9/26 Apollo PMPS 342, +2 378, +3 383, +6 399

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Re: 9/26 Apollo AMPS 401, +6 151, +8 93, +9 125, +9.75 166

Wow - what a day! Gorgeous numbers for Apollo - it looks like the diet switch is working some magic!!

Likewise, I'm not going to give you dosing advice, other than Jill, Sienne, and Libby really know what they're talking about. You and Apollo are completely safe in their hands.

Great job today. And, it does get easier, and those greens do get less scary in time. Just remember, there is tons of support here - you are not alone!!!

Amy
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo AMPS 401, +6 151, +8 93, +9 125, +9.75 166

are you comfortable shooting a full dose on a 262?
i would, but i'm not you. you have to be comfortable with whatever you shoot.

here's the likely scenario... he'll bounce for up to the next 3 days because his body dropped into numbers he's not used to feeling. that doesn't mean you can become lax on getting a before bed spot check. now that you're seeing a response... spot checks and posting the results become more important than ever.
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo AMPS 401, +6 151, +9 125, +9.75 166, PMPS 26

ps --------- you do have options if you're not comfortable shooting a full dose on this number.
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo PMPS 262

I'm torn. I know you have much more experience when it comes to this then I do. I have been reading more and more and I see how using Lantus follows a protocol and guide, plus Alex's sheet shows you can give a full dose on lower numbers. I think the only thing that worries me is him dropping too low and me sleeping through it. Is the +6, +7 the spot where he would be the lowest?
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo AMPS 401, +6 151, +9 125, +9.75 166, PMPS 26

today his lowest numbers were at +7 and +8.

the spot checks before you go to bed are telling. if you see them dropping, it's a signal to get more even if it means setting an alarm clock to get what we've dubbed a sleep test (test and go back to bed).

using today as an example. he started out at 401. chances are a spot check at +3 or +4 would have given you a clue that he was dropping at a pretty good rate. that would have been a signal to be on guard... more spot checks would be necessary. after all, he didn't drop from 401 to 151 all at once. kwim?

there's no doubt, now that you've seen green these spot checks are important.

if you're not comfortable, you can reduce the dose or stall until he reaches a number you're comfortable shooting. if you stall, the next shot is due 12 hours after whenever you shoot tonight.
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo PMPS 262

Let me ask you this. If I did do the full dose, what times would I need to check before bed to feel comfortable that he will be ok? What are the chances that he will drop into a danger zone on a full dose?
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo PMPS 262

Example of a typical Lantus curve:
+0 - PreShot number.
+1 - Usually higher than PreShot number because of the last shot wearing off. May see a food spike in this number.
+2 - Often similar to the PreShot number. <------- if this test is lower than the ps number, further testing will be required, for sure
+3 - Lower than the PreShot number, onset has started.
+4 - Lower.
+5 - Lower.
+6 - Nadir/Peak (the lowest number of cycle).
+7 - Surf (hang around the nadir number).
+8 - Slight rise.
+9 - Slight rise.
+10 - Rising.
+11 - Rising (may dip around +10 or +11).
+12 - PreShot number.


without knowing what numbers you get for each test, it's impossible to lay out a plan for you. the cat always leads the dance. the best we can do is suggest when to test next based on the numbers you're reporting.

if you want to reduce, i wouldn't go any lower than 2.25u because we already know 2u wasn't enough to bring him down. however, you'll still have to test because remember lantus is cumulative. that means whatever you shoot tonight has the shed behind it. you may not see the effects of a reduced dose shot tonight until tomorrow's AM cycle.

those are my thoughts, but you have the option of shooting 2.25 or nothing... and everything in-between.
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo PMPS 262

Ok. I think I am going to go with 2.25 just to be a little conservative. I will test again before shot just to see if I change my mind and will report back here.
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo PMPS 262

I will go with the full dose and put it in God's hands. When do u suggest I start spot checking?
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo PMPS 262

doesn't surprise me.
it's your call as to what you want to do about dose.

one thing you have to remember... lantus usually kicks in around +2. that means he has the next 2 hours to go higher before lantus will begin to pull the numbers down.
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo PMPS 262

john, my heart goes out to you. apollo has been on N for so long. switching to lantus requires a whole different mindset. trusting "people on the internet" with apollo's well-being in mind is another hurdle. it's not easy and i know it.
you're doing great!
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo PMPS 262

yep, it's a very tough thing to adjust to a whole new insulin with such different action. You're doing great, really.

If it helps, click on Lucy's spreadsheet. She loved to skydive down from high numbers, she could get to green from pink or red in a heartbeat, but when I shot lower she didn't drop nearly as much. Usually she just surfed, except those times when she was ready to earn a reduction (and those weren't a surprise to me, I tested enough that I could usually tell when that was about to happen so I knew I was ready to deal with it). You'll get there too.
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo PMPS 262

Wow! Lots of exciement here today!

Great job!

Glad you went with the full dose. Shooting lower numbers is a bit dauntung at first but that feeling will pass.
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo PMPS 342, +2 378

Sure I can get a +3. Heck I can get a +4 through +11 if u need. I'm wide awake just watching him sleep. :lol:
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo PMPS 342, +2 378

lol! "they" always sleep. we're the ones who have to stay awake!
342 and 378 are too close for me to feel comfortable saying go to bed... nothing will happen here tonight. a +3 should give us a better idea. i have a hunch you'll be able to go to bed in an hour...
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo PMPS 342, +2 378

John, good job! It IS gut wrenching. I agree totally. Definitely one of the hardest things I've dealt with in my life. But then you start to see him doing better at the lower numbers and not so good at the higher numbers and you get a little experience dealing with this and pretty soon green is your favorite color! :lol: :lol:
Liz
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo PMPS 342, +2 378, +3 383

are you any good at sleeping for for a few hours and then waking up to grab a test?
if i were in your shoes, i'd set the alarm to get a +6.

i honestly don't think there's any cause for concern tonight. the ONLY reason I'm suggesting a +6 is he dropped from red to blue today. since the data is limited... i just don't want to take any chances. i admit i'm being overly cautious. if we had more data to show his patterns and responses... i'd probably be saying "good job, good night and see you tomorrow" about now.
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo PMPS 342, +2 378, +3 383

I also agree on the gut wrenching I remember first time Do Lou went into the 20's felt like I was going to pass out this feline diabetes truly keeps us Beans on our toes and you are doing fantastic with Apollo great to see him hit blue today
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo PMPS 342, +2 378, +3 383

I can do a +6. Luckily I work from home, but my poor wife (who is my push the strip into the meter and grab the sample person) isn't going to be as accommodating. I think I will give it a try again doing it all on my own. If I have trouble I will just wake her up. Will you be here to advise me further at the +6 time? That would be 2:30am EST.
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo PMPS 342, +2 378, +3 383

i don't think i'll be here at that time. it'll be 3:30 my time and i have to get up at 5:30.
however, if you're nervous i'll set my alarm, too. let me know. i don't mind. it's not much different than having to get up to get a spot check from alex.
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo PMPS 342, +2 378, +3 383

Would you mind setting your alarm? I'm just nervous if he comes back with a low number and what I should do. Also is the +6 the low point or +7 (he was lower at +7 today then +6). Or does whatever his number says at +6 tell you all you need to know for the rest of the night?
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo PMPS 342, +2 378, +3 383

no problem! i'll set my alarm.

the +6 will tell us what we need to know for the rest of the night.
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo PMPS 342, +2 378, +3 383

If the +6 is at 2:30am EST. I thought you were on Central time, so that would be 1:30am your time, no?
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo PMPS 342, +2 378, +3 383

ha! i wasn't thinking. thanks! 1:30 will make it much easier for me since i test and feed alex between 12 and 12:30.
thanks for catching that!
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo PMPS 342, +2 378, +3 383

Ok, sounds good. Thanks again for all your help. Sending over a virtual hug your way.

Meet you back for the +6 results.
 
Re: 9/26 Apollo PMPS 342, +2 378, +3 383

Great job today John! The first greens really scare the H*ll out of you, but you handled it well & had a great team here working with you!- You did all the right things!-Guess you're a real lantus lander now :mrgreen:
Have a good night!
 
see if you can get him to eat, leave some food out and go back to bed. :mrgreen:

i have an exceptionally long work day tomorrow, but i'll pop in here when i can to see how things are going...

goodnight!
 
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