? 9/30 Mandarin AMPS 299, +3 241 / Walter AMPS 268, +3 216 - Q about EZ Complete + other premixes

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Mandarin'sMom

Mandarin'sMom

Member Since 2014
Yesterday's condo

I wish I knew what was going on at the moment, it seems like my animals continue to have one medical problem after another. When I came home from my volunteer shift yesterday, I noticed that Flora once again has liquid diarrhea. She had been doing great for almost a month and is now back to being as bad as she was before. Our shelter vet was pretty much out of ideas the last time and I am starting to think about switching everyone's food (they are currently eating Friskies + FF). I bought some chicken thighs and cooked those yesterday (just to see if my cats are even interested in home-made meals) and everyone loved them.

I don't think I am quite ready for raw food... but home cooked meals might be a good compromise. I looked into various pre-mixes yesterday and I have a few questions for folks who have tried them before:

1. I am not really sure about the carb content. Since I have seen it mentioned on here quite a bit, I would assume that raw/cooked meat is LC - but what do you do when your cat is running low? Canned food?

2. Does anyone know if the EZ Complete premix would be appropriate for a cat that is in the early stages of CKD?

3. How about kittens? The website says that it is for all life stages - but I seem to remember @Marje and Gracie saying that she is feeding her newest addition something different than Tobey.

4. I am also trying to figure out the cost. I currently have 7 cats and I need to find something that doesn't break the bank.... Realistically, how does this compare to canned food?

5. Or can anyone think of other alternatives that might work for my mix of cats? I have two sugar cats (Mandarin and Walter), one civvie who has had elevated kidney levels (Capone), one civvie that is prone to struvite crystals (Sassy), two foster kittens (Flora and Iris) and one very healthy, young cat who will eat anything that I put in front of her (Sparrow).

Oh, and the boys are both doing fine. Mandarin surprised me with a gorgeous blue pre-shot last night and I got so excited that I gave him a (partial?) furshot. :banghead:
 
Glad everyone liked the chicken! I'm pretty sure the home cooked with Food Fur Life is safe for all your kitties and hope you get some answers to your questions. The IBD kitties FB pages has a lot of knowledgable people as well as their website FB https://www.facebook.com/groups/IBDKitties/ website http://www.ibdkitties.net/ @Woodsywife and @Wendy&Neko both use the premix. Sorry about the excited partial FS! Extra vines and prayers for Flora & Iris.

I think in all your spare time :p:p we need a group picture of your crew :)
 
Poor Flora. I hope her poop firms up quickly. I don't know about the home cooking, but I hope you find something that works. I hope more insulin got in than you think with Mandarin.
 
Doodles & Karen said:
The IBD kitties FB pages has a lot of knowledgable people as well as their website FB https://www.facebook.com/groups/IBDKitties/ website http://www.ibdkitties.net/
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Thank you! I just sent a request to join that group. IBD is not something I am very familiar with... but it was among the things the vet mentioned as a concern.

I'll work on a group picture. ;) In the meantime, here's a funny picture from the shelter yesterday. We have quite a few rather large cats at the moment and a few really small dogs. We did some intros yesterday and here's Dottie (an 8-pound Chihuahua) with Sunny (a 17-pound cat).
 

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Mandarin'sMom said:
IBD is not something I am very familiar with... but it was among the things the vet mentioned as a concern.
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The website has tons of info on GI issues and home cooking! It's the FDMB of IBD and GI issues. I believe that IBD is mostly food allergies but this is my personal belief. Since getting Doodles allergy test done he's had virtually no issues. I just ordered one for Moo Moo and will be sending that in soon. I found the ImmuneIQ https://immuneiq.com/ on the IBD Kitty FB page as others reported it helped control their kitties symptoms. For $90 I figured it couldn't hurt. The IM vet wanted to put Doodles on Metro and or Atopica for the IBD which was confirmed via biopsy. She told me we had to monitor his BW for toxicity so I opted not to treat with meds. When I asked her what would happen if I didn't treat with meds vs. treating it with meds her answer was "either way it could turn into lymphoma in a year or two". :rolleyes:

Either way that website and FB has great info!
 
Some questions on EZ, I can answer.

I don't know if it safe for CKD or CRD. You can call them. They are very helpful. They also have a FAQ page on their site that might answer that question. Go to the IBD website and post your question there. The moderator there is one of the developers I guess you call it and can answer you.

You do not add liver to you food with EZ.

As far as cost of homemade vs commercial. I find it cheaper. EZ is the most expensive item. I cooked 2 lbs boneless meat and it yields me anywhere from 38-42 oz of pureed food. If there is bone you will yield less. I freeze in 9.5 oz and 12oz containers. Each container lasts 3-4 days.

Chicken thighs I get for $1.98 a pound. Gizzards and hearts are about the same. Beef heart I just got foe $2.99 lb and it's over 2 lb package same with kidney. I mix the heart and kidney to make 1 lb so the left over I freeze to use in next batch. Also stew meat can be on sale $3.48 per lb. So mix and match is what I do.

Some days Smokey eats more some days less. So far he is the only one eating it.

I mix half homemade and half commercial in his overnight feeder. I have commercial the others won't eat so I'm using it up by mixing. I do want him used to commercial only for the purpose if something should happen where he runs out of homemade and someone else is caring for him there won't be problems. When he is low like the other day I had to use commercial hc and honey. However, with the hc he was making a lot of digestive noises.

He poops less so don't freak about that it's normal. I use a slow cooker to cook the meat. Then when it's done and cooled off, it takes 30 minutes to puree (I have a mini processor) and portion out into containers. I just did beef and batch of Turkey and will make batch of chicken when EZ arrives (don't have enough EZ).

EZ is very fine powder. I find it easier to dump bag in plans container and scoop when I use it.

Hope this answers some of your questions. Anything else let me know.
 
I can't offer any advice here about either home cooked foods or raw. Just offer lots of hugs to you for just being you and caring so much for all your babies! :bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug:
 
EZ complete is a good low carb option. The bottom of this page shows the nutritional breakdown for various proteins. At one time I think they listed the phosphorus content, but seemed to have changed the page since then. Their source of calcium means it's phosphorus level is Ok for CKD kitties. Neko Used to eat it. Note that EZ complete is designed to be mixed with pure protein, no organs or bones. Marje was at one point using Alnutrin as a premix for Tobey, but it's not designed to be used with kittens.

My civie eats it regularly, mixed with buffalo or chicken. I am lazy, just get the butcher to grind the meat for me. So it's very easy to add water and premix and I am done. Of course, that is for raw, with cooked there is extra work before adding the premix. You could always try a little raw to see if they like it. I am a big believer in low effort. I have done cooked for Neko, as she is finding raw too chewy now and cooked is easier to whir in the blender. A good kitchen scale is an asset. And I get the smallest ziploc freezer tubs. It nicely fits 125-130 grams which is one days worth of food for one kitty.

I used to use the TC Feline Special premix which is good for kidney cats, and much cheaper than EZ complete per meal, as well as locally made. There is also a US version. But it has Xanthum gum in it, which is not good for IBD kitties.

Neko gets Weruva pouches when going low. I guess you could add honey or karo to LC. I found the cost comparable or better with some proteins than manufactured raw, which in turn is cheaper for the canned version of novel proteins my boy has to be on.

I see the boys are synchronized again.
 
@Wendy&Neko

Why no organs with EZ? Curious as they told me as long as organs (heart, lungs, kidneys is all I asked about) did not make up more than 1/2 it was okay. That's what I been doing. Please let me know if it's not right. I don't what Smokey being deficient or overdosed with nutrients.
 
First of all: thank you for all the suggestions!

Woodsywife said:
cooked 2 lbs boneless meat and it yields me anywhere from 38-42 oz of pureed food.
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Is it necessary to puree the food or is that just Smokey's preference? What I did yesterday is that I just cooked the chicken thighs, discarded the bones and skin when it was done and pulled everything into bite sized pieces. I am feeding the pieces as treats to everyone to get them used to the idea and I am adding the broth to their canned food. So far, all is good and everyone is loving it.

Woodsywife said:
I just did beef and batch of Turkey and will make batch of chicken when EZ arrives (don't have enough EZ).
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So, in other words, you only use one protein per batch but go back and forth between different proteins?

Wendy&Neko said:
My civie eats it regularly, mixed with buffalo or chicken. I am lazy, just get the butcher to grind the meat for me. So it's very easy to add water and premix and I am done. Of course, that is for raw, with cooked there is extra work before adding the premix. You could always try a little raw to see if they like it. I am a big believer in low effort. I have done cooked for Neko, as she is finding raw too chewy now and cooked is easier to whir in the blender. A good kitchen scale is an asset. And I get the smallest ziploc freezer tubs. It nicely fits 125-130 grams which is one days worth of food for one kitty.
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Low effort is what I am hoping for too! :smuggrin: I think I will eventually try raw, but I figured that the cooked meat would be closer to what they are eating now and would make it easier to transition. ...and I don't think that I will have to worry about tiny freezer tubs with all my cats....:rolleyes:
 
You don't need to purée the meat. The first batch of cooked I make with just chopped meat, done after cooking. Make sure you apsave the cooking water if you poach or boil it. Use it When you add the premix. I use any extra instead of water for mixing some of Neko's meds.
 
Mandarin'sMom said:
First of all: thank you for all the suggestions!


Is it necessary to puree the food or is that just Smokey's preference? What I did yesterday is that I just cooked the chicken thighs, discarded the bones and skin when it was done and pulled everything into bite sized pieces. I am feeding the pieces as treats to everyone to get them used to the idea and I am adding the broth to their canned food. So far, all is good and everyone is loving it.


So, in other words, you only use one protein per batch but go back and forth between different proteins?


Low effort is what I am hoping for too! :smuggrin: I think I will eventually try raw, but I figured that the cooked meat would be closer to what they are eating now and would make it easier to transition. ...and I don't think that I will have to worry about tiny freezer tubs with all my cats....:rolleyes:
Click to expand...

Pureeing is my preference or very very finely minced. I use one container beef, when finished I use 1 container chicken then turkey. This way he won't get tired of the flavor.
 
@Wendy&Neko

Just talked to EZ regarding organs. As long as it's a muscle organ ( heart, tongue, kidney, lung etc) is okay. Do not use secreting organs like liver, pancreas, brain or eyes.

However, she did say heart is an amazing organ to use but high in sodium. Kidney should be no more than 5% of batch.
 
Woodsywife said:
@Wendy&Neko

Just talked to EZ regarding organs. As long as it's a muscle organ ( heart, tongue, kidney, lung etc) is okay. Do not use secreting organs like liver, pancreas, brain or eyes.

However, she did say heart is an amazing organ to use but high in sodium. Kidney should be no more than 5% of batch.
Click to expand...

I just talked to them too and I went ahead and placed my first order. I really hope that all of mine will eventually like it... So far, I'm really encouraged by their reaction to the cooked meat. I heated up the broth a bit and the cats were basically jumping up and down with excitement. :)
 
Mandarin'sMom said:
I just talked to them too and I went ahead and placed my first order. I really hope that all of mine will eventually like it... So far, I'm really encouraged by their reaction to the cooked meat. I heated up the broth a bit and the cats were basically jumping up and down with excitement. :)
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How exciting! So jealous..neither one of my brats will eat people food. Moo use to love boiled chicken but hasn't touched it in a while. A while back I was giving Doodles small pieces of raw chicken breast as a treat...might try that again since he did eat a little of it. Doodles also tried RadCat raw Lamb long ago but vomited. Now I know it's not a good protein for him though. My home cooking with Alnutrin failed too but all these experiments were done before the heart dx. Since he's been on heart meds he does it so much better.

I hope they all love it. It's soo much better than any commercial food!
 
I"m jealous as well - Murphy wouldn't touch people food or raw. I may at some point do the cooked - so nice not to have to worry about the gums or the dreaded carrageenan. Good going, Christina
 
I love the EZC and I use it raw but if I were starting out as you are and had multiple cats with issues to consider, I'd also start by cooking. They have recipes on their website.

I recently did the calcs for P using different meats and they all came out to around 205-210 mg P/100 kcal. That isn"t low P like th renal diets are but, for my CKD cats, I did not feed renal diets and tried to keep the P levels in their food around 200 mg P/100 kcal or under 1.00% P on a dry matter basis.

Wendy is right that the pre-mix I stopped using because it is not balanced for kittens is Alnutrin. I got Livia at 12 weeks and started converting her from the Fancy Feast and Royal Canin she was on to raw the first full day I had her. I started with chicken thighs and took it slow and as discussed on the FoodFurLife/EZC site. Once she was all on raw chicken with EZC (about ten days), I introduced lamb, turkey, and venison, all with EZC, slowly and one at a time but she gobbled them down. She has absolutely thrived and gained 1.2 lbs in a month. Her coat is gorgeous and she's getting muscular.

I also give her Renee Life ULtimate Flora Adult 15 b CFU (1/4 bid) which is what I give Tobey. And, of course, he is on all the raw meats with EZC as well. I use ground meats but you can also chunk it, if and when you get to raw.

I highly recommend the ibdkitties.net and the rawfeedingforibdcats.org sites as well as the FB page for both if you are on FB. If a kitty has IBD, everything must be done slowly and if they are on canned food, it's best to go to homecooked and when they are stable on that, try to go to raw, if you wish.
 
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