And now prayers for Honey please...

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Justgin

Justgin

Member Since 2017
This can't be happening again, not so soon! Honey is Oreo's "cousin" and one of my rescue kitties born in 2004 a little older than Oreo.

She's not a diabetic kitty but she is an IBD vs lymphoma kitty. I just took her in last week to a new vet who gave her Metronidazole and a Depo shot and some new food - Royal Canin specific protein duck/pea. She likes the new food but she still wants her FF flaky tuna and I've been letting her have it. I don't want her going hungry when she will eat that.

Her appetite has always been good but she's lost from 12 pounds a few years ago to 6.9 the other day. Since we started low carb last April 2017 for Oreo, she has steadily lost weight on low carb and she's slowly become ravenous. (She was seen Nov 2016 at 12 pounds and then April 2017 at 12 pounds. By Sept 2017 she was down to 9.12.)

The depo increased her appetite and she's started having solid stools which I thought was a good thing, but she's acting lethargic again and now her respirations are up. <sigh> I honestly don't think I can take it.

Honey is a very sweet girl. She waits for me by the back door when I leave, until I get back home. She always sticks close like velcro when I'm at home. She's a lap kitty and purrs a lot. Dear God I'm not ready to let her go! Not this soon...

Please pray. Thank you. I'm taking her in to this new vet in the morning. I just can't go back to the old one.
 
Here is a pic of Honey from a few years ago. She loves my tennis shoes.
 

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This was Honey in October last year, begging me for food.
 

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I'm really scared this is it for her. I'm just scared. It's too soon after Oreo passed. Honey is my baby. I'm really sad for her.
 
She's a pretty girl. I lost two babies in just over a month seven years ago, so I understand your fear, but 'try' not to jump to that in your thoughts. Keep hope! She may surprise you. I hope she does. Let us know how the vet visit goes.
 
l am praying you can handle whatever happens....l agree with Futbabiesmama...try to not jump ahead...I just lost my Bubbles March 15th and my other kitty Mor Mor has all the signs of decline aswell (16yrs old)...so I truly relate to how you feel...it is alot to try and handle...very difficult that things can make life very challenging and sad at times...sending you and Honey sweet hugs and prayers...
 
Honey is still amongst the living! On the one hand it wasn't as bad as I thought, but there's still some bad news. They got an xray which compared to the one done last year shows no difference in her intestines. She gained from 6.9 to 7.7 so almost a pound since last week! At first I was scared it meant something bad, but the xray showed she really needs to go poo, soon. Even her stomach is full yet she still wants more food, begs for it. Maybe this was the cause of her high respirations? Or part of it anyway. The bad news is her heart is enlarged compared to last year and the vet thinks she has HCM. I wasn't expecting that, but not totally surprised either. Her other vet said he detected a murmur last year. This is not what I wanted to hear but still thank goodness, for now, she is still here and hopefully will be for some time. The vet still thinks she has digestive issues or IBD but her diarrhea was controlled after just 3 doses of the Metronidazole. Now we are concerned about constipation. If she does have HCM she doesn't need to be straining. So they are looking at giving her Reglan to help her poo if she needs it, and after that maintenance dose of Enalapril for blood pressure.

So, whew! Y'all were right. I did overreact, but it's not even been 2 weeks since I had to put Oreo to sleep and I'm starting to 2nd guess my decision. One good thing I did was to leave that vet's office. I had asked them for Oreo's last xrays because I wanted the referral vet to take a look at them and give an opinion, just to ease my mind.

But let me tell you, that office is either completely inept or else they were just trying to screw it up for me and make me have to come back in the office one last time. They sent me HONEY's xrays from one year ago, not Oreo's last xrays from 1 1/2 weeks ago. They labeled it Oreo and yet the film has Honey's name on it as clear as day. They also listed her as a canine on her film. Has anyone heard of an office so inept? What makes it so bad is this is the work of 2 people, not one. And the one girl that was there today worked at the vet referral office. She's very rude and condescending and takes advantage of people when they are scared and upset. It's not just me. She used to run the front desk at that office at night when it was an ER. She wouldn't even look me in the eye. I would never want her touching any of my kitties! The girl I spoke to today was very nice and efficient, and got me my xrays in less than 5 minutes.

Thank you for your prayers! Now pray for her to use the litter box. I'm relieved for the time being.
 
Very happy things arent as bad as you originally thought...what intense relief you must feel....! My kitty had HCM ...some research on it might be helpful for you...
 
allison and Bubbles said:
Very happy things arent as bad as you originally thought...what intense relief you must feel....! My kitty had HCM ...some research on it might be helpful for you...
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Thank you! Yes, I know that an enlarged heart is devastating news and all the possibilities that go with it. Now I am realizing that Oreo did not have a hypo 6 weeks ago. He may have had a partial saddle thrombus or like a TIA in humans. His only back leg wouldn't work for several minutes. I almost scooped him up and went flying to the ER but decided to see if treating it as a hypo would help. It actually did. I called his vet's number and spoke to an on call vet who said she thought it was a hypo. Even at the time I wasn't convinced that it was, even though feeding Oreo his high carb gravy lover FF seemed to help him. That incidence never happened again.

Now it's Honey's turn. I worried all yesterday at work how I would find her when I got home because I tend to imagine the worst. She was ok but her heart rate was fast and she didn't seem as hungry as she used to be. She did have a poo yesterday morning right as I was leaving, so I didn't get to see the size of it. She may still be constipated which certainly won't help her heart. So I'm waiting to hear back from her new vet this morning about Reglan and Enalapril and what to do next.

I didn't mean to downplay the seriousness of HCM the other day. It's just that I had been almost certain that I was going to have to put her to sleep that day for another reason. And when that didn't happen, I was greatly relieved for the moment. Now I'm back to worrying about her and this new problem.
 
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I know the feeling of the rollercoaster...the for sure euthanasia decision and then returning home with kitty from vet...it is quite traumatizing all around...the pivotal worst and best moments of our lives in a way....but it is a benefit to know if kitty has sooner...than later...you definitely have that on your side...if i am not mistaken isnt there a confirmitive test for it and treatment options ? beta blockers and blood thinners...?
 
I just hope it's not too late for treatment for her. The vet didn't mention any beta blockers or blood thinners. the other day but I will ask when she calls.
 
my kitty had undiagnosed HCM and in the end thre a clot or possibly what was called a "shower of clots" by one vet which could have been possibly been prevented had she been on blood thinners...that is what one vet's opinion was...his back ankle began 'drooping' so he was walking on the 'front ' of his ankle and in alot of pain...wish I had taken him in immediately but didnt know this was possibly reversible with thinners...just so you know ...
 
Chris & China said:
I think you're thinking of the proBNP blood test....it detects heart disease
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That test is for HCM? or just any heart disease? How much does this one cost? I'm getting really irritated with this new doctor. Now she's saying she does not want to treat Honey unless I get an Ultrasound. But she wants blood work first. Why didn't she tell me this the other day when we were there? It sure would have saved yet another damn trip, which is not easy on ANY cat, but it's certainly more stressful on a feral cat who has heart/respiratory problems. She wants to rule out thyroid and kidney problems which has come back perfect twice before when thyroid was suspected. I understand all this but I'm really irritated that she didn't insist on this while I was there the other day.
 
Oh yes, and they charge an arm and a leg. If I had money it'd be no issue but I'm living paycheck to paycheck like most people. There's just no good way to do this but put her back in the car tomorrow morning and take her to this vet who, for some godforsaken reason, doesn't seem to want to treat her. Why Enalapril? That's for blood pressure, and when I asked her what Honey's blood pressure was she couldn't tell me. The problem is in this town there just are very few good vets. Even the ER vet office is awful. Only one of the owners is nice and knowledgable and compassionate, the one time I saw him anyway.
 
The Cardiopet proBNP is a simple blood test that was adapted from human medicine and is used to predict the risk of developing congestive heart failure. This test measures the presence of a particular type of hormone (NTproBNP), which is released into the blood when the heart muscle is stretched or experiences stress. A few reasons the heart muscle could be stressed include:

 
Justgin said:
The problem is in this town there just are very few good vets.
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I feel your pain....I live in a small town of about 1000 people and 2 vets who see mostly cows....most of the cats they see are chasing mice on their way out to the barn to look at the cows.

The nearest ER vet is 75 miles away. There are no 24/7 vets around here at all

I have to take China 60 miles to get her to a vet that treats mostly small animals
 
Wow, and I thought I had it bad. That's awful! I hope China loves to ride in the car poor baby. I live in a sort of small town but not really that small. The problem with finding a good vet isn't because there are too few of them, but that most of them aren't good. Having more to choose from really doesn't help for that reason. We do have an ER vet after hours, but the front desk staff are mostly incredibly rude and take advantage of the people who come there with their sick pets are already scared and will tolerate staff's abusiveness. Not all are bad though. Some are good as gold but the bad ones still stand out. The good ones don't stay.
 
Justgin said:
I hope China loves to ride in the car poor baby.
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She's become a pretty good little traveler!! I used to get lots of strange looks from people in the cars next to ours wondering where that awful noise was coming from (and wondering if I was torturing a small child or something)....Was just China "singing the song of her people" (and she has enough Siamese in her that she sings very loudly!!)

Several years ago after my dad died, my mom wasn't adjusting really well so I decided to take her to Branson to see the Christmas shows....it was something Dad used to do every year. Of course it also meant either boarding China and trusting her care to the idiot vets around here or packing her up and taking her along....so that's what I did!!

I started taking her on short trips that didn't end with her at the vets office and she'd get lots of praise for being quiet. Gradually the trips got longer and through experimenting, I found that if she was in a harness and on the back seat, she did MUCH better than if I put her in a carrier. So I put a blanket over the back seat, put her harness and leash on her, went and picked up mom and off we went! We had reservations at a hotel that allowed pets so we just adjusted our schedule so I could shoot at 6am/6pm.....we'd go to a show in the afternoon and another one in the evening.

We've gone the last 4 years now and other than the fact that I pack more stuff for China than I do for both mom and me, we have a great time!
 
I've had 2 cats with HCM. One now GA and my current.

Currently, my new adoptee Olive makes the same sounds Smokey made. My 1st thought was some kind of heart disease. We have no history on her. She is part Maine Coon, and vet thinks part Persian or Himalayan (sp??). Those are 3 breeds predisposed to HCM. On her 1st vet visit I insisted they draw the cardiopet bnp test vet charged $110. No murmur picked up at this time. So the test came back normal 55 normal is under 100. So I was relieved. I also had an abdominal ultrasound done because her abdomen was distended and very hard, not going away and she was so uncomfortable. Also not regulated as treatment was just started 2 weeks previously. At the ultrasound (done without my vets referral, they wanted to wait) the IM picked up a galloping heart arrhythmia which intermittent so not always heard. 2 days later had the echo done ($545). She shows mild HCM and grade 2 murmur. She was started on benazepril to slow down the progress.

Smokey, 1st cat we did not know had it. Enlarged heart was found during pancreas ultrasound. Had the echo done and Smokey was poor and prognosis was guarded. It also showed he had a heart attack some in the previous 6 months. Cardiologist prescribed a bunch of meds with follow up in 3 months. He was on aspirin vs plavik. The cardiologist thought that would be better because of the bitter pill and Smokey had bad teeth so I only gave liquids to him. The follow up showed great improvement that the cardiologist (forgetting I was in the room) say holy ****!!! I thought the worst and my heart sunk. When I got my tongue back I said is it that much worse? He said on no, he is so much improved I can't believe it. The heart is back to normal size, no excess fluid. Perfect for an 18 1/2 yr old. Sadly a thrombosis took him a month later.

In my opinion, not knowing what blood tests your vet wants, the echo is more important (again my opinion) you need to know if there is a problem and how bad and if needed start treatment right away. In Olive's case the cardiopet pro bnp didn't help as she does have it. We only have a traveling cardiologist who goes to the larger practices and the 24/7 hospital. I was lucky he was due in that Monday and they squeezed us in. IM was expediting because they also found a tumor on the ultrasound but needed the echo before he would consider any biopsy or surgery because of anesthesia risk .

In 3 weeks time, Olive arrived to me, had 2 regular vet visits that included xrays and full labs, an echo, an ultrasound, testing for cushings and next week will be tested for acro and insulin resistance. Echo will be repeated in 3-6 months and ultrasound will be also to check size of tumor.

If you can have the echo done so you know for sure if she has it and can start treatment right away. Good luck. Keep us posted.
 
:(

Sooo, it seems that I could spend a whole bunch of money on her for tests and meds only to have her die a few weeks later anyway? All this costs money I just do not have. I guess I know what I have to do. I hate that it all comes down to finances, but once again, it does.
 
Justgin said:
:(

Sooo, it seems that I could spend a whole bunch of money on her for tests and meds only to have her die a few weeks later anyway? All this costs money I just do not have. I guess I know what I have to do. I hate that it all comes down to finances, but once again, it does.
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No, no, no. Smokey was 18 1/2 and already had a heart attack. His prognosis was poor. He had been neglected for years by previous owners. No one can foresee a thrombosis coming. Olive we know and caught early. Her prognosis is good. It can't be reversed but hopefully slowed down. We don't know her age, we do know she has a tumor of some kind that may or may not take her instantly. I can't afford the tests they want for that. So I gamble with what I can afford and treat. Take some time process the info. Don't make any hasty decisions. How about some higher calorie food to help with the weight? Maybe some medicine to help make her more comfortable. Is she grieving Oreo?
 
No I won't make any hasty decisions and I certainly want to give this plenty of thought. I'll proceed with the senior panel tomorrow and see if that shows anything treatable. I don't see what harm it would do to put her on a very low dose beta blocker as a trial. But I'm thinking this vet wants me to go elsewhere - and she is just not bold enough to say it outright. All the kitties grieved Oreo even Honey. I had brought him back home so they could see him one last time and say goodbye to him. They hardly ate anything for 2 days. Honey and Oreo didn't really get along though. But then, she really doesn't get along with any of the others, only me. She's my little shadow :cat: It's so hard to tell with them because even if they don't seem to get along, that doesn't mean they don't love each other.

Honey is 14 and she's already having tachycardia and tachypnea (around 32 to 36 at rest - haven't yet counted her heart rate) so I'm wondering if she's really advanced. The latest xray showed an obvious enlarged heart compared to last April.
 
The vet finally called yesterday afternoon and said she wanted to draw blood. Got that done this morning and vital signs. A different vet saw her today because the other one was off. To be honest, the other one is irritating me. I asked for a full set of vital signs and she said that the blood pressure wouldn't be accurate. But I know they can take into consideration that a vet visit is stressful. Hers were at first 150's/102, then went down to 136/something. An rx of Enalapril and Plavix has already been written, but first we need to see the labs. Her heart rate was 180 and resp 66 to 72. Not good. I would think they should treat heart rate first before blood pressure but was told by this vet we saw today that without an expensive echo ($500 +) they will not write an order for a beta blocker. I'm still considering all my options. I have Honey's 3 siblings to consider, they're all the same age. Why wasn't I born into a rich family? :(
 
I forgot to explain. The other vet in this same practice gave me excuses for NOT taking vital signs because she knew they would be elevated. But how much sense does it make to give a medication that effects blood pressure without knowing the blood pressure first? Anyway, her partner got a relatively low blood pressure for all the stress she was under, with that high HR and resp.
 
God, I feel for you! I've been putting off booking my Monty in for a much needed teeth cleaning just in case something bad happens under the general anaesthetic and I lose him too, 2 months after my baby Dweezil.

Poor Honey. Why can't our babies be healthy? Why can't we help them more by knowing exactly what's wrong at all times and before it happens? Why can't all vets be great?

Why can't we keep our beloved furs safe and happy forever...?

Dweezy was my shadow too.
 
Hugs:bighug: to you and Honey. It’s tough to be going through this with your baby, sorry you have to deal with such pains at the vet’s.
 
I've been doing a lot of thinking over the past few days at work, and I've realized that the best course of action, all things considered, is to wait it out. I've started giving her Plavix and Enalapril on Saturday night after Honey's labs came back. The blood work was all good, except some low normal anemia. The vet herself said even if I put Honey, a feral cat, through the stress of an echo - if she survives it - and then put her on appropriate drugs (which they will not order for her without the echo) it's not really going to change anything in the long run. She's still going to die of this wretched disease sooner or later. I'm preparing to say goodbye to yet another sweet little soul. God this is so hard. I have to live with what kind of stress I put Oreo through in his last hour taking him to the vet, letting them poke him and restrain him to get an IV and an xray. Wonder how he viewed all that? I know he hated the vet a lot, but I couldn't put him down without being sure. Anyway, I wished for a better more gentle ending for him. Same as I wish for her. Today her respirations are up and down, but never lower than 32/min. I don't know if drawing fluid off her belly might help but I might allow that if it makes her breathing a little easier.
 
Depending on the fluid in the belly and why it's there, could giving her a diuretic help? Why do you think she wouldn't survive the eco? It's not invasive. Draining fluid would be a lot more stressful and it us invasive.
 
l am so sorry Honey has a heart issue... did the vet have an idea of what kind of heart issue it might be ? I am guessing that this is the reason for the higher respiration rate?
 
She is a feral cat and is only tame to me and to 2 others, one of whom passed away. At the vet the other day her respirations were 66 to 72/min and her heart rate was 180. Today she seems a little worse than she was on Friday. I've got a call into her vet who has been in surgery all day today. Will discuss all that with her. And as I said, I have considered all things, not just Honey and the echo, but also my finances, my own health, and other things that I have not said here and won't. It's tearing me up, but it's what I have to deal with.
 
The vet said that 99% of the time it's HCM but they dont' know if it's dilated or restrictive so can't treat it.

I also learned from this vet what the other vets didn't tell me about Oreo's surgery. That the amputation likely was the reason the cancer spread if it hadn't already. I'm not sure if that would have made any difference in what I did for Oreo, but I'd rather know than not. His surgeon told me he felt that the surgery would be curative despite what the consulting vet said (who had also consulted with an NC State oncologist). And then this vet had the nerve to tell the one who had Oreo PTS that "you know he's an osteosarc." He knew, he just didn't want to tell me.
 
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