8/7 Harley PMPS 314

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Harley and Pattie

Member Since 2010
Harley had a great run of blues on 8/5, into 8/6 and then yellows. Since then (2 cycles, going into 3) he has been pink. Would I be out of line to give only 0.1u (or 0.2) R to get him down a bit.

I can now do the 0.1 thanks to Dyana and her great diagrams...thanks so much Dyana, they have really helped.

Pattie

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Re: 8/7 Harley +8/332 - would I be out of line if....

He's only 332. How about trying 0.0 of R or 0.5? Just a touch. You can always give more if it doesn't help, but I bet it will.
There is still a little insulin in the syringe when the plunger is at the zero mark. I have given J.D. 0.0 (or whatever you want to call it) of R at the wrong time (I guess) and he dived.. too fast.. to set up another bounce, later.
0.5 would be the plunger halfway in the zero line and halfway under it.
In my wonderful experience with R, I have found that it works better for me to break a long pink cycle, than to try to stop a bounce. Hope that helps.
 
Re: 8/7 Harley +8/332 - would I be out of line if....

Yes Dyana, it does help although I did have to chuckle at 0.0. I will try that tonight if he does not come into the yellows. Snacks today have only been cooked chicken..staying away from the FF that has a bit of carbs. I am also getting rid of the freeze dried salmon. Seems like he spikes upward after that. Must be something else in it other than the salmon that is listed on the package...they don't reference anything else.

Pattie
 
Re: 8/7 Harley +8/332 - would I be out of line if....

:o J.D. would say at getting rid of the freeze dried salmon.

I have found that J.D. occasionally seems to react to it, but not often, so I'm not blaming the salmon. Is is WildSide?
 
Re: 8/7 Harley +8/332 - would I be out of line if....

No it's Beefeaters - mostly makes dog treats but this one if for cats. He loves it. I may reserve it for the low numbers. Won't bring him up but will be a nice treat.

Pattie
 
Even though Harley is still pink, I did not use any R. This is a point where he might go low during the night (looking at his ss) and I don't want that to happen.

Pattie
 
You know your kitty best. I hope he behaves himself.
Come on down real slow and easy, Harley.
 
Hi Pattie,

I've thought a lot about your giving Harley the dried kibble to manage the cycle the other night. Although a few tsp of kibble will not harm Harley, I think that adapting that strategy will harm his chances for achieving remission or even regulation.

What if, without the kibble, Harley would have dropped to 40 or lower? You would have missed and important sign that he needs a decrease.
On the flip side, I suspect using slow clearing carbs may leave him sitting at higher numbers longer afterwards (like he is now for example). You don't want Harleys body to become accustomed to hanging around in the pinks. You want him to be able to clear a bounce naturally (no R), as quickly as possible.

I need to ask you, what is your goal for Harley? Do you want to go for OTJ or are you just looking for regulation in a safe BG zone?

A couple things about IAA -
  • High BGs do not create the antibodies -the antibodies are created by the immune system in reaction to insulin.
  • Unlike other conditions that require High Doses of insulin (Acro, Cushings) IAA is self limiting It eventually comes to an end.
I'm no expert, just been there. However, by following the guidance of the folks here in LL, we did successfully battle a very tough case of it, and ended up OTJ.

I have not known you and Harley long but IMHO I have not seen any evidence of lingering IAA - Harleys dose has been decreasing and he certainly is capable of achieving low numbers, (a bit too low for my comfort) - I think Harley broke through it. He's down to a skinny 3.75 for cryin' out loud!

So now is the time to put the IAA thinking away and start to think like someone whose cat is a long term diabetic. and decide what is your goal.

Getting to and managing numbers at the lower end of the dosing scale can be very nuanced. If you are going for tight regulation or possible remission, I don't believe there is time or room in a cycle for slow acting carbs. They will just muddy the waters. In case of emergency, it's definitely a good to have in your bag of tricks - you know it works.

Time is valuable in the bigger picture as well. I believe its said that the longer a cat is diabetic the less the chance of remission. . .

I believe you can find a way to manage the swings with an all wet diet and that Harley can continue to make progress. It's gonna take work, some trial and error and - excellent record keeping that all can quickly see. if you are looking for support and help, this is the place to be. However, those you are seeking it from have to know exactly whats going on, and have confidence they know all the data - what all the variables are.

If you want help with a puzzle, you have to place all the pieces on the table, always. That's your best hope for a good outcome.
 
Hi Harley,

No dosing advice. Just wanted to stop by and say hello and to wish you luck!

Bonnie
 
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