BG rate increase after eating?

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jbeausoleil

Member Since 2013
I am just curious if anyone knows approximately how soon and/or how quickly a cats BG starts to rise after eating?
(low carb, high protein wet food diet in my case)

And since I never seem to get on here much - my update is:
looks like Izzy is getting herself close to remission!

She has been really good at self regulating through her free feed diet routine and by all accounts I suspect most of you would wonder why she even was put on insulin because her home testing high was 130 and low was 63 but on average has sustained a range of 85 - 105 since July 1st. The two weeks prior to July 1st were her first 2 weeks on insulin and ironing out her dose, 1st week was 1u Lantus 2/day - 2nd week went down to .5u and has remained at that until last week when she suddenly dropped to the 63. She has since been at .25u 2/day and staying at about 88-103. At nearly all times her am & pm have been within about 2-5 points of each other so the long lasting is working very well with her free feeding. That and her mid day low is staying up near 85-95 from her free feeding.

Her lows were each at the vet while on day long curves before I was set up to home test. I think she hit those lows due to refusing to eat while at the vet but they were looow - 40 & 43. They monitored her though and she did not show any clinical signs of hypo so they were pleased with her none-the-less.

Fructosamine came back 2 weeks ago at 283.

Life is looking good for Izzy! And lucky for me she likes the PetSmart brand of pate style food which is even cheaper than FF :)
Cheers from Izzy

Guess I should have qualified the BG numbers - she is being tested with the AlphaTrak2 and was tested with it at the vet with their kit as well. The two kits are quite close in this case.
 
Here are some glucose reference ranges used for decision making using glucometers. Human glucometer numbers are given first. Numbers in parentheses are for non-US meters. Numbers in curly braces are estimates for an AlphaTrak.

< 40 mg/dL (2.2 mmol/L) {< 70 mg/dL for an AlphaTrak}
- Treat as if HYPO if on insulin
- At nadir (lowest point between shots) in a long term diabetic (more than a year), may earn a reduction.

< 50 mg/dL (2.8 mmol/L) {< 80 mg/dL for an AlphaTrak}
- If before nadir, steer with food, ie, give modest amounts of medium carb food to keep from going below 50 (2.8).
- At nadir, often indicates dose reduction is earned.

50 - 130 mg/dL (2.8 - 7.2 mmol/L) {80 - 160 mg/dL for an AlphaTrak}
- On insulin - great control when following a tight regulation protocol.
- Off insulin - normal numbers. (May even go as low as the upper 30s (1.7 mmol/L){60s for an AlphaTrak}; if not on insulin, this can be safe.

= 150 mg/dL (8.3 mmol/L) {> 180 mg/dL for an AlphaTrak}
- lowest no shot limit for ProZinc, PZI, or other non-depot insulins, after you have been testing at least 5 weeks and reduced your limit gradually - maybe 10 mg/dL{.5 mmol/L} per week.

> 150 mg/dL (8.3 mmol/L) {> 180 mg/dL for an AlphaTrak}
- At nadir, indicates a dose increase may be needed when following a tight regulation protocol.

200 mg/dL (11.1 mmol/L) {230 mg/dL for an AlphaTrak}
- no shot level for beginners; may slowly reduce to 150 mg/dL (8.3 mmol/L) {180 mg/dL} for long-acting insulins (Lantus, Levemir, and ProZinc) as data collection shows it is safe

180 - 280 mg/dL (10 - 15.6 mmol/L) {may be 210 - 310 mg/dL for an AlphaTrak}- Any time - The renal threshold (depending on data source and cat's renal function) where glucose spills into the urine.
- Test for ketones, glucose is too high.

>= 280 mg/dL (15.6 mmol/L) {may be >=310 mg/dL for an AlphaTrak}, if for most of the cycle between shots
- Uncontrolled diabetes and thus at risk for diabetic ketoacidosis and hepatic lipidosis
- Follow your insulin protocol for dose adjustments
- Test for ketones; if more than a trace level of ketones, go to vet ASAP.
 
You're ready to learn the drop method of dosing.
Take a syringe and fill it with 0.5 units of water (colored water may be easier to see).
Carefully twist/squeeze the plunger and count the number of equal sized drops are in that 0.5 units.
Practice until you can do it the same each time.

Now, how many drops are < or = the 0.25 unit dose?
Starting at that, begin dosing by number of drops. Gradually reduce and see if the numbers stay
good. Continue reducing all the way to 0.

OR, see what happens with no insulin for a day. If good numbers, try another day and so on.

After 14 days of no insulin and glucose in normal numbers (see preceeding chart), its official remission.
 
The drop dosing is what my vet explained to me the last Friday of August when her fructosamine came back looking very good.
He wanted to keep her on .5u BID Lantus for about a month longer for healing purposes with the caveat to test and monitor very closely.
We were estimating the first week of October to begin the weaning process but her little body seems to have begun on its own!

I am very grateful my vet explained this since he just got transfered to a new clinic out of town - up and over the mountain pass of course.

We have been at 0.25 u BID since the PM dose on last Wed. Sept. 18.
So far the high has been about 90 and the low about 80 and each of the numbers are still at really good times indicating the insulin is working the full 12hrs and Izzy seems to be keeping nadir in check with her own feeding schedule.

I will indeed practice the drop method though and appreciate the recap immensely - I had not thought to try it with colored water so that will be helpful. I guess if she is continuing to do well on .25u BID then I will hold off on dropping further yet?

Do you do this for a week or just like when we all first started and had to let their little bodies get accustomed to the dosing?
Then if all is going well drop a little and hold that for a week, etc?

I really miss my vet - As I have read through so many of the posts I find that I happened upon a really good and very well informed vet who was also patient while explaining each of my many questions!!!! He was/is quite young and cannot be that long out of school so I find that very promising that perhaps the schools are teaching with all the new research on feline diabetes. He also had a student intern that he made sure was a part of following our case this summer and with the immediate positive affects I am hopeful she takes that back to school!

A new generation with hope!!!!

Thanks for the replies!
Cheers from Izzy
 
If she goes below 50 mg/dL, she earns a reduction of a drop or so.

Edited to add: on a HUMAN meter; it's 80 mg/dL on an AlphaTrak.
 
BJM said:
If she goes below 50 mg/dL, she earns a reduction of a drop or so.
Click to expand...

Is that below 50 with the AlphaTrak or should I keep an eye out for a slightly higher number?

Thanks!

I guess it is time to brave going to the new vet so she knows what is going on.
I hope she is as good as my recent vet.

Cheers from Izzy
 
If she drops below 80 using the Alphatrak, she has earned a reduction to 0.1U (basically one drop). If she stays in normal numbers, 80-160 on the Alphatrak, for a week, we would consider that time for another reduction with the Lantus, down to zero and the start of an OTJ trial.
 
Sorry - the AlphaTrak meter didn't jump out at me - could you maybe edit your signature, highlight the meter and instead of leaving it as Normal, click on the drop down and make it Large?
 
Ahhh, will do!
I only got the info on there this morning so you would not have seen her meter without reading the whole string. Sorry about.
J
 
BJM said:
Much better!
Click to expand...

LOL!

I can't get in to see my new vet until this weekend :P
Work schedule with a tiny company is challenging at the end of summer construction surveying season! First time on 5 yrs.
But so far Izzy is keeping her mid day BG right in the 80's so I'm happy.
Still staying under 100 at her two pre-shots. We've got 12 cycles like this on the 0.25u of Lantus BID :D

Cheers
 
Sheesh,

I was supposed to start my Izzy on 1u Lantus BID the first week after the diet change and her first full curve.
As I now have those handy 1/2 unit marked syringes and studied them for a bit tonight - I am pretty sure I actually started her on .5u BID.
The plunger is pretty close to a half unit in width upon closer examination. But better to error on the that side than the other!

After the first week of injections she earned a reduction to 1/2u BID of which I probably gave her closer to .3-ish units BID and have for the last 2 months.

Now that we have the nifty 1/2 unit marked syringes and she is getting .25u I think I am ACTUALLY giving her the correct dose and her numbers are hang out right where any good non-diabetic cat should :D

Duh . . . I'm sure glad I did not err on the other side of the plunger head :P

Makes me feel better about how she has been doing and I was already super happy with her progress!
Maybe that is why she went hypo at the vet - they probably gave her the correct dose which was evidently too high anyway.
So much for me trying to help my vet help my cat.

Cheers
 
Thank you for the link to the photo!

We stayed at 80 - 103 for 13 cycles.
Tonight at what would have been the 14th cycle she was 77!

So we are going to try dropping a drop and I will set my alarm to check on her at about the next nadir.
The last 3 days she stayed between 80 - 88.
I think her body is healing really well but now I'm nervous.

But first I shall go back and read what you all said to make sure I'm clear;)

Thank you so much for helping even though I have posted so little!
Jean & Izzy
 
Hey, looks like Izzy may be trying to go OTJ and join Wink and the gang at the falls. Wink sure does appreciate the less pokies, now that he is a diet controlled kitty. We'd love it if you were successful in getting Izzy there for a while also.
 
I think she is working toward OTJ testing!

My previous vet was going to start weaning her off next week. He got transferred 2 weeks ago:P
The very day I went in to thank him I came home to cat with a BG of 63!
I monitored her and made the call to lower her dose.

It has been a very successful two week cycle at the lowered dose and she is creeping down yet.
We go follow up with a different vet (who was my vets mentor - thank heavens) this Sunday.
So just to be sure I am going to put poor Izzy through a full curve Saturday so I can take the curve in to the new vet.
She is not aware of the lowered dose so I want to back my presumption of lowering the dose myself.

We are currently hanging very well at 0.25u Lantus BID!

Hopefully by the middle to end of October we may be doing the OJT dance!

When we start the official OTJ test I will open a new post :D

I might get to sleep in on a weekend once again!
Cheers!
Jean & Izzy
 
Looks like a couple of my posts did not post.
I've been having issues with my computer though :P

So Izzy is on day 7 of OTJ trial and holding her own at AlphaTrak2 BG numbers between 78 - 93!

Really like her new vet but expected it since my previous wonderful vet worked with the current vet.
Jean & Izzy
 
Day 12 of OTJ trial and holding between 78 -91 BG's!
The only noticeable thing is she is eating closer to 4.5 oz/ day this week, down from 5.5 oz/day. I'm guessing the decreased appetite may have to do with not having extra insulin in her driving her natural desire to keep BG' s from going too low? Energy is great. Litter box results normal. I only just got a scale last week so I do not have enough data regarding her weight yet but now taking on a weekly basis.
I guess my only question at this time is of the appetite change is normal for kitties gone in remission?

thanks!
J and I
 
If there is more insulin than glucose, hunger kicks in.
No extra insulin, no need to eat more.
 
Tomorrow will be day 14-ish. Izzy's last injection was the morning of September 29 a couple hours before her vet visit and subsequent advice to go OTJ for a 14 day trial. So that was 2 weeks ago Sunday making Monday a full 14 days of no insulin> She has not budged past 91 on the AlphaTrak2 so I am feeling VERY confident we made it!!!!

Now to just stay in remission :D
I have a scale and now know what signs to look for.
We go back for the normal 6 month visit and a blood workup just to see how things are going - that is next month.
Her first injection was 6/15/13 and her last injection was 9/29/13.
Started 1u Lantus BID.
Dropped to .5u one week later.
Dropped to .25u 9/18/13.
OTJ trial began 9/29/13.

She actually seems to be doing even better off of the insulin.
Food & water intake down to normal levels with the resulting output to the litter box showing very normal results.
She probably should have gone off the insulin a week or two earlier but we got caught between vets and I did the best I could with the help of you good folks!

My little fighter!
cat_pet_icon
 
:mrgreen: :mrgreen: CONGRATULATIONS!! :mrgreen: :mrgreen:​


Tips to stay OTJ

We say a cat is in remission if the cat can maintain BG levels for 14 days between 40-120 with most of that spent under 100. However, please keep in mind that once a diabetic always a diabetic.

1. Never feed dry - not even treats. If you change wet food types, be 100% sure the new food is also low carb and same low carb % as your current food. Some cats are very carb sensitive and an increase from 3-6% to 8-10% can spike the BG’s. Don’t feed if you aren’t sure!
2. Weigh every 2 weeks to 1 month to watch for weight changes. Too much of a weight gain can cause loss of remission.
3. Measure blood once a week, indefinitely. You want to catch a relapse quickly.
4. No steroids or oral meds with sugar - remind your vet whenever giving you any medication. Always double check.
5. Monitor food intake, peeing and drinking. If increasing, a sign of losing remission.
6. Regular vet checks for infection such as dental , ear or UTI. And get them treated quick!

If she does fall out of remission you need to be more aggressive and resolve issues/ back on insulin as soon as possible as the window for a second remission is tight if any.
Wendy
 
Thanks Wendy (& Tiggy)!

I will be posting your remission tips up on my fridge!
We passed - today was BG 83 and maintaining weight nicely.

First week OTJ BG levels from 78 - 93.
Second week a tighter 81 - 87!

I promise to test and weigh every weekend or if anything seems out of the ordinary.
She does go back for a full blood test workup next month as part of her bi-annual exam.

As any of you can probably tell I only get on here on the weekends so I will continue to check in once in awhile and give the occasional update.

Izzy and I both say thank you for the tips!!
 
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