8/7 Morgaine AMPS 173,+3 94,+6 91,PMPS 116

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skybar22

skybar22

Member Since 2010
yesterday

I went ahead and increased Morgaine's dose to 2.75 as per our discussion yesterday. I also changed her syringe to a 1/2 inch needle as suggested by someone a few days ago to see if that will make a difference since she has such thick fur.

I am a bit concerned about the continual dose increases at this point and am wondering about the potency of the Lantus. Is it possible that it is beginning to lose some of it's potency? In all my years on insulin I have never experienced insulin losing potency gradually. It was either working or gone bad. I did notice Lantus going bad on me but it was obvious. I hate to waste insulin but do any of you think I should open a new vial? I get them 3 at a time from mail order and have 2 in my refrigerator, unopened with 12/11 exp. dates. I opened this bottle 7 weeks ago.

My concern about the insulin would be that if, in fact, it was losing some potency, her numbers might really take a dive if I change bottles. OTOH, she seems to do well with every new dose for a day or so and then up she goes, still doing okay in the lower blues but those healing numbers disappear.

At some point, shouldn't i just hold the dose as per the protocol, if she stays between 100-200? I want to be aggressive but it seems like 2.75u bid is quite a bit for a cat who was not ever showing high numbers to begin with. I know there are no simple answers to this and I truly do appreciate brainstorming with others to figure out my best course of action as we move forward.

All advice and comments are always welcome. Hoping the increased dose and longer needle will do the trick.
 
Re: 8/7 Morgaine AMPS 173 ?s about Lantus/advice

skybar22 said:
I am a bit concerned about the continual dose increases at this point and am wondering about the potency of the Lantus. Is it possible that it is beginning to lose some of it's potency?
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It's possible, and if you're worried then you can try a different vial. Some people routinely open new pens each month just so they don't have to worry about it. Others use their insulin for much longer. Usually when insulin goes bad what we see is just a lot of wonky, inconsistent numbers. I don't see that on Morgaine's spreadsheet, so it doesn't scream "old insulin" to me, but anything is possible.

For some reason, with Lantus and Lev cats the normal pattern seems to be that they stay fairly flat, dose increase after dose increase, until suddenly they hit a dose that works for them. All of a sudden there is more green, and they will usually start earning dose reductions. You would think there would be a gradual lowering of numbers as the insulin dose increases, but that is not usually what happens. It's an overnight change and almost always catches the bean off guard. ;-) With that in mind, what I tend to think is happening with Morgaine is just that she hasn't reached her breakthrough dose yet. FYI, most of the time when a cat returns from the Falls, their breakthrough dose the second time is higher than it was the first time around. Often it is quite a bit higher, so don't worry yet. I know 2.75 might seem like a lot of insulin, but really it's a fairly average dose and nothing to be concerned about. Some cats need more, some cats need less.

At some point, shouldn't i just hold the dose as per the protocol, if she stays between 100-200?
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That depends on your goal. If you want to try for OTJ again, then bringing the numbers down to <120 is usually the best way to accomplish that goal. If your goal is to get Morgaine into a nice healthy healing range and relax into long-term maintenance, then I would say she is pretty much there and you can hold the dose until she needs a change. Of course, sometimes even if you decide to go for maintenance, the cat will have a different goal in mind. :lol: It's up to you, and Morgaine of course.
 
Re: 8/7 Morgaine AMPS 173 ?s about Lantus/advice

That depends on your goal. If you want to try for OTJ again, then bringing the numbers down to <120 is usually the best way to accomplish that goal. If your goal is to get Morgaine into a nice healthy healing range and relax into long-term maintenance, then I would say she is pretty much there and you can hold the dose until she needs a change. Of course, sometimes even if you decide to go for maintenance, the cat will have a different goal in mind. It's up to you, and Morgaine of course.
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Thank you for your reply to my questions. I do feel better and I agree that the insulin seems to be working.

This is Morgaine's first time on insulin. When she was first diagnosed in May 2010, I changed her diet from Hill's R/D to FF classics and she went into remission with no need for insulin. But she began to get higher numbers this past spring and insulin was started.

My goal is to see her heal and hopefully get OTJ. I would prefer that than her needing insulin shots though I do know it may not happen. So yes, I want to be aggressive and see if we can get tight control with the goal of healing.

And at +3 she was 94!!!

Thank you so much for your advice and response. I think I needed to hear exactly what you shared with me.
 
Re: 8/7 Morgaine AMPS 173 ?s about Lantus/advice

Hi Rosalie!

I agree with what Libby said.....you will find Morgaine's breakthru dose. Zoe's was 3.0......it seems like we had yellows with an occasional pink and a few blues, each time we increased the numbers would look better for a day or so, then go back up....then one day we had blues, the next there were some green and before I knew it a week had gone by, then 2 and her numbers stayed blue and green. And she started earning decreases....something I wasn't sure would happen ever.

This Zoe's second time on insulin - the first time she was on it 6 weeks, now it has over 4 months and I am giving her 3 times the amount of insulin I did the first time......seemed scary to be drawing up 3 units. Hang in there - you are doing great, so is Morgaine!
 
Re: 8/7 Morgaine AMPS 173 dose inc,+3 94,+6 91

So nice to see Morgaine in green!!! Nice going...you've waited a long time for that.

If you look at Gracie's SS, you'll see some real wonky numbers right before the "NEW PEN" insert.

Have a great night.
 
Thanks to Sherry and Zoe. It is really helpful to see some similar patterns as Morgaine's. I have looked at many SS but hadn't found one that looked anything like Morgaine's. I saved it so I can keep referring to it as an example.

Marjorie, I have looked a Gracie's SS many times and admire how hard you and Mike work with her on this. I do see the wonkiness of insulin going bad and definitely do not believe Morgaine's problem is bad insulin.

I am encouraged by similar cases of kitties having flat curves and little movement until they break through on the right dose.

I generally take things one day at a time and need to apply that to this situation. Today Morgaine had a very nice day. You know she often sits like a lady with her front paws crossed. I will have to get a picture of her doing this for those here who cross paws for good luck. I will post it if I can get one.

Thanks forthe support, ALL!
 
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