BCP PZI Insulin Junk so probably move on to something else.

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rbrumbaugh82

Okay well I think I got screwed with this insulin. I only have about a quarter of the bottle left and just got it last Friday. It is supposed to be a 100 unit bottle and I know I haven't used 30 units yet. Not only that but I am just not getting anywhere with this as his numbers do the talking and he can't stay in the 200s and hasn't even gotten below 240 on this yet. So I guess just because it is a cat insulin doesn't mean it will work wonders for your cat. So my next option would be Lantus. I know many people have used Lantus as their go-to insulin and that eventually got their cats to OTJ. So my question is, where did you guys purchase your Lantus from and how much did it cost you? I have saved the VetRx website that BJ sent me because they sell Lantus Pens 100 units for about $80. However, the directions say that you do not refrigerate the insulin and that you must discard it after 28 days. The vial itself is over $200 so did you guys all afford to pay that much for a vial of insulin? I just can't imagine any mouth problems would prevent his insulin from dropping because just a month ago he was in the 100s but even since switching insulins he can't even get below 240.
 
You said " I only have about a quarter of the bottle left and just got it last Friday. It is supposed to be a 100 unit bottle"
Which BCP insulin did you purchase? If I recall if you purchase it you can get it in either U40, U50 or U1o strength and get either 5 or 10 ml.
They all come in the same size vial.
If you got 5 ml of U100 that would be 500 units.

Yes, the Manufacturer says that once opened, whether refrigerated or not, Lantus is only good for 28 days. However, everyone here uses until you run out or it is no longer effective. If yo get the 3 ml disposable pens most users can use the whole vial until it goes bad.

Yes, sometime bovine insulin like BCP does not work well in some cats. Form my Badger, Lantus, Levemire and BCP did not work well. N did work but had problems like you experienced. However, the BCP is working good from my MurrFee.
 
I paid just under $300 for a 10ml vial of Lantus from Costco.

I believe you can refrigerate the pens when you're using them for cats. Refrigeration damages the syringe part of the pen, not the insulin. And as you don't use that for a cat (you have to use the pen like a mini-vial with disposable syringes), I think it's OK to refrigerate them. Obviously because I have the vial, that does get refrigerated.

I haven't tried using this myself (only just found it on the internet) so I've no idea where, if or how it works, but you could try this to get some discount on the price
http://www.helprx.info/lantus-discounts-coupons
It looks as if they have discounts for both the pens and the vial.

The one proviso I would make if you switch to Lantus is that it's probably going to take longer than his original insulin to start working well. I notice from your spreadsheet that you change doses frequently and by up to a full unit at a time. While I do completely understand your reasons for doing so and that you want to get Poopers into better numbers quickly, that method is not going to work with Lantus - you have to be consistent with the timing of the doses and only make dose changes at a maximum every 6 cycles (3 days) as the dosing has to be based on the nadir over the course of a few cycles, not on pre-shot numbers or one-off spot readings so you really do have to be patient and take the time to get the data in place before starting to change up the dose. Please take a look at Rosa's ss to see how long it took to get her into consistently improving numbers and how few dose changes I made during that time. There are many people using Lantus for their cats, and if you take a look at the Lantus/Levemir forum you'll be able to take a look at the protocols for using Lantus. And you'll be able to take a look at other people's spreadsheets too to see just how the dosing is done and how carefully we make dose changes. I can't stress enough the importance of being patient with the doses of the longer-lasting insulins for Pooper's safety.
 
Larry and Kitties said:
You said " I only have about a quarter of the bottle left and just got it last Friday. It is supposed to be a 100 unit bottle"
Which BCP insulin did you purchase? If I recall if you purchase it you can get it in either U40, U50 or U1o strength and get either 5 or 10 ml.
They all come in the same size vial.
If you got 5 ml of U100 that would be 500 units.

Yes, the Manufacturer says that once opened, whether refrigerated or not, Lantus is only good for 28 days. However, everyone here uses until you run out or it is no longer effective. If yo get the 3 ml disposable pens most users can use the whole vial until it goes bad.

Yes, sometime bovine insulin like BCP does not work well in some cats. Form my Badger, Lantus, Levemire and BCP did not work well. N did work but had problems like you experienced. However, the BCP is working good from my MurrFee.
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Hey Larry, it is the 100 unit one so probably 1mL one.
 
manxcat419 said:
I paid just under $300 for a 10ml vial of Lantus from Costco.

I believe you can refrigerate the pens when you're using them for cats. Refrigeration damages the syringe part of the pen, not the insulin. And as you don't use that for a cat (you have to use the pen like a mini-vial with disposable syringes), I think it's OK to refrigerate them. Obviously because I have the vial, that does get refrigerated.

I haven't tried using this myself (only just found it on the internet) so I've no idea where, if or how it works, but you could try this to get some discount on the price
http://www.helprx.info/lantus-discounts-coupons
It looks as if they have discounts for both the pens and the vial.

The one proviso I would make if you switch to Lantus is that it's probably going to take longer than his original insulin to start working well. I notice from your spreadsheet that you change doses frequently and by up to a full unit at a time. While I do completely understand your reasons for doing so and that you want to get Poopers into better numbers quickly, that method is not going to work with Lantus - you have to be consistent with the timing of the doses and only make dose changes at a maximum every 6 cycles (3 days) as the dosing has to be based on the nadir over the course of a few cycles, not on pre-shot numbers or one-off spot readings so you really do have to be patient and take the time to get the data in place before starting to change up the dose. Please take a look at Rosa's ss to see how long it took to get her into consistently improving numbers and how few dose changes I made during that time. There are many people using Lantus for their cats, and if you take a look at the Lantus/Levemir forum you'll be able to take a look at the protocols for using Lantus. And you'll be able to take a look at other people's spreadsheets too to see just how the dosing is done and how carefully we make dose changes. I can't stress enough the importance of being patient with the doses of the longer-lasting insulins for Pooper's safety.
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Well honestly, I am trying to be patient with this insulin but its been almost a week and he still has the same persistent numbers which are in the 300s. That stresses me out because these numbers make me feel like his pancreas is dead and therefore other organs in his body could be suffering due to the high numbers. I would have thought by now I'd be seeing 100s showing up or atleast below 240.
 
I will also emphasize what April said about using Lantus.
You will REALLY need to find a pair of Patience Pants that fits very well.

It is not an insulin well suited to changing doses on a day to day basis. It is a depot insulin that relies on consistent dosing and giving shots as close to 12 hours apart as possible. The dosing of Lantus is not dependent on the preshot numbers. The number that really matters, and the number that dose adjustments are made according to is the nadir number.
There are two primary protocols followed here with Lantus.
The "tight regulation protocol" and the "start low, go slow" protocol. No matter which one you choose, there are many people here who use them, so you won't have any problem finding people with lots of experience.
 
Carl & Polly & Bob (GA) said:
I will also emphasize what April said about using Lantus.
You will REALLY need to find a pair of Patience Pants that fits very well.

It is not an insulin well suited to changing doses on a day to day basis. It is a depot insulin that relies on consistent dosing and giving shots as close to 12 hours apart as possible. The dosing of Lantus is not dependent on the preshot numbers. The number that really matters, and the number that dose adjustments are made according to is the nadir number.
There are two primary protocols followed here with Lantus.
The "tight regulation protocol" and the "start low, go slow" protocol. No matter which one you choose, there are many people here who use them, so you won't have any problem finding people with lots of experience.
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Let me emphasize that I am not trying to change dosages daily. I ONLY changed my dosage because the lowest dosages were not doing anything to his numbers so I upped
the amount. Yet, I experimented with 4 units but see that it does nothing to lower it to healthy range. So I may as well just stay at 3 units since no amount is working.
 
My point is that with Lantus, you will need to stay with the same dose for at least three days, and when you adjust, you will only increase by .25u or at most, .5u at a time. How much you adjust the dose will be determined by his nadir tests.
Do your syringes have half-unit markings, or just whole unit markings?
 
I do completely appreciate that you're trying to be patient, and that the insulin you're using now doesn't work the same way as Lantus. And also that you're not trying to change the doses so much. But I felt I needed to make the point that with Lantus you really might not see good numbers for a week or so - you could almost say that it's expected that you won't see quick drops into the 100s or even the 200s to begin with. The thing with Lantus is that even if he stays up in the 400s for the first week or so, you have to hold the dose for the minimum amount of time without being tempted to increase too early. I'm not saying you're not doing your best - you're clearly incredibly devoted to Poopers and doing everything you can to get him well, I just think it's important that you fully understand what you might be getting into with Lantus and that taking the dose up too quickly while the depot is still building could result in a hypo for Poopers as his depot fills if you've increased the dose thinking it's not working. It's incredibly difficult to be patient through those first few weeks - I know, I've been there! And if I didn't make the point that it has to be handled differently and anything went wrong for you, then I'd feel bad for you and Poopers.
 
Carl & Polly & Bob (GA) said:
My point is that with Lantus, you will need to stay with the same dose for at least three days, and when you adjust, you will only increase by .25u or at most, .5u at a time. How much you adjust the dose will be determined by his nadir tests.
Do your syringes have half-unit markings, or just whole unit markings?
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No they have .5 markings. They are the U100 syringes
 
manxcat419 said:
I do completely appreciate that you're trying to be patient, and that the insulin you're using now doesn't work the same way as Lantus. And also that you're not trying to change the doses so much. But I felt I needed to make the point that with Lantus you really might not see good numbers for a week or so - you could almost say that it's expected that you won't see quick drops into the 100s or even the 200s to begin with. The thing with Lantus is that even if he stays up in the 400s for the first week or so, you have to hold the dose for the minimum amount of time without being tempted to increase too early. I'm not saying you're not doing your best - you're clearly incredibly devoted to Poopers and doing everything you can to get him well, I just think it's important that you fully understand what you might be getting into with Lantus and that taking the dose up too quickly while the depot is still building could result in a hypo for Poopers as his depot fills if you've increased the dose thinking it's not working. It's incredibly difficult to be patient through those first few weeks - I know, I've been there! And if I didn't make the point that it has to be handled differently and anything went wrong for you, then I'd feel bad for you and Poopers.
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Yeah well bad luck is currently running on my side with insulins. You would think a cat specific insulin would work on all cats because the insulin is supposed to closely resemble what they produce so you'd expect it to build up and start working naturally to lower their numbers to where they should be. However, that isn't happening with Poopers. :(
 
It does seem to be - it really does. I hope you can get some Lantus for him - I'm not sure I'd have ever got Rosa into good numbers with anything else as she was so insanely high to begin with. I think I only got maybe 2 or 3 readings below 600 from her in the first week or week and a half so an in-and-out insulin wouldn't have done anything much for her I don't think.

I know every cat is different, but I agree you'd expect to see some sort of result from one or other of the 2 insulins you've tried. For whatever the reason, Lantus and Levemir seem to have good results in a lot of cats even though they're human insulins. If you can, as the current insulin isn't working the way you want it to, it would be worth trying to get a prescription for Lantus or Levemir I think to see if the depot and the resulting overlap between doses gets you better control for him. I'm not sure which is more expensive out of the two, but I'd have thought either might be worth trying with him as it seems that when they do start working they gradually keep numbers more and more consistent over the full 12 hours which is of course what you're looking to achieve long-term.
 
I don't understand. You've only been using the PZI since the night of the 20th. All the doses added together equals 32.5 units of insulin. The vial shouldn't be anywhere close to half empty.
To MY knowledge, vials only come in 5ml and 10ml sizes. If it is "U100" concentration, that would mean that there are either 500 units, or 1000 units, in the vial. Even if it were U40 concentration, there would be 200 or 400 units in the vial.

I am wondering if the vial you received was "repackaged". There should be no such thing as a "1 ml" vial. Did it come directly from BCP in Texas?
 
For what it's worth....

Until you can switch to Lantus, here's what I would do:

Go back to 2u, and only shoot every 12 hours. Give it a few days to really see what a consistent dose on a consistent schedule will do. And try to get a "mid-cycle test" on as many cycles as you can get one. Somewhere between +4 and +6 after the shots.

You will need that data in order to figure out what a logical starting dose on Lantus will be. It could very well be that 3u and 4u are actually too high of a dose. And that might be what is behind the repeated pattern of high flat numbers. Too much insulin can look just like too little insulin on a Spreadsheet.
 
Carl & Polly & Bob (GA) said:
Can you take a pic of the vial and post it?
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That would be good.
A couple of days ago there was a member here (using PZI) who found that she'd been using U40 insulin with U100 syringes, but hadn't been using the conversion chart, and so was giving less than half the dose...

And isn't it the case that Poopers may have a mouth infection? (That could also keep numbers high and 'flat'.)
.
 
Carl & Polly & Bob (GA) said:
I don't understand. You've only been using the PZI since the night of the 20th. All the doses added
together equals 32.5 units of insulin. The vial shouldn't be anywhere close to half empty.
To MY knowledge, vials only come in 5ml and 10ml sizes. If it is "U100" concentration, that would mean that there are either 500 units, or 1000 units, in the vial. Even if it were U40 concentration, there would be 200 or 400 units in the vial.

I am wondering if the vial you received was "repackaged". There should be no such thing as a "1 ml" vial. Did it come directly from BCP in Texas?
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I agree, you should not have gone through a vial this quickly. Can you post us a picture of your vial? Also, can you post us a pic of the syringe you are using and mark it for your normal dose? It is possible you are using the wrong mark on the syringe.
 
I didn't take a pic of the vial but on the label it said 5mL vial and 100U insulin. However, this crap isn't working so I guess even though it is a cat insulin his body must be too stubborn to accept it and work. :( Just can't afford $300 to buy the vial of Lantus but its stupid to think that you'd have to possibly discard the insulin after 28 days.
 
manxcat419 said:
It does seem to be - it really does. I hope you can get some Lantus for him - I'm not sure I'd have ever got Rosa into good numbers with anything else as she was so insanely high to begin with. I think I only got maybe 2 or 3 readings below 600 from her in the first week or week and a half so an in-and-out insulin wouldn't have done anything much for her I don't think.

I know every cat is different, but I agree you'd expect to see some sort of result from one or other of the 2 insulins you've tried. For whatever the reason, Lantus and Levemir seem to have good results in a lot of cats even though they're human insulins. If you can, as the current insulin isn't working the way you want it to, it would be worth trying to get a prescription for Lantus or Levemir I think to see if the depot and the resulting overlap between doses gets you better control for him. I'm not sure which is more expensive out of the two, but I'd have thought either might be worth trying with him as it seems that when they do start working they gradually keep numbers more and more consistent over the full 12 hours which is of course what you're looking to achieve long-term.
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So if by some chance Pooper's has dental problems, could I still expect to see lower numbers even if he had issues? I just have not had him under 240 since being on this stuff. Yeah for the most part it keeps his numbers consistent but only in the 300s which is too high. I just think even if he had inner body issues the insulin should somehow still get his numbers into the lower range.
 
Carl & Polly & Bob (GA) said:
For what it's worth....

Until you can switch to Lantus, here's what I would do:

Go back to 2u, and only shoot every 12 hours. Give it a few days to really see what a consistent dose on a consistent schedule will do. And try to get a "mid-cycle test" on as many cycles as you can get one. Somewhere between +4 and +6 after the shots.

You will need that data in order to figure out what a logical starting dose on Lantus will be. It could very well be that 3u and 4u are actually too high of a dose. And that might be what is behind the repeated pattern of high flat numbers. Too much insulin can look just like too little insulin on a Spreadsheet.
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I wish I would have read this before I gave him his insulin this morning because I gave him 3 units. I'll go back to 2 units this evening.
 
Lisa and Witn (GA) said:
I agree, you should not have gone through a vial this quickly. Can you post us a picture of your vial? Also, can you post us a pic of the syringe you are using and mark it for your normal dose? It is possible you are using the wrong mark on the syringe.
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No, I know I'm not using the wrong dosage marking. I am very careful to what I give him. I know I have the U100 syringes and I mentioned what the label said on the vial. 5mL of BCP PZI(Bovine) insulin and then it says 100U/mL
 
Well obviously it couldn't be 500 units because there would def be a lot more insulin left. If this was only 50 units then I got screwed and cheated because it should be 100 units. I can't take a picture because it shows personal info on it which I do not want to disclose.
 
rbrumbaugh82 said:
So if by some chance Pooper's has dental problems, could I still expect to see lower numbers even if he had issues? I just have not had him under 240 since being on this stuff. Yeah for the most part it keeps his numbers consistent but only in the 300s which is too high. I just think even if he had inner body issues the insulin should somehow still get his numbers into the lower range.
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It's quite possible that dental issues could cause his BG to remain a lot higher than you want it to be. Any sort of infection or anything that causes him any pain can raise BG significantly - hundreds of points in some instances. I have seen others say that their cats' levels started to improve significantly after dental work (and depending on the cat and the nature of the problem suitable recovery time as well). If dental issues are the problem then it isn't going to make much difference what insulin you choose - if something's artificially raising his numbers then they're going to be raised regardless of insulin therapy. The other side to this is that once the dental issue is resolved, if that's what it is, he might then need less insulin than he's currently getting - then you'd need to watch him for low numbers as he started to feel better.
 
Sure hope so. Would enjoy not having to switch insulins if the culprit was his mouth or an infection that can be treated and be gone.
 
Hey April, can I ask you again and I know its shown on your SS but what exact foods do you feed Manx? Do you give him any dry and if you don't and if your cat wanted dry food what would you feed him? Do you give any treats? My cats are spoiled and like treats but want to find healthy low carb ones in addition to the dry/wet. I just give them Turkey and Giblets FF classic with also the Chicken classic for my other cats. Pooper's just gets the Turkey and Giblets and I feel like he is getting bored with it. I know most other classics from 9 lives and other brands contains soy, flour and gluten in them and those are ingredients to avoid.
 
I don't give dry food at all any more - my cats were completely dry fed until Rosa's diagnosis, but now they're on all low-carb wet. I mostly feed the Friskies Special Diet Pate, but they do sometimes get Friskies, Fancy Feast or 9 Lives Classic pates for variety. Rather than taking a 'can't feed if it has even a tiny amount of carb in it' approach, I experimented to find brands and flavors that don't affect Rosa's BG and that they both still enjoy.

They would probably both still kill for dry food and crunchy treats but those just aren't an option any more. I haven't been able to find anything they'll reliably eat as treats apart from occasionally a small piece of cooked meat. But I know a lot of people use either freeze-dried or fresh boiled chicken.
 
What Friskies special diet food are you talking about? Don't know if my local stores have the special diet. I think they do but its the Ocean Whitefish one and I don't want to feed fish products. In addition, don't these products have wheat gluten, flour and soy in them?
 
Nevermind. The only one I would go for with Special Diet Friskies would be Turkey and Giblets. However, stupid stores around here don't carry it. Why do they call it Special Diet? Seems like the same ingredients in FF classic?
 
rbrumbaugh82 said:
The label says 5mL BCP PZI(Bovine) Insulin Vial Cat 100-U/mL
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U100 insulin means there are 100 units per ml. If it was a full 5ml vial, then the vial contains 500 units of insulin. A 10ml vial would contain 1000 units.
A syringe full of insulin would only contain 30 units of insulin, which is why I don't understand.
At 2u per shot, you should get 250 shots out of just that vial.

I used U40 insulin and syringes. My 10ml vial contained 400 units of PZI. It lasted ten weeks and there was still some left when Bob went into remission. He got about 150 shots of various doses, the biggest dose being 4u.

Can one of you folks who uses u100 insulin please check my math?
 
Yeah well if this had 500 units of insulin in it then it still would not be at the halfway mark yet on the bottle. When I look at bottle it is about half empty with the white liquid settling at the bottom of the bottle with the top half being clear liquid before mixing it. It would have probably 3/4 left if it was 500 units but for some reason they may have gotten label wrong or something and just put 100 units in it.
 
The description of the label says you should have 500 units (5 ml times 100 units per ml (U100)).
If you can take a photo of the vial standing up so I can see the level i can determine about how much you have left based on me using an old via of BCP insulin.

It could be that the mouth issue have goon worse and that is why the BCP seems not to be working. If you still have some N you can that a a cyle of two to see if it acts the same as before.

As I said i a previos post, most caretakers can use a a 3 ml disposable pen of Lantus/Levemir before it goes bad. The 28 day for Lantus/40 days for Levemir is what the insulin passed, not the full capability. Those are human insulins some almost all humans would use up a pen/vial before the 28/40 day period.
 
rbrumbaugh82 said:
Yeah well if this had 500 units of insulin in it then it still would not be at the halfway mark yet on the bottle. When I look at bottle it is about half empty with the white liquid settling at the bottom of the bottle with the top half being clear liquid before mixing it. It would have probably 3/4 left if it was 500 units but for some reason they may have gotten label wrong or something and just put 100 units in it.
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All of the shots you have given so far only add up to about 35 units. In a 500 unit vial, it should hardly look like you have used any of it. Like 90%+ full still.
 
rbrumbaugh82 said:
Yeah well if this had 500 units of insulin in it then it still would not be at the halfway mark yet on the bottle. When I look at bottle it is about half empty with the white liquid settling at the bottom of the bottle with the top half being clear liquid before mixing it. It would have probably 3/4 left if it was 500 units but for some reason they may have gotten label wrong or something and just put 100 units in it.
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The same vial is used if 10 or 5 ml of insulin is provided. When filled with 10 mil it is not full to the top. When filled with 10 ml the BCP is filled to about 3 1/2 cm from the bottom. I just tested than on an old via I had.
 
On your syringes, what is the first number printed on the scale?
 
Larry and Kitties said:
The same vial is used if 10 or 5 ml of insulin is provided. When filled with 10 mil it is not full to the top. When filled with 10 ml the BCP is filled to about 3 1/2 cm from the bottom. I just tested than on an old via I had.
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That's interesting Larry. So a brand new vial containing 5ml would look half empty before you used it?
 
Larry and Kitties said:
The same vial is used if 10 or 5 ml of insulin is provided. When filled with 10 mil it is not full to the top. When filled with 10 ml the BCP is filled to about 3 1/2 cm from the bottom. I just tested than on an old via I had.
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So my label says 5mL 100-U/mL so if it equals atleast 100 units it still should be more than half bottle left. Just don't know if they screwed up the order or what?
 
rbrumbaugh82 said:
Nevermind. The only one I would go for with Special Diet Friskies would be Turkey and Giblets. However, stupid stores around here don't carry it. Why do they call it Special Diet? Seems like the same ingredients in FF classic?
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It's called Special Diet because it's lower in phosphorus (it's marketed as "helping your cat maintain urinary tract health") and carbs than the other Friskies Classic Pates.

I paid $269 at CVS in early December for a vial of Lantus (I didn't even know about the pens then). Believe it or not, that was with a coupon the pharmacist found online for me. I kept it refrigerated and my vet said it would probably be good for several months that way. In our case, Henry was only on insulin about a month before he went OTJ so I wasn't able to test that out, but plenty of others on here have used theirs way longer than the label's stated 28-day expiration. You just have to take care of it (refrigerate it, don't shake it, don't shoot any excess insulin back into the vial, etc.).
 
rbrumbaugh82 said:
So my label says 5mL 100-U/mL so if it equals atleast 100 units it still should be more than half bottle left. Just don't know if they screwed up the order or what?
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The vial will be less than half full when you received it since the vial is made to hold 10 ml with an extra volume for maybe 3 ml. The 5m of U100 insulin is 500 units of insulin. If you place the vial on a table how high up is the top of the liquid. My guess is about 1 1/2 cm since 10 ml would be about 3 1/2 cm and you used some of the 5 ml.
 
A few questions. I looked at your spreadsheet and in your notes you indicate that Pooper wasn't feeling well just prior to his numbers really increasing. What was going on then? In what way wasn't he feeling well? Is it possible that something related to that bout of illness is still effecting his numbers?

As far as the Lantus goes, I had a very difficult time finding anyone to sell me an individual pen (http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/new-diagnosis-where-to-purchase.132057/) and ended up just having to buy the 10 ml vial. I hope your local pharmacies are more reasonable, but there are several suggestions on pharmacies to try throughout that thread. I ended up going with Walgreens where a 10 ml vial was $243.99 after I paid an additional $20 (good for 1 year) to enroll in their pet prescription plan. The plan also takes a little money off of the cost of syringes and any other cat meds that you get through them.
 
You'd think for the price of Lantus the dang stuff would work miracles for every cat. lol
 
As for the under the weather.. I am sorry but that was me who was under the weather.
 
rbrumbaugh82 said:
You'd think for the price of Lantus the dang stuff would work miracles for every cat. lol
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The cost used to be quite a bit less, about $60 a 10 ml vial I think. However, the closer the manufacturer of Lantus gets to the end of their patent, and a lawsuit with another company that was going to start making a very similar product, the more the price has gone up and up. It's price gouging as far as I'm concerned. I can't even imagine what it's been like for humans who use Lantus since they go through quite a bit more of it than our cats do. In the link to the thread I sent you there are also some links for Canadian pharmacies that sell pens or vials for quite a bit less. The only problem can be the shipping time.

rbrumbaugh82 said:
As for the under the weather.. I am sorry but that was me who was under the weather.
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Shoot, I thought I might be onto something there. Did I see in another thread you started that you have noticed some bacterial growth in Pooper's mouth (or was that someone else)? Dental issues can definitely effect BG levels.
 
Yeah I am just praying that its only bacterial problems in his mouth and that is contributing to his high bg levels. Hopefully they can just clean his teeth and if he has an infection then treat it with meds and a day or two after his bg levels will start to really drop into healthy range and see my boy happy and feeling better. All he does now is sleep but still purrs really loud and of course eats and drinks plenty of water. Just pray for better times tomorrow when I take him to the vet in the morning.
 
bsmith said:
The cost used to be quite a bit less, about $60 a 10 ml vial I think. However, the closer the manufacturer of Lantus gets to the end of their patent, and a lawsuit with another company that was going to start making a very similar product, the more the price has gone up and up. It's price gouging as far as I'm concerned. I can't even imagine what it's been like for humans who use Lantus since they go through quite a bit more of it than our cats do. In the link to the thread I sent you there are also some links for Canadian pharmacies that sell pens or vials for quite a bit less. The only problem can be the shipping time.


Shoot, I thought I might be onto something there. Did I see in another thread you started that you have noticed some bacterial growth in Pooper's mouth (or was that someone else)? Dental issues can definitely effect BG levels.
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So what special diet cat food from friskies do you feed? I only seen the Turkey and Giblet special diet so didn't know how low of carbs the food is. I am only feeding Pooper's Turkey and Giblets FF classic and would love to find a variety to feed him so that he isn't just getting stuck with one food only. The crazy thing is that Purina came out with Purina Pro Plan True Nature Chicken and Liver Entree and from using the nutritional calculator provided to me from here the food has less than 2% carbs. It was like 0.5 for wet dry carbs. Yet when I fed it to Pooper's it made his numbers go up.
 
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