? 9/1 Abby PMPS 542 her numbers are nuts!

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megmonger

megmonger

Member Since 2017
I don't know what is going on, the last two days Abby's numbers are skyrocketing. I really do not think she is bouncing due to low nadir as she has literally never gotten below the low 200s yet on Lantus. She has gained a lot of weight this last week, which we took as a good sign, but other than that nothing is different. Could our insulin be going bad already? I've had the vial barely 3 weeks. I have no backup and it'd be at least a week before more arrived from Canada and that wouldn't happen until I could pick up another script from my vet on a holiday weekend of course. Could it be her new weight means she needs more insulin? We are nowhere near regulated so the protocol would be to increase based on her readings but it just seems so sudden and odd that they are shooting up after being consistently lower. I have no idea what to do. You can tell she is suffering too with the high BG it's like she's out of her mind. :(:oops:
 
Hi. I know you must be so frustrated but I'm thinking you just haven't hit the right dose yet. I used tge two vials for about 5 months each and the pens to the last drop. Patience pants are needed as hard as that is. When's your next curve?
 
tiffmaxee said:
Hi. I know you must be so frustrated but I'm thinking you just haven't hit the right dose yet. I used tge two vials for about 5 months each and the pens to the last drop. Patience pants are needed as hard as that is. When's your next curve?
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Under SLGS we'd be holding another 4 days before a curve and then increase by 0.25 units. Seems like a long wait and very small increase though when her numbers are so bad right now. :(
 
You don't want to increase by more because you might miss a good dose. Everything seem ok? Eating, peeing, and pooping normal? SLGS does move slower than TR.
 
tiffmaxee said:
You don't want to increase by more because you might miss a good dose. Everything seem ok? Eating, peeing, and pooping normal? SLGS does move slower than TR.
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Eating normal. Pooping seems normal. Peeing a lot but that's been the case for months since Dx.
 
Kris & Teasel said:
The black looks like a big, bad bounce number. Try to ignore it and stay with the program. You're not at her good dose range yet.
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I can do that. But could you help me understand more about bounces with Lantus? On Vetsulin she bounced a few times, but that was when she was on such an overdose from the vet that her BG crashed by like 300 points in 2 hours and that would set off a bounce. Looking at her Lantus numbers I haven't seen such steep drops. So I'm thinking maybe I don't know what I'm watching for to identify a bounce? Thank you so much for the help and education.
 
megmonger said:
I can do that. But could you help me understand more about bounces with Lantus? On Vetsulin she bounced a few times, but that was when she was on such an overdose from the vet that her BG crashed by like 300 points in 2 hours and that would set off a bounce. Looking at her Lantus numbers I haven't seen such steep drops. So I'm thinking maybe I don't know what I'm watching for to identify a bounce? Thank you so much for the help and education.
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I wrote this before about bouncing:

Here's how it works:
  1. BG goes low OR lower than usual OR drops too quickly.
  2. Kitty's body panics and thinks there's danger (OMG! My BG is too low!).
  3. Complex physiologic processes take glycogen stored in the liver (I think of it as "bounce fuel"), convert it to glucose and dump it into the bloodstream to counteract the perceived dangerously low BG.
  4. These processes go into overdrive in kitties who are bounce prone and keep the BG propped up varying lengths of time (AKA bouncing).
  5. Bounce prone kitty repeats this until his body learns that healthy low numbers are safe. Some kitties are slow learners.
  6. Too high a dose of insulin can keep them bouncing over and over until the " bounce fuel" runs out and they crash - ie., have a hypo episode. That's why we worry so much about kitties that have had too high a starting dose prescribed by the vet and the owner isn't home testing.
That black is an outlier number and doesn't warrant special attention. There's often no specific explanation for numbers like these - wonky strip, "Oh, look! A squirrel!" syndrome, momentary spike in BG from some unknown blip of physiology, etc.
 
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Black numbers are not an emergency, just high. Numbers below 50 can be an emergency. What really the question is what caused the black, and why is she bouncing? A spot check before bed at night can be very informative. She might have gone lower either today or last night. We dose Lantus based on the low point and without data, we don't know what that is. My Neko's first reduction was earned starting the cycle at 430. High preshots don't mean they stay high all cycle.

As for Abby's dose, just stick with the SLGS guidelines for now. When you started Lantus, we would have had you start something closer to the Vetsulin dose, so she may have some dose increases yet to come.
 
Kris & Teasel said:
I wrote this before about bouncing:

Here's how it works:
  1. BG goes low OR lower than usual OR drops too quickly.
  2. Kitty's body panics and thinks there's danger (OMG! My BG is too low!).
  3. Complex physiologic processes take glycogen stored in the liver (I think of it as "bounce fuel"), convert it to glucose and dump it into the bloodstream to counteract the perceived dangerously low BG.
  4. These processes go into overdrive in kitties who are bounce prone and keep the BG propped up varying lengths of time (AKA bouncing).
  5. Bounce prone kitty repeats this until his body learns that healthy low numbers are safe. Some kitties are slow learners.
  6. Too high a dose of insulin can keep them bouncing over and over until the " bounce fuel" runs out and they crash - ie., have a hypo episode. That's why we worry so much about kitties that have had too high a starting dose prescribed by the vet and the owner isn't home testing.
That black is an outlier number and doesn't warrant special attention. There's often no specific explanation for numbers like these - wonky strip, "Oh, look! A squirrel!" syndrome, momentary spike in BG for some unknown blip of physiology, etc.
Click to expand...
Thank you for the helpful info!
 
megmonger said:
I really do not think she is bouncing due to low nadir as she has literally never gotten below the low 200s yet on Lantus.
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During the course of the 6 cycles at 2u, 5 of the 6 had no mid cycle tests.
That leaves ,overall, about 80% of the total hours spent on that dose "uncharted territory ". A whole other world of BGs could be hiding in those wide open spaces of white on her ss.

You have done a great job getting all the PS readings before shooting. Time to build your knowledge by finding out as much as you can about the hours in between. Know Thy Cat

Start with 1 test each and every cycle...and mix up the times...sprinkle tests in at various times and before you know it the wide open spaces won't be so wide or open.

Before changing doses find out what's really going on.
You will be glad you did.
:cool:
 
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