Awaiting confirmation of diabetes diagnosis

Status
Not open for further replies.
A

Astasmum

Member Since 2013
We are waiting for the results of a second blood test to eliminate any other possible cause that would account for a blood sugar level of 22. My cat is 12 and had long been on the hefty side, so I wasn't too concerned when I first noticed her gradually losing weight. I just thought she was getting old, and that older cats tend to be skinny, and maybe this was a natural part of her aging. In the last week, however, she began to have an odd way of using her back legs and we got her to the vet ASAP.

First of all, I'm so thankful that this is a realistically treatable disease. Then I'm thankful for my so kind and wonderful vet, and next I'm thankful for finding this site. Presuming Asta does have diabetes, I want to give her the best diet possible. For now the only thing she wants to eat is canned salmon. I'm not at all averse to continuing to feed her a high protein human grade food but I wonder what other things I need to include to properly meet her dietary needs. Is a homemade diet based human grade ingredients a reasonable venture?

Thanks for your time!
 
For feline nutrition, a great reference is Cat Info. There's info on home made diet, a printable file of nutrition infor on commonly available US foods, and more.

In North America, Friskies pates are probably the least expensive canned foods that are under 10% calories from carbohydrates; Fancy Feast Classic pates are next.

Change gradually to avoid GI upsets (diarrhea, vomiting, refusal to eat). This may reduce the glucose levels by 5. (100 mg/dL)

By the way, that 5 tells me you're not in the US; we have folks worldwide and may have some country specific info we can give you, if you let us know where you are.
 
Hi and welcome to the FDMB, the best little message board in the universe to help you learn about feline diabetes and how to best help your cat.

What's your name? What's your girl cat's name?

What other blood test is being done fo confirm?

What other symptoms? P/U (polyuria)? P/d (polydipsia)? Eating tons but still losing weight?
 
Hey there and welcome to the board!

What was she eating before?

Has the vet discussed types of insulin yet? Best ones for cats are Lantus, Levemir or Prozinc..
 
I'm Deborah and my cat's name is Asta. She was eating wellness dry food but I switched her to wet before I even got her diagnosis because her dandruff was clearly showing her dehydration. She was a fat kitty and she lost a lot of weight, it came on gradually, as far as we could see, and then seemed to accelerate in a two week period. About the time it became clear to us that she was really sick she began to turn away from the wet food (innova senior cat food), so I started giving her canned salmon. She's still only interested in that. The vet gave us Hill's diabetic wet food and she won't touch it, even mixed with salmon, so I'm looking at a homemade alternative. I'll be starting with the powdered bonemeal option because a grinder is not in my budget after the vet bill.

Asta did get the confirmed diabetes diagnosis and responded well to the glucose curve. I read up on everything I could and came to the vet with all the glucose monitoring supplies ready. He gave us caninsulin for her and I gave my first injection last night (all by myself because my fiance has a needle phobia). I had a little trouble filling the syringe without any bubbles. In the back of my mind I kept thinking that if you inject a bubble into someone they die...but that's only if a bubble goes into a vein, right? This is a different kind of injection, I think. The only thing I read about bubbles is that they can throw off the insulin measurement by taking up space in the syringe. Anyway, I watched Asta closely for signs of death and she never showed any. I also measured my own glucose for practice. Asta's a two injection a day kitty.

Question: how often should I test her glucose?

Thanks to everyone for being here!

Deborah and Asta
 
Many cats get sick of the hills really quick because its a strong liver flavour so I am not surprised. Here is a good website all about cat nutrition and even tells you how to make your own http://www.catinfo.org . Although many of us here feed fancy feast classic pates,friskies pates or wellness grain free canned because they are low carb which helps to control blood sugar. You have to be careful though as a food change will reduce blood sugar and so her insulin needs may drop so home testing is critical?

What country are you in? Reason I ask is that caninsulin is not a good insulin for cats - especially if your goal is remission -if you choose an insulin like lantus, levemir or prozinc you have an 84% chance of your kitty going into remission within 6 months if you are home testing and feeding low carb wet too.

yes its only if you inject the needle into a vein that a bubble is an issue. As long as you are tenting the skin and inserting the needle at a shallow angle to the body you should be fine - but try and get rid of bubbles as they will mess up your dose.

What meter do you have?
For testing
- You should always get a test before every shot. As a newbie you dont want to shoot under 200 until you have enough data to know if its safe.

-Its good to try and test midday around 4-6 hours after the shot to see how low the insulin is taking her and be able to adjust dose if too low. If your schedule allows - otherwise at weekends

- one test before bed to see what her nighttime plans are. If the before bed test is lower than the evening preshot test you might want to set the alarm for a test in a few more hours as the cycle may be an active one.

Wendy
 
Caninsulin was developed for dogs and works well for dogs.With a cat's faster metabolism, Caninsulin does not last long enough. Vetsulin is the US version of Caninsulin. Same issue, too short duration in cats to last for a full 12 hours. That leaves your cat with NO insulin for long periods of time and high BG (blood glucose) numbers.

Vets need to stop treating cats as if they were small dogs and start prescribing better proven insulins for cats.

Even the Merck Veterinary does not recommend Caninsulin for cats but says Lantus as the first choice.

Of course, if you are in the UK, the antiquated laws still require you to use Caninsulin for cats first, even though there are 3 better insulins to use for cats.
 
Thank you, Wendy and Deb, for your prompt posts and information. I took some time to monitor Asta's BG over the course of the last couple of days. Before her shots it's really high still, 18-20. The lowest I've measured at five or six hours after her shot is just under 8 and the highest is 12. I obviously need to discuss the dosage and insulin type with my vet. It's really frustrating to find I've got all these vials of dog insulin now and that I need to educate my him about the appropriate treatment for Asta. To this end, I'm writing everything down in a diary and taking notes from your posts.

Wendy, would you happen to have a source for that 84% chance of remission statistic? It helps to have the research. Oh, I live in Vancouver, BC, Canada and the meter we have is a Bayer Contour Next EZ. Raùl picked it out based on it needing the least amount of blood. Some of the models recommended on FDMB aren't available in Canadian Walmarts.

Asta is showing some improvement in her level of activity and reduced neuropathy in her hind legs. She still drinks a lot, because her blood sugar is so high about half of the time it seems. The vet said it would take a couple of days for her BG to stabilize, and I figure that time has passed. I wouldn't have the info to advocate for Asta without your help.

Deborah, Asta, and Raùl
 
Since you are home testing,here are some glucose reference ranges used for decision making using a human glucometer:

< 40 mg/dL
- Treat as if HYPO
- At nadir (lowest point between shots) in a long term diabetic (more than a year), may earn a reduction.

< 50 mg/dL
- If before nadir, steer with food, ie, give modest amounts of medium carb food to keep from going below 50.
- At nadir, often indicates dose reduction is earned.

50 - 130 mg/dL
- On insulin - great control when following a tight regulation protocol.
- Off insulin - normal numbers. (May even go as low as the upper 30s; if not on insulin, this can be safe.

> 150 mg/dL
- At nadir, indicates a dose increase may be needed when following a tight regulation protocol.

180 - 280 mg/dL
- Any time - The renal threshold (depending on data source and cat's renal function) where glucose spills into the urine.
- Test for ketones, glucose is too high.

>= 280 mg/dL, if for most of the cycle between shots
- Uncontrolled diabetes and thus at risk for diabetic ketoacidosis and hepatic lipidosis
- Follow your insulin protocol for dose adjustments
- Test for ketones; if more than a trace level of ketones, go to vet ASAP.
 
Hi Wendy. Since just prior to her diagnosis the only thing Asta has wanted to eat is tinned salmon. I've kept her on this for the time being until I got a handle on the situation. I guess I'd be leaning toward the wellness wet low carb food and ultimately aim to get her on a partial homemade diet when I am better organized. I just want to see my cat be healthy again.

Also, thanks for the tip about the Lantus at Costco. Now to find a friend with a membership...

BJ posted some tips on glucose reference ranges and based on that and my charting from the last three days I found that Asta's BG is over 18 for about 2 hours twice a day. Does anyone have any thoughts about this. I'll be phoning my vet to discuss it tomorrow.

Thanks,
Deborah, Asta, and Raùl.
 
Tinned cat food salmon or tinned human salmon? The latter is missing essential nutrients for cats and may start or worsen other problems due tonutrient deficiences.

There are supplements which may be added to round out the nutrient profile. See Cat Info for info, or post a new question or search the board (upper right corner of screen). [Soory - heading out the door!]
 
You can get lantus at pretty much any pharmacy including Walmart and shoppers, I just find it a bit cheaper at Costco but if you don't have a membership those places are ok too!
 
Tinned human salmon as a temporary solution to keep her eating. I know it isn't going to meet her dietary needs long term. (Actually, I'm beginning to think she might be constipated.) My main concern was that she eat at all. I'm aware that changing her diet suddenly will affect her BG and I'm cautious about that. Hopefully she accepts one of the recommended wet foods. I plan to slowly add it in to the salmon and then phase out the salmon altogether.
 
Have you tried transitioning in a salmon cat food like Fancy feast savory salmon feast? It might be a good way to get her started...
 
I want to mention something about the TC premix. I've used this for my cats for years, and I recently stopped using it because the owner of the company changed the formulation to include xanthan gum, a thickener and emulsifier. I don't see the need for this to be added to my cat's diet. Sure, cat foods contain other substances such as guar gum and carageenan, both of which I'm not crazy about either. But I'm very picky, or rather, protective, about what my cats eat, and I didn't think there is anything that would benefit them in eating xanthan gum.

"Xanthan Gum is made by fermenting corn sugar with a bacteria, Xanthomonas campestris"

"Nutritionally, xanthan gum is a carbohydrate with 7 grams of fiber per tablespoon. This may cause bloating in some people.

"Xanthan gum may be derived from a variety of sources such as corn, wheat, or soy. People with an allergy to one of the above, need to avoid foods with xanthan gum, or to ascertain the source."

Source: http://blog.fooducate.com/2010/09/23/10-facts-about-xantham-gum-a-very-popular-food-additive/
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top