8/6 & 8/7 Jupiter AMBG/63 upset tummy from ABs?

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Jamie & Jupiter

Member Since 2013
Link to previous condo: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=101551

Hmm... Where to start.... I posted on 8/4 about Jupiter's wound. I was very concerned with it - wasnt looking good at all. I got a few suggestions here to get a second opinion so yesterday (8/5) we took him to a new vet.

The vet said that Jupiter needed to be put under sedation and have some of the granulation tissue removed. He said its not going to heal unless its removed, and if they dont do the surgery - the next step would be amputation. He really sounded like he knew what he was talking about and explained everything very thoroughly.

At about 6pm yesterday I called and they said they had just finished and were wrapping up his foot. They said I could pick him up at 7pm.

We went to pick him up and talked to the vet and asked all the questions we had. I was so happy he was so willing to communicate and explain things to us.

So he said there was too much granulation tissue build up so he removed some of the excess. He also said he had to trim back the edges of the skin so the wound will look a little bigger now - but that it should start to heal soon. He measured it and the wound size is now 2 & 1/2 by 3 cm. He wants us to go back 1 time a week for him to check the wound and he will measure it to make sure that it is healing. This will be treated as an open wound and it is not stitched.

To prevent further granulation tissue build up he prescribed an ointment. He said the ointment has antibiotics and steroids in it. He said this will help with any swelling and it will also limit the amount of granulation tissue. I will change the bandage every other day for the 1st week and I am to apply the ointment directly to the wound. (Oh I am so grossed out by this kind of stuff... Last time I looked at the wound I almost got sick on Jupe... but I know I can do it for my Jupe baby) I asked him what I should expect to see when I change the bandage. He explained what it would look like and what would be normal - and he also explained what to watch out for. (Like it being swollen, yellow tissue, large buildup of red tissue, or separating toes on his paw because that usually means its starting to swell up)

I also asked what to do if Jupiter were to get urine on the bandage. He said its just too hard to tell if the urine soaks through or not. He said if I smell urine on the bandage at any time - just remove the bandage and put a new one on.

So for the first week the bandage will be changed every other day. He said he doesnt think we will see much progress until week 2. He said after week one, as long as things seem to be going well, we will just change the bandage twice a week. He would still like to see him once a week though until it is healed.

Since this is an open wound he would like Jupiter to continue antibiotics. He wanted to give Amoxicillin but I explained how Jupiter stopped eating last time on Amoxicillin and he said we definitely dont want that so we will keep him on the Clindamycin - but he did raise the dose some. We were giving 1ml (25mg) twice a day before and now we will give 1.5ml twice a day. He said if Jupiter would stop eating we will go back down to the other dose. One of the questions I asked him today when I called was about probiotics. He said yes its a good idea to give Jupiter probiotics while he is on these antibiotics.

He prescribed Jupiter Buprenex to be taken orally twice a day if needed. (.5mls twice daily) He said Jupiters foot will probably be sore for a few days - and he doesnt want him to be in any pain.

We got some bandaging supplies from the vets office and we also got him a very good fitting cone! And today, we received 2 tubes of yuk gel and a roll of petflex no chew wrap! Thank you so much Josie&Ripley. :-D

Also thank you so much to everyone for the visits, support, advice, vines, prayers, good thoughts, etc. I appreciate it so much!!!

Prayers for Ann today. Fly free Maggie

The next reply is the an update on how things are going today
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 UPDATE

From this morning:

Well last night didnt go so well. He ended up biting the bandage a whole bunch - which was my fault. He kept yelping and meowing at his water bowl so I took his cone off and figured as soon as he was done drinking, that I would put the cone back on.... but unfortunately I dozed off. 10 minutes later I woke up and he had chewed on it a whole bunch. I feel so bad about it - I cant believe I fell asleep.

The rest of the night went okay... I woke up (I wanted to wake up frequently because I was also worried about him getting stuck in the couch with the cone on) every 30 minutes to give him a tsp of food and let him have some water too. (He was very thirsty last night - and I didnt want to let him eat a lot at once since vet said to give him a very small amount at a time until the morning because of the sedation.) I would take the cone off while he ate and drank then I would put the cone back on.

So I was thinking about trying someway to elevate his food and water so that the cone kind of goes around the bowl so he can get his face close enough to the water to drink and close enough to the food to eat with the cone still on.

I didnt put any yuk gel on last night for 2 reasons. 1- I figured he would be wearing the cone all night and 2- I figured it would be best to save it for during the day today. Vet mentioned leaving off cone when I am able to watch him so that he can clean himself and eat and drink... but this way if I look away for a second and he would go to bite the bandage hopefully the yuk gel would prevent him from chewing on it.

But now that we got more yuk gel, we will have yuk gel or the no chew wrap on at all times to prevent him from chewing on it!

I apologize for not posting an update last night, was very busy watching Jupiter like a hawk! He kept trying to jump up on the cat perch by window and stuff and vet said to keep close eye on him. I mean he just finished at 6pm so he was probably still feeling weird for a few hours until sedation wore off and I didnt want him to fall and get hurt or something.


......and WOAH!!! I had a few more questions to ask the vet so I called and ask If I could speak to him or if he could give me a call back. The tech said "let me go see if hes available or if hes in an appointment".... a minute later he answered! I asked him my questions and he gave me good answers. WOW awesome! I am really loving this vet now!



I know a very very long update! But so much has happened. Jupiter is doing okay so far today. I gave him his Bupe, prozac, and ABs this morning. He is sleeping now.
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 UPDATE

Thinking of you guys, and wishing Jupiter fast healing. It sounds like your new vet is a good one. That is wonderful to read. Take care, and Major healing vines for Jupiter.
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 UPDATE

I am so happy you found a vet that communicates, answers your questions and is compassionate. (Can I tell you how much I disliked the other vet?)
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

How did Jupe do last night when you brought him home, was he at ease and glad to be home.I'm sure glad you changed vets this place sounds great and caring people. Hope Jupe is on the road to recovery now.quick healing vines...
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

Sounds like you have a winner w/ the new vet! Don't beat yourself up about falling a sleep. Jupe is going to find a way to mess w/ his bandage sometimes and you caught it quickly. We do what we can. I hope he is now on the road to healing up.

What did the vet say about the oncologist?
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

So glad you found this vet!!!

I had a hand incision that had to heal from the edges in (by secondary intention, they called it) because the stitches got infected. It can work well, so here's hoping its the ticket for Jupiter.

You want to give the probiotic a couple hours after the antibiotic so the good stuff doesn't get killed off for a while.
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

Jamie, did the vet tell you how to administer the bupe?

To put it under the tongue, or as I do with Checkers, in the cheek pouch. It needs to be absorbed by mucus membrane, not swallowed.
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

Hi Jamie, I am so glad this vet is communicating with you better. Glad you like him. I hope Jupe gets better at lot faster now. We feel so sad that you have to deal with this. Leave you bandage alone now Jupe, don't make your mommabean worry all the time. I hope the Bupe helps him a lot.((((Jamie))))
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

Hi Jamie. It was so good to read of Jupiter's progress. Glad you were able to find a new vet, sounds like you've found a keeper.

Many years ago when PurrFace was an outdoor/indoor cat he got in a fight and was bitten on his tail unbeknownst to us. When we discovered it we took him to the vet. It was infected and he had to cut away all of the bad tissue. When he was done the open wound was the size of a quarter. He said to treat it as an open wound. It was actually a hole through his tail. You could see the cartilage in his tail. I told DW it would never heal. She applied the ointment the vet gave us, kept his cone on when she couldn't watch him and kept the bandage clean. It took a while but the wound closed and he's none the worse for it now. I didn't mean to hijack your condo. I just wanted to let you know that even though Jupiter's wound looks horrible now it will heal with proper care which I know you and Dane will lovingly provide. So hang in there and be patient, it sounds like your new vet has Jupiter headed down the right path to recovery.

You done good Jamie!
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

Jupiter was very happy to be home last night and was purring a bunch. He was a little out if it from the sedation though.

Thanks for the tip - I will give probiotic maybe between the 2 doses of AB's?

I mentioned the oncologist and he said he thought it was good we were taking him there.

Uh.... the buprenex... no they didnt say.... I have just been squirting it in on the side of his mouth.... how should I be giving it?

Thank you all for the visits. Just seeing how everyone is supporting Jupe and wanting him to feel better is amazing. :-D
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

Jamie, I'm so glad you found a better vet for Jupiter. My brother's dog had to go through the same thing (removing the granulation tissue) and open wound healing. At first the fur grew in darker, but otherwise it healed fine.

Buprenorphine can be given in the cheek pouch (between the molars and lips, or under the tongue. Just doing some googling on this, and found out you shouldn't give the cat aged cheese while on bupe. I did not know that before.

Jupiter, please be good for your bean. Nothing interesting on that foot!
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

Hi Jamie - I'm so happy you have found a great vet!! Praying for Jupiter to heal quickly!
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

Last night's cheweing event aside, this is a wonderful Jupiter update. This vet sounds like a keeper for sure - what a relief!
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

That's great everything went well with the procedure and this vet seems to be a really good vet. Sending prayers for healing of his foot and for you.
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

:RAHCAT for a good Jupe report !! This vet sounds like a winner !! What an awesome bean you are to Jupe !! Hugs and scritchies from me and Poe :-D
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

squirt the bupe into the cheek, between teeth and cheek, yes he will swallow it, but it will also get absorbed. One thing I did with bupe and my girls was to give 1/2 the dose every 6 hours instead of the full dose every 12. It makes my girls loopy and this seemed to chill them and take the edge off the pain.

this vet definitely sounds like a keeper and is very thorough. Having a vet clearly communicate, answer your questions, take all the time you need is really part of them doing their job. It's a shame that not all vets follow this process.

I love how he explained what it should/shouldn't look like and warning you about it taking a couple weeks to see improvement. Another thing if the wound starts to smell funny (not like the meds you are applying or the yuk gel), then call the vet immediately. It could be something is not healing properly and smell is another great way to tell.

Now, let's hope for quick healing of the wound, your being able to stomach it and Jupe feeling better pretty soon.
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

Hi Jamie,

I've been out of pocket lately and not checking in on you, but I am so glad at what I see about finally getting a vet with some sense :!: That can make all the difference in the world. And finally prescribed some Bupe for Jupe...that is fantastic! Hopefully you will have plenty of that to take that edge off Jupe's pain.
I think this is a major turnaround for you and Jupe and I am sending many prayers and healing vines to you and Jupe for a speedy recovery.
:YMHUG:
Robert
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

Glad things are progressing forward. sounds like a much better vet.
prayers for some real and speedy healing now.
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

I am just so confused about how to give the bupe.... now I feel a little bad that I didnt think to ask that because what if they meds didnt help him and hes in pain?

I guess only 4 more hours to go and I will give him another dose but really want to make sure I do it right this time
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

Sending vines for a speedy healing, and no pain. I'm glad that you got a good vet this time. I only had one experience with the bupe for Zeus, but they said to squirt it in the pocket between his cheek and teeth.

Good luck,
Kathie
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

Jamie, the bupe works a bit differently from pills. It does not work by being swallowed and then absorbed from the stomach. It works by being absorbed through the mucous membranes in the mouth. Ideally you try to squirt it into the cheek pouch (where it is absorbed into the skin of the cheek) or under the tongue. This is sometimes easier said than done with a struggling cat. If you and Dane cannot manage to restrain him well enough to do this, just squirt it into his mouth. It is likely that enough will be absorbed to help him. Don't aim to squirt it down his throat. Don't be concerned about some accidentally going down his throat - it won't hurt him, but the medicine that gets swallowed will not be helping his pain. You may find that as time goes by your technique gets a bit better. Getting it inside his cheek pouch is best, but if it is impossible, just do your best to get it in his mouth (not his throat).
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

so do I aim towards like... up or down toward his teeth on the side? if my question makes sense?
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

I always had a hard time giving bupe myself, because J.D. won't keep his head still.
I just tried pretending by opening J.D.'s mouth and he moved it back and forth and his tongue went in and out. :-| I'm no help.

It does sound like you've turned a corner in Jupe's progress by finding this new vet. I am happy for you.
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

Hi Jamie,
I'm so glad you found this vet.
I like this vet very much too!!

Whenever I try to give bupe to Lucy, she seals her mouth shut tightly which works good for me because I then insert the syringe from the corner of her mouth along her cheek, and push the plungers slowly.
Under the tough is too difficult for me, so I always do the cheek.
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

I try grabbing the scruff a little to tilt the head back and a bit to the side, leaving the side I want to put bupe in to the upside a bit. I aimed for between the upper teeth and cheek and a bit to the cheek, figuring it would slide down the cheek. But you could equally do the lower one and hope it slid under the tongue. Not sure I could get it under the tongue very easily otherwise.
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

Sounds like you've found a great vet and everything sounds very promising :-D Woo Hoo!!!
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

Oh no. He just chewed up his bandage a whole bunch! :sad:

He was eating and then I couldnt find him... he snuck away and chewed on his bandage!!!

I just wish he could understand that hes making it worse :sad:
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

try this to get perspective where to give bupe -

take your tongue place it on the left or right your choice outside of your upper and lower teeth - like you are trying to run your tongue along the outer part of your teeth. - feel your gums and the space between gums/teeth and inside of cheek.

it's that space between that you are aiming for - you can do upper or lower mouth and left or right - I found that upper seems to work better with my girls.

does that make sense?

Oh no! he tore it apart already! I think you are going to need to keep him in the cone of shame full-time. Cause he just needs a few minutes and he attacks it.
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

You aim the bupe at Jupe's cheek. (If you were to wiggle your tongue to the side of your mouth, anywhere from the upper to the lower gum lines, outside of the teeth -- not in the middle where your tongue is -- that fleshy part is the cheek pouch. It's the same in cats.)

Jupe is probably chewing on the bandage because the healing skin is itchy. You really may need to keep the cone on him.
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

I think he ran and hid and attacked the bandage because he knew you would be putting the cone back on and took advantage. Maybe only take the cone off (if at all) for 2 minutes max (and keep your hand on him the whole 2 minutes) just long enough to eat and get a drink. I think eventually, he will figure out how to eat and drink with the cone on. It's just something you have to put up with Jupe, if you're going to heal.
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

Hang in there, Jamie. It will be OK. I'm sure you will be able to get enough Bupe into him to help him with his pain. The bandage may have to be changed, but you are getting good at that. You and Dane are doing a great job. I'm very glad you found a good vet.
Thinking of you and sending vines to Jupe. Bupe for Jupe! A nice motto for today!

Hugs and scritches,

Ella & Rusty
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

He didnt rip the bandage off just bite marks on it. so it will be left on until tomorrow. Considering I leave the cone off for the majority of the day - not too bad!

I will be giving bupe in about an hour. thank you all for the explanations! lets hope i do this right!
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

You are doing FANTABULOUS!! We are all in awe of how dedicated you are. :-D :-D :-D Jupe, leave the bandage alone!
Liz
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

Jamie, you know to keep the bupe in darkness, right?

Jamie, please try to stop stressing. You'll be fine. No one knows how to do these things, first time.
You'll be a pro at giving meds, and changing bandages, in no time.
Jupiter is a very lucky boy, to have you and Dane for loving beans :-D
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

Okay so I gave him the Bupe... and luckily he laid there perfectly the whole time... didnt try to move at all!!!! WOOHOOO good job to my baby boy Jupe!!! :-D


thank you all soooooo sooooo much for the help and explanations!! you guys are so wonderful
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

It could be that Jupe has figured out that he feels much better after you stick that syringe in his mouth, so he'll keep up the good behavior when you give it to him.

I think a lot of kitties, after at first hating the ear pokes or the shots, begin to associate the routine with feeling better. Maybe it's the same with Bupe?

I've never used Bupe on any of my cats. For those that have, is it okay to give a treat afterwards (reward for being good?) or will that mess up the absorption or cause him to swallow it?
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

Carl thats a great question! I wonder the same! Thanks for thinking to ask that.

I just gave the AB's and he moved around a bit. Glad he didnt do that with the Bupe cause it made it much easier when he was still.


Thank you all so much for your support, you have all been so kind and helpful :-D
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

maybe pain meds working too well? hes acting a little overexcited... cant get him to calm down and he keeps yelping with the cone on... he even got it off twice!

i am so tired. tonight is going to be a long long night
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

He could be loopy from the bupe. while it's supposed to calm them down, it does have a spacey high feeling and may make him a bit loopy. It's why I suggested halving the dose and giving it every 6 hours instead of a full dose every 12.

Maui couldn't handle a full dose at a time and I learned after her dentals to halve the dose and that seem to take the edge off and let her chill without being agitated.

Discuss with the vet, I'll bet he is ok with this approach.

Glad he didn't get the bandage off. Bite marks, oops, but it stayed on - yay!
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

i think i am going to give him a little less at this morning dose in less then 1 hr. im so tired.... but bandage is still on!
 
Re: 8/6 Jupiter AMBG/53 Yesterdays Procedure UPDATE

Okay just a few questions...

Does anyone else use Bupe for their cat?

What dose are they on and what is their weight?

Do you guys think .5 is too high of a dose for Jupiter?

Could I try giving him a smaller dose this morning and see how long it lasts... If he is acting weird after 6 hours I dont know if I would even want to give him more... How about giving .4 and waiting 12 hours before giving more?

Any opinions on this?

I also like Carl's question! So if anyone has any opinions on this please let me know -and thanks Carl for thinking to ask this... I hadnt thought of that
For those that have, is it okay to give a treat afterwards (reward for being good?) or will that mess up the absorption or cause him to swallow it?

Also... for those of you that use or have used bupe for your kitty in the past.. do you just squirt the whole dose in at once? Or should I slowly squirt it into the cheek so more is absorbed?
 
Re: 8/6 & 8/7 Jupiter - - - Questions about Bupe ????

When my cat MC had her dental (she had 10 teeth removed), the vet gave me Bupe. They told me to give her 0.3 ml every 8 hours. That made her spacy. I ended up slowly reducing it and found that 0.1 ml every 8 hours worked for her. MC weighs about 12 pounds.

Every cat is different. You may have to try a couple of different doses to find the right one for Jupiter.
 
Re: 8/6 & 8/7 Jupiter - - - Questions about Bupe ????

Hi guys .. no bupe advice from me but I am so so happy you've found a vet that cares about jupiter and wants to get him feeling 100%! Poor little guy, been through so much .. and poor beanz too, you guys must be exhausted!
 
Re: 8/6 & 8/7 Jupiter - - - Questions about Bupe ????

Jamie, I've been giving Checkers bupe on a regular basis for back pain.
I could give you his weight, and the dosage, but ECID. What works for Checkers may be too much for Jupe, or the other way around too.

Some cats here, take/took, tramadol/Ultram, for pain, with no problems. It made Checkers spacey for many hours. It was a small dose, and the pill couldn't be broken any smaller. Bupe suits him well.

No one told me to, but I don't give bupe while he has food particles,in his mouth.
I give it after he had a good drink, then don't let him eat or drink for a while, to make sure it isn't washed out of his mouth too soon.
 
Re: 8/6 & 8/7 Jupiter - - - Questions about Bupe ????

Morning Jamie,Glad things went better for you,did you look at those other type of cones they look like big dunuts,check them out on Doctor foster and Smiths site,they might be better then these cones.
Well Jupe be good for mommy today she needs rest...
 
Re: 8/6 & 8/7 Jupiter - - - Questions about Bupe ????

Could I try giving him a smaller dose this morning and see how long it lasts... If he is acting weird after 6 hours I dont know if I would even want to give him more... How about giving .4 and waiting 12 hours before giving more?
I think I would try what Hillary suggested. Halve it to .25u and see how he does for six hours. See if it seems to relieve pain but not make him act strange.
 
Re: 8/6 & 8/7 Jupiter - - - Questions about Bupe ????

I think Hillary's idea of giving half a dose twice as often is good. As others have said ECID. .5ml is a hefty dose, but Jupiter has a serious wound. It also depends on what he weighs. After her dental Tess got .15 ml but she was only a little over 8lbs. You have to judge how much to give by Jupiter's reaction. We're not there so it's up to you in the end.

How did you get the Bupe? in a vial or pre-dosed syringes? If it is the syringes it can be hard to control a partial dose w/ a squirming cat. I cut a piece of the barrel of an old syringe half the space of the dose and slip it over the exposed end of the plunger. Or anything else you can use to keep from pushing the plunger all the way, a wedge of cardboard maybe. Remember, when you try to put anything in a cat's mouth they clamp their jaws shut. That is great for Bupe, just lift his lip and squirt along the gums.
 
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