9/3 ** Harley PMPS 534, +1 489, +2 523

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Harley and Pattie

Harley and Pattie

Member Since 2010
Harley had another good night except for one red that popped up. I don’t know how to avoid that one red number. No crying for food and ketone free.

PMPS 352
+3 419
+7.5 199
AMPS 211 - hope he is not going for another red later on

Have a good day everyone.

Pattie

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=23938
 
Re: 9/3 ** Harley AMPS 211

Note to Harley: no need to go way up to Reds...a high yellow is a fine bounce if bounce you must.
And you really do not HAVE to bounce at all...okay? :mrgreen:
 
Re: 9/3 ** Harley AMPS 211

peeked at your spreadsheet, ugh, that's quite a bounce. :shock:

come down from there, Harley...
 
Re: 9/3 ** Harley PMPS 534

Wow, I thought it was going to be a good day. Could not test much but got a +7.5 – 156 was so happy. Gave Harley a snack of 1 tb EVO + FF and 1 tsp freeze dried salmon. Not a bad snack and really not much of it. But tonight – 534 (2nd test). First test was 513.

I did not give much as dinner and he is crying. I will give a little more at +1 and +2.

This was my fault – I feel. Could not get the new insulin until this afternoon. I have a bad case of the guilt's because I caused this. Well, the new stuff is on board. Have not heard back from either vets on the acro tests but with Labor day upon us, I doubt if I will hear anything.

AMPS 211
+7.5 156
PMPS 534

Pattie
 
Re: 9/3 ** Harley PMPS 534

This is the response from Harley's University vet:

We tested Harley for acromegaly in June of 2009. His IGF-1 (growth hormone) level was normal at 12 nmol/L (the normal range is 12-92). We have not checked him for insulin autoantibodies (IAA), but I don't know if it will be worthwhile. It is uncommon for cats to have significant amounts of IAA (much more common in people and dogs), though they can theoretically develop in response to the insulin injections. Additionally, while the presence of high IAA levels helps explain why insulin resistance is present, it doesn't change the management. Our goal is simply to give as much insulin as needed to overcome the insulin resistance and control the blood sugar.

I still have Harley's primary vet to go to. She will run the test I am sure.

Pattie
 
Re: 9/3 ** Harley PMPS 534 - response from vet

My thoughts and prayers are with you both, Pattie.*HUGS* I've got my fingers crossed and Blackie has her paws crossed for you both.
 
Re: 9/3 ** Harley PMPS 534 - response from vet

Pattie --

The university vet is correct. The management is to give as much insulin as needed in order to overcome the resistance. It's more a matter of whether you want the validation of what you suspect so you feel better about being aggressive with dosing. I have to say that I'm impressed that the U of MN vets ran an IGF-1 already. Most vets deal with acro as a very rare condition and don't think it's worth testing for.

That not so pretty PMPS is a bounce from that very pretty blue. I hope it clears very quickly.
 
Re: 9/3 ** Harley PMPS 534 - response from vet

Ok Pattie...it's good that you got the new insulin. He will bring himself down from that bounce. Try to relax now. You are off for the weekend? Let's see how that new insulin works. You will be able to test him this evening, right? New Juice Harley....did you hear that boy? dancing_cat dancing_cat dancing_cat
 
Re: 9/3 ** Harley PMPS 534 - response from vet

I will be testing Q hour for the first 4 hours...My boy had better be good and get down.

pattie
 
Re: 9/3 ** Harley PMPS 534 - response from vet

Your vet isn't wrong that IAA is rare, it is, but it happens. It's also true that it knowing he is IAA wouldn't change the treatment much. I guess I'm just the type of person who wants to know WHY, if possible.

The good news is that IGF-1 is the test we were talking about for acro and it is negative, so YAY! Harley is probably not acro. I think the number can vary if you test again, but probably not by that much.

I think the main difference for me between knowing and not knowing if he has IAA, is that with IAA we would possibly handle his dose reductions differently when he earns them. With a normal diabetic cat, we take reductions 0.25 at a time and work our way down the scale (sometimes fast, sometimes slow). Most of the time if a normal diabetic cat takes reductions too quickly, they might lose momentum and have to go back up. With IAA, once the resistance is broken, the cat can run down the dosing scale REALLY fast. They might be able to (or even NEED) to take much larger reductions. For example, he's getting 7 units now, if all of a sudden the resistance breaks then 7 might be way too much and instead of going down to 6.75, we might need to go down to 5. There have been a couple of higher dose cats here who raced down the dosing scale, and I really, really wished we knew if they were IAA because it would have helped know how to handle the reductions. A couple of times it even felt dangerous to not know (a cat that is only 0.25 over dose can handle low numbers, but when we don't know how far over dose they are, then a 35 could become dangerous very quickly).

There is also a bit of a difference on the way UP the dosing scale, but not as much. We would probably be a little more aggressive with an IAA cat than with a normal diabetic because we know that if he gets good numbers on a dose, then all of a sudden he doesn't anymore, he might be building a resistance at that dose and we need to hurry up and increase to help "squish" the antibodies.

Anyway, I think it would probably help to know if Harley has IAA, but I also think it's not the end of the world if we don't. I'm curious, though...
 
I don't know about R, Pattie. Harley clears his bounces pretty fast sometimes so that might make him drop too fast (and set off another bounce). R can drop him quite a bit. I would probably just wait it out.

Also, Jojo always used to tell us not to test too often when they are that high. It's only going to depress you. I think it's save-a-strip night. Get a test before bed, and that's it, ok?
 
You are right about the "lay off the testing". Took another one before I read this and it is 426. I think I will wait and do one at about +6 since bedtime is calling me. I did not do the regular although I sure was tempted to. Will update later.

Pattie
 
I don't have any wisdom to add in the dosing or dx department, but I do know about "realizing insulin went bad" guilt. We're all doing our best, you included. No room for guilt. Okay? :smile: I hope Harley clears this bounce soon.
 
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