9.20 Lucy AMPS=293 HIGH flat curve...HELP!

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LucyCat

LucyCat

Member Since 2013
If you look at Lucy's SS you can see that she is hovering between 250-350 for the most part even though I have gradually been increasing her insulin. Any ideas why? Should I see if she needs the K supplement shots? She is flooding litter boxes again. Acting the same and everything...don't understand these high numbers.

Thanks.
 
Hopefully this is a high before a break.
Come on pretty girl, come on down tonight, nice and easy. Sometimes dose increases can take a few cycles to take effect. Would you be able to do a test mid cycle tonight?
I swear, I just Love Lucy. She is so beautiful.
 
I have been through similar times with Trixie. Take a look at her SS from this year, starting at the end of March and through April. At that time, I changed her diet, and it changed her insulin needs. I had to take her from 2.50 to 5.00 (systematically following the protocol) before I hit a breakthrough dose. During that time, I was scratching my head - a lot. I'd increase her dose, and the increase seemed to have no effect what so ever. But, suddenly, I hit a dose that worked, and now we're heading back down the ladder.

I'm sure others may have more scientific insight, but for some of us, this may be one of the anomalies of FD. With that said, you may also want to double-check to see if any sort of infection is brewing, too, if you can.

You're doing a great job with those increases....you will eventually hit a working dose.

Have a great evening, guys!
 
I'd I can't emphasize enough how important it is to get at least one PM test every single night. There are more occasions than not when you're only tests are at pre-shot times. This makes it very difficult, at least for me, to offer a suggestion about dose. It is entirely possible for our kitties to have numbers in the 400s at both pre-shot times and drop to the 40s in between. Lantus dosing is based on the nadir so those spot checks are critical for both safety and dosing reasons.

If you are still feeding the M/D, it's 14% carb. That's what we consider a medium carb food (15% and above is high carb). If there's any way you can see your way clear to transition Lucy to low carb food, I suspect you will see better numbers. You have a wealth of LC choices on Dr. Lisa's chart. To be honest, M/D is a very poor quality food. It's primarily animal by-products vs. muscle meat. You could be feeding Lucy a premium, human grade cat food for less than what you're spending for the M/D.

I think you are holding doses for too long. When a kitty is in high numbers for an overly long period, it can be harder to get the numbers to come down. I'd encourage you to stick with the TR protocol and evaluate Lucy's dose every 3 days.
 
I'd second Sienne's comments about transitioning to a low-carb canned food if you can make it happen. having too many carbs in the food is like a person trying to control their diabetes while eating a snickers bar every day. most people try for 4-8% - so Lucy's getting 2-3x as many carbs in the MD as she could be getting with canned. You might really see some progress with the food change and you wouldn't need as much insulin to counter the carbs she's eating.

if you need some tips on transitioning her, just ask. everyone's got a bunch of tricks that have worked for their cat.
 
I only started Lucy on about a tablespoon of M/D about 2 weeks ago. The reason I am doing that is 1. she needs some roughage in her diet because only wet is negatively effecting her bowels and overall digestion. 2. the local no kill shelter is supplying the M/D because they have tons of it...therefore it is FREE for me. I would love to have money that I can spend on super "human quality" food for Lucy...but I don't. We were going to try out the M/D, which I understood to be 11% carbs but everyone keeps saying different percentages...to see if it helps with digestion. So far, neither cats have left soft poop skid tracks around the house because their poops are back to a good solid consistency. So...in the future...depending on Lucy's numbers and my financial situation, I may try to switch out the type of dry food we are using. I don't know how other people's cats do on wet only but my cat's poops are way too soft on wet only.

Also, I think I've singled out the Salmon and Liver/Chicken Friskies Pates as being problematic for Lucy. I think both of those, for some reason, cause her to vomit. So, I'm stopping those and sticking to other Pates.

Also, if you look at her SS, the dry food was started after her numbers started going up and up. I know people are huge supporters of wet only on here but ECID. Please allow me the flexibility to explore this option for Lucy.

I was able to get many tests done last weekend and I will again today. I am happy that her AMPS was only 206 today...that is the lowest I've seen in weeks! I am hopeful that 3 units may be the dose that gets us going back down.

Thanks everyone.
 
Are you using M/D dry? The percent carbs I gave you was for the M/D canned. That may be the discrepancy. However, M/D dry is way higher in carbs. Honestly, even a tablespoon of a HC dry food is going to inflate the numbers and you'll need to increase insulin to compensate. The problem will be if you increase dose and then stop the dry, it is likely to cause a very dramatic (and potentially dangerous) change in Lucy's insulin needs. Sticking with Friskies or Fancy Feast is fine. I was assuming you were paying for the M/D yourself.

If you want to add fiber to Lucy's food, using canned pumpkin (not pie filling) or squash baby food works very well. Marje routinely uses the squash as do several others here.

Many cats are allergic to fish and beef. Gabby tends to vomit with beef. I feed her only poultry flavors.
 
Yeah, I've been sticking to poultry flavors too. I tried the pumpkin before and they refuse to eat it. I want to point out that Lucy's numbers didn't change after I started giving her dry food. Her numbers were already very high. Then I started some dry M/D and they stayed about the same. I have not observed an increase in Lucy's numbers due to the dry food. In fact, her numbers stayed about the same.
 
My guys didn't like pumpkin, either. I'd try the squash. It's a small investment in one jar of baby food to see if they'll eat it. If they like it mixed into their food, it's an easy, no muss, no fuss option for a kitty that needs fiber.

The dry may (or may not) be effecting Lucy's numbers. It's just such cr*p food at so many levels. The biggest issues with dry food food is that it contains grain. Cats are obligate carnivores. Their systems can't process anything other than protein. If you think about what the big cats in the wild eat, the only non-protein source in their diet is the food that's partially digested that's in the digestive track of their prey. Cats need a good source of protein -- in other words, muscle meat. M/D is primarily animal by-products which are the undesirable left overs and not good sources of protein. Dry food also spoils very quickly. If you look at the recent food recalls, it's typically dry food that's become spoiled or contaminated. I'd encourage you to take a look at Lisa Pierson, DVM's site on feline nutrition. Her research on feline nutrition is what has made canned food converts of most of us. It's your decision re. what to do. I know it's coming across as I'm twisting your arm (and I am). However, knowledge about your choices makes for informed decisions even if cost is a prevailing factor. I just want you to have all of the information at your disposal.
 
I honestly don't have any experience with M/D or dry food and FD kitties...but I can agree with the "ECID". I do live with three feline anomalies myself...littermates with really difficult digestive sensitivities, who absolutely will not eat canned. Much to my dismay, and going against everything I ever believed in about feline diets, these three littermates actually can't digest high protein diets, despite being obligate carnivores. Foods that are to high in protein and too low in fiber run straight through them. I tried for YEARS to make it work with them, and for years, they paid the price for my persistence. It wasn't until my vet finally convinced me to rethink my approach to food try some of what I considered to be lower/low quality food (Right now, it's Purina One Hairball kibble), that they started having solid poo for the first time in their lives. If I weren't living it, I wouldn't believe it myself.

It can definitely be a tough balance, trying to figure out how to manage all the different issues an individual kitty can have. I couldn't agree more that Dr Lisa's info is second to none, and 99.9% of the time I would be pushing for the high protein/low carb ideal kitty diet. But there are some kitties out there who, for whatever reason, just don't fit the mold. Sometimes there has to be a little give and take, and hopefully you will soon find a dose that works well for Lucy and her dietary needs!
 
Thanks for the insight and support Amy! They mostly have wet pate but in the AM with the introduction of about a tablespoon of dry M/D, the pooping issues have stopped. I'm hopeful for Lucy's numbers to start getting lower as I've already observed it starting yesterday and again today.
 
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