been said, you are a wonderful caregiver and you will know what to do.

I just had to give Hank Bupe. iF you swirl your own tongue around your mouth top and bottom of your teeth, THAT 'canal' is where you want to squirt the bupe.
Be sure to not let him swallow, you want it to soak into the cheek.

We also used fortiflora for the first time recently. it was tricky because he was not feeling well and if he wouldn't eat all his food, then he wouldn't get his Fortiflora dose fully either. So I would gauge how much to use, at least initially, on how much he is eating per sitting. It may be that you sprinkle 1/5 or 1/6 the package over mini meals through the day for him to get full packet.

Hopefully this will not be a long visit back. But I do know Bob is one lucky boy to have you for his bean..no matter what.

continued vines for you both :YMHUG: :YMHUG:
 
So what is the vet diagnosing besides Bob being extra sweet? I'm assuming with the bupe the thought is pancreatitis? (The ALT may be elevated in p'titis but you'd be better off getting a Spec fPLI.) Is there an infection that the vet is treating with clavamox? (Was the white count elevated?) Did you get a creatinine level or was it normal? (Elevated BUN is interpreted differently if creatinine is also elevated.)

Is Bob nauseated and not eating as a result? For many years, Jojo would recommend Pepsid for kitties with p'titis. It may be worth considering if you think that's why Bob's not eating. More recently, people have been asking for a bigger gun anti-nausea med such as ondanstron (Zofran) or Cerenia.

I would try sprinkling a couple of pinches of FortiFlora on Bob's food. You want the smell of it to attract him to his food. You're not using it to help with diarrhea. While a probiotic shouldn't be an issue, some cats can find it constipating.

You cross-posted back to Dyana while I was typing. Did the vet do a Snap fPLI in the office? I wouldn't rely on an ALT or lipase level to diagnose pancreatitis.
 
Sienne and Gabby said:
So what is the vet diagnosing besides Bob being extra sweet? I'm assuming with the bupe the thought is pancreatitis? (The ALT may be elevated in p'titis but you'd be better off getting a Spec fPLI.) Is there an infection that the vet is treating with clavamox? (Was the white count elevated?) Did you get a creatinine level or was it normal? (Elevated BUN is interpreted differently if creatinine is also elevated.)

Is Bob nauseated and not eating as a result? For many years, Jojo would recommend Pepsid for kitties with p'titis. It may be worth considering if you think that's why Bob's not eating. More recently, people have been asking for a bigger gun anti-nausea med such as ondanstron (Zofran) or Cerenia.

I would try sprinkling a couple of pinches of FortiFlora on Bob's food. You want the smell of it to attract him to his food. You're not using it to help with diarrhea. While a probiotic shouldn't be an issue, some cats can find it constipating.

You cross-posted back to Dyana while I was typing. Did the vet do a Snap fPLI in the office? I wouldn't rely on an ALT or lipase level to diagnose pancreatitis.
Click to expand...

Sienne,
The vet is theorizing high BG due to a pancreatitis flare up. She did not run a Spec fPLI (at least it isn't on the lengthy invoice they gave me. She also said he showed signs of pain when she felt around his abdomen, that it felt "tight" as well, but that she didn't feel it was due to constipation. He hasn't pooped all that much, but he hasn't eaten enough the past few days to warrant doing so. When he goes in the box, he isn't straining or crying. He is dehydrated, so he'll need squids daily for a few days.

Is white blood count abbreviated as "WBC" on the lab work? If so, it says 8.21 (normal range says 5.50 - 19.50), so no, that wouldn't be elevated, right? I'm thinking hold off on the clavamox? My sense was that she was prescribing an AB on a "just in case" basis? She did look at his teeth. He has plaque, but no signs of swelling, redness, and didn't mind her finger in his mouth feeling around his gums (other than just not wanting a finger in his mouth). No signs that it "hurt". She said yes, he needs a cleaning, but does not feel that there's anything critical or immediate going on that would cause an infection.

CREA says 1.4 mg/dl which looks like the middle of the normal range
BUN//CREA listed right below that says "29".

Bob is not acting nauseated. No licking his lips, and I can't remember him ever vomiting since before he was diagnosed the first time. I put a bit of fortiflora on his food, and he dove in, but only ate about 1.5 ounces. I think I'm going to try syringing in a little while. I don't want to give him any bupe on a half empty tummy, do I?
 
With the liver enzymes elevated, he could have a little bacterial infection somewhere so I would give the clavamox. IMHO. Especially if you know he tolerates it.

The dosing for bupe is based on weight but has a fairly liberal window. In other words, for Gus, when he weighed 9/10 lbs, I could give him up to 0.25ml tid. I don't remember if you said what Bob weighs but if he's 9-11 lbs, I think 0.2 mls is an ok place to start. You can even give it just bid and see how he does with it. If it makes him wonky, cut it back. I currently give Gus 0.1 ml bid and he's bright, alert, but also pain free.

LRS comes with potassium and I'm not sure if what's in it is enough to help Bob....but I believe you had this issue before with him, correct? Keep in mind that diabetic cats also tend to run a little low in potassium but not for the same reasons that CKD cats do. I know you know that you have to really monitor the K+ closely if you decide to supplement with Tumil K. I think even for a diabetic kitter, his K+ is purty low, pardner.

Hey...PM me....I'll do his SS for you. It will take me two minutes. It's the very LEAST I can do for all you do here.

Hang in there....we'll hope that as soon as the pancreatitis is under control, he'll be back at the Falls. And...have you seen my Primer on Pancreatitis?

Feel better BOB!!!!

PS...sorry to confuse you on Friday. Yes, it is Lupita Friday but she called in "broken car".
 
I gave Hank his bupe even when he wasn't eating well. he was eating some..kind of like Bob....an ounce here or there.
But it was a fraction of his usual intake, guessing maybe 1/3 to 1/2 at best for several days. He did fine.

I see you got your SS up already . Wow are you on top of it! Great job getting everything in gear.

I can only think this will make you even more empathetic than you already are..if that is possible.

What else do you need right now??
 
Well...poop! ohmygod_smile Shasta and I are sending healing vines for BOB! Good thing he has you as his daddy! Hugs & Scritches :YMHUG:
 
Oh Carl, So sorry to read this. Hopefully it will be just a short visit and Bob will be back at the falls! Hope he is feeling better, and his appy improves.
 
Oh Carl, I'm sorry to hear this. Poor Bob. Muffin has p'titis flares every few months. So far, she's only returned to the juice for 2 of them, and it's only for 2 months at the most. We are hoping that this is very temporary for Bob as well. :YMHUG: cat_pet_icon
 
Carl -

So sorry to hear about Bob, but you've done the whole FD thing before and you know you can do it, again. Bob is so fortunate to have such a loving dad and couldn't be in better hands. i hope you get the appy and other issues worked out soon and may his time back on the juice be a short one.

great BIG HUGS to you both -

Libby (& Hershey, too!)

Hey, Bob - Going back on the juice won't be so bad; your dad is a pro. (And, I bet it'll mean shrimp treats more often!) Sorry you're aren't feeling well, though - get better SOON!!! - Your buddy, Hershey
 
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