7/5 Henry C, PMPS =325, +2.5=284 Delayed Shot, Diarrhea and No Appetite

Suzanne & Darcy said:
I am glad he ate the Dr. E’s. If you need to use it again because he won’t eat, don’t hesitate. But if this keeps up, you should get him checked out. I really hope it’s just transient tummy troubles. Constipation can really diminish appetite but he seems to have diarrhea. It doesn’t sound like he’s just playing you.
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Now what constitutes as constipation? I think the most he goes is 3 days - by day 3 he gives me a nice smelly big gift. I think fortiflora helps. He used to go every day but since the change to high protein food not so often, sometimes every 2 or 3 days. Never more than 3 days.
 
John & Henry said:
I wish I could be of assistance with your situation Roxana, but I'm just a noob. Just because my Henry has been loving his new diet of rabbit, duck, venison and lamb, I'm curious if you're ever tried some of the single source novel proteins with him? Maybe it would be enough to peak his interests?

edit: also your post got added twice. you may want to delete one: https://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/thr...ood-has-diarrhea-and-no-shot-yet-help.265436/
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Does he have any favorites so far? Mine does not like the duck and the rabbit; the lamb he liked it for a hot minute. Not sure I tried venison.
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
What do you think has caused the diarrhea? When did it start? Do you have any s. Boulardii? How about FortiFlora (just as an appetite stimulant.) What about Slippery Elm bark powder? Baby food? Freeze dried pumpkin? Psyllium husk power?
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can you please send me some links to these (except for fortiflora which i have and baby food)? Brands you like? I need to stock up on stuff lol
 
Bobbi Kraham said:
@John & Henry curious what brand cat food you use - Dimi insists on variety, so I'd love to try rabbit, duck, venison and lamb.
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So he's tried (and loved) Ziwi Peak, Koha and Kiwi Kitchen. I ended up going with ziwi peak venison and ziwi peak lamb as his main staples. I pretty much picked those two over the others at random because my local mud bay stocks them and for some reason they charge about 2 or 3 dollars less per can then on their website. Novel proteins are highly recommended in kitties that have IBD or suspected IBD (in Henry's case, this is only suspected so far) Here's the full list of novel proteins he's liked. :

Feline Natural Lamb (LC)
Ziwi Peak Venison (LC)
Ziwi Peak Lamb (LC)
Koha Rabbit (LC)
Koha Duck (LC)
Kiwi Kitchen Venison (LC)
Kiwi Kitchen Lamb (LC)
Go! Solutions Duck Pate (LC)
Blue Buffalo Duck & Potato Basics (MC/HC)
Natural Balance Duck & Pea (MC/HC)
 
Roxana & Henry said:
Does he have any favorites so far? Mine does not like the duck and the rabbit; the lamb he liked it for a hot minute. Not sure I tried venison.
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Well, he'll polish off pretty much anything I give him until recently with the enzymes, but even then he eats about 3/4 of it and will come back for the rest later. I try to rate how much he like likes someone based on how quickly and the amount of gusto he eats it with, based on that "rating scale" the only thing that didn't get a "10" was the Feline Natural Lamb. Everything else I listed in post #56 above, he seems to love. I ended up going with the Ziwi peak vension and ziwi peak lamb as his main staples.
 
I am new so sorry if this is irrelevant. My kitty also has Ibd and had diarrhea. Metronidazole treats it well for the short term. We did the s boulardi protocol for diarrhea. It is a probiotic and the instructions tell how to tackle it with high initial doses. I would go to the vet. Sounds like he may need an anti nausea medicine.
 
You really did buy the store out!
Roxana & Henry said:
Now what constitutes as constipation? I think the most he goes is 3 days - by day 3 he gives me a nice smelly big gift. I think fortiflora helps. He used to go every day but since the change to high protein food not so often, sometimes every 2 or 3 days. Never more than 3 days.
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I was wondering the same. I started mixing 1/4 tsp Miralax in with Dimi's food when I realized he was going 4 days without pooping, and when he did, it was small hard balls. Even with the Miralax it's not great, once every 3 days or so. Not surprising, as he won't go near water now that his blood glucose is regulated. :(
 
You really did buy the store out!
John & Henry said:
So he's tried (and loved) Ziwi Peak, Koha and Kiwi Kitchen. I ended up going with ziwi peak venison and ziwi peak lamb as his main staples. I pretty much picked those two over the others at random because my local mud bay stocks them and for some reason they charge about 2 or 3 dollars less per can then on their website. Novel proteins are highly recommended in kitties that have IBD or suspected IBD (in Henry's case, this is only suspected so far) Here's the full list of novel proteins he's liked. :

Feline Natural Lamb (LC)
Ziwi Peak Venison (LC)
Ziwi Peak Lamb (LC)
Koha Rabbit (LC)
Koha Duck (LC)
Kiwi Kitchen Venison (LC)
Kiwi Kitchen Lamb (LC)
Go! Solutions Duck Pate (LC)
Blue Buffalo Duck & Potato Basics (MC/HC)
Natural Balance Duck & Pea (MC/HC)
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With the exception of the last two, I've never seen any of these, and I spend many hours staring at pet store shelves! Hmmm, I see that you're in the US, so not sure how I've missed these. Are they only sold in speciality pet stores?
 
Bobbi Kraham said:
You really did buy the store out!


I was wondering the same. I started mixing 1/4 tsp Miralax in with Dimi's food when I realized he was going 4 days without pooping, and when he did, it was small hard balls. Even with the Miralax it's not great, once every 3 days or so. Not surprising, as he won't go near water now that his blood glucose is regulated. :(
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Hi Bobbi. This thread is getting a little complicated. I am concerned when I hear about a cat who is not having a BM but every 3 or 4 days. Have you tried Lactulose? You would have to get it (or a prescription) from your vet. By the way, how much Miralax are you giving. It can be given twice a day.
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
Hi Bobbi. This thread is getting a little complicated. I am concerned when I hear about a cat who is not having a BM but every 3 or 4 days. Have you tried Lactulose? You would have to get it (or a prescription) from your vet. By the way, how much Miralax are you giving. It can be given twice a day.
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Yes, it worries me too. My vet said to give Miralax; never mentioned Lactulose. I was giving him 1/8 tsp/day, and that wasn't doing the trick so I just upped it to 1/4 tsp/day. I'm now tracking his BMs in my spreadsheet (my husband and kids think I've gone off the deep end)
 
Bobbi Kraham said:
Hmmm, I see that you're in the US, so not sure how I've missed these. Are they only sold in speciality pet stores?
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I think so. I got mine at my local "mud bay". They're a chain of pet food specializing pet stores. I had no idea they even existed until someone on this board pointed me to them. All the ones I listed should also be available at chewy or amazon. It's nice to find them locally tho, so you only have to get a single can to try first. Mud bay will even give you up to 3 different varieties of your choosing to try for free.
 
Roxana & Henry said:
How many kitties you have Suzanne? Would love to see some pics.[
Roxana & Henry said:
Now what constitutes as constipation? I think the most he goes is 3 days - by day 3 he gives me a nice smelly big gift. I think fortiflora helps. He used to go every day but since the change to high protein food not so often, sometimes every 2 or 3 days. Never more than 3 days.
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Every three days is too many. I would add Miralax or increase it if you are already using it. Also fiber in the aforementioned pumpkin or psyllium husk. I use “It’s Just Psyllium” from Amazon and the “Diggin’ Your Dog” freeze dried pumpkin. But honestly Miralax should get him going again.
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Bobbi Kraham said:
You really did buy the store out!


With the exception of the last two, I've never seen any of these, and I spend many hours staring at pet store shelves! Hmmm, I see that you're in the US, so not sure how I've missed these. Are they only sold in speciality pet stores?
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Yes specialty stores and some online (you can find ziwi at chewy). Koha is also sold on their own website. Vet told me about it but all Kohas were no go which is terrible because they are very healthy.
 
Boy did I mess that response up! I’m heading to bed now. I’ll be around tomorrow. I have to get up at five in the morning and people and their fireworks have kept me up past one a.m. for the last two nights. I was falling asleep while driving today. ☹️
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
Well, here’s a link to s boulardii. It’s just a yeast based “probiotic” that is recommended for diarrhea. But as far as a good quality probiotic I recommend Proviable DC. Chewy sells it. As for s. boulardii brands Jarrow and Now foods brands are reliable and not ridiculously expensive.
https://smile.amazon.com/Supplements-Saccharomyces-Boulardii-Probiotic-Capsules/dp/B07YBKYPSX/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?crid=11VO3Y1OKAF65&keywords=s. boulardii now&qid=1657073276&sprefix=s. boulardii now,aps,99&sr=8-3
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I see proviable DC is this the one :https://www.chewy.com/nutramax-proviable-dc-capsules/dp/101471 ? Henry does not do well with capsules - are they small how do you usually administer them? Any tips? Do you give them daily or just when diarrhea or constipation?
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
Boy did I mess that response up! I’m heading to bed now. I’ll be around tomorrow. I have to get up at five in the morning and people and their fireworks have kept me up past one a.m. for the last two nights. I was falling asleep while driving today. ☹️
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Thank you Suzane for your help. Have a good night!
 
John & Henry said:
So he's tried (and loved) Ziwi Peak, Koha and Kiwi Kitchen. I ended up going with ziwi peak venison and ziwi peak lamb as his main staples. I pretty much picked those two over the others at random because my local mud bay stocks them and for some reason they charge about 2 or 3 dollars less per can then on their website. Novel proteins are highly recommended in kitties that have IBD or suspected IBD (in Henry's case, this is only suspected so far) Here's the full list of novel proteins he's liked. :

Feline Natural Lamb (LC)
Ziwi Peak Venison (LC)
Ziwi Peak Lamb (LC)
Koha Rabbit (LC)
Koha Duck (LC)
Kiwi Kitchen Venison (LC)
Kiwi Kitchen Lamb (LC)
Go! Solutions Duck Pate (LC)
Blue Buffalo Duck & Potato Basics (MC/HC)
Natural Balance Duck & Pea (MC/HC)
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He liked the feline natural lamb for a hot minute now it's no go even with yummy stuff sprinkled on it. Jerk! He did not like any of the Kohas. Did not tried the others but will look into it. I did check the Chewy site for the ziwi pate but it said on a dry matter basis something about 20% carbs which is weird. in the FAQ questions section. I will have to investigate the others and go to a specialty store so i can buy only a few cans and see if I get lucky.
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
Now a product that I really like for quick relief is BeneBac. It’s another probiotic yes, but this one I have had great success with. I use it in very young neonatal kittens with diarrhea and also on my older cats. It gives quick results (Chewy and Amazon both sell it.). https://www.chewy.com/petag-bene-bac-plus-gel-digestive/dp/135925

this stuff is good to keep on hand in any cat household.
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This is for tomorrow but checking the ingredients it contains sucrose which is a type of cane sugar. Would this work on a diabetic cat? Did you see any change in glucose?
 
Roxana & Henry said:
I see proviable DC is this the one :https://www.chewy.com/nutramax-proviable-dc-capsules/dp/101471 ? Henry does not do well with capsules - are they small how do you usually administer them? Any tips? Do you give them daily or just when diarrhea or constipation?
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I give this to my sugar boy & my non sugar boy every day mixed in with beech nut turkey or beef baby food. I empty the 1 capsule in there bowls & mix in the baby food. I don't think it's for diarrhea or constipation though. I bought some psyllium husk thats supposed to be good for constipation. I only tried it once & he tasted it in his food so I bought some size 5 empty capsule that are small enough to put in a pill pocket to try tomorrow.
 
Roxana & Henry said:
He liked the feline natural lamb for a hot minute now it's no go even with yummy stuff sprinkled on it. Jerk! He did not like any of the Kohas. Did not tried the others but will look into it. I did check the Chewy site for the ziwi pate but it said on a dry matter basis something about 20% carbs which is weird. in the FAQ questions section. I will have to investigate the others and go to a specialty store so i can buy only a few cans and see if I get lucky.
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That is... Strange. I just went to chewy and saw that reply and I think it's either old or incorrect information. If you go to ziwi peaks website their nutrition information for this product says carbs are 13% on a dry matter basis. Of course what really matters is the "as fed" basis or "as received" as they call it which lists carbs as only 3%. The nutrition information on their website was last updated 8/31/2020 and chewy responded to that question in the FAQ on 10/06/2019 so the recipe may have changed since that answer. Either way, it's like 93% meat so I don't think you'll need to worry about carbs with this one.
 
Hey Roxanna if the diarrhea persist you might check with your vet to see if you can bag a sample and have them run a cytology on it. Oreo had pretty bad runs last week and it turned out to be bacterial imbalance, so my vet got her fortiflora SA which has finally straightened things out after 4 days. It also solved her green poops haha.
 
Roxana & Henry said:
I see proviable DC is this the one :https://www.chewy.com/nutramax-proviable-dc-capsules/dp/101471 ? Henry does not do well with capsules - are they small how do you usually administer them? Any tips? Do you give them daily or just when diarrhea or constipation?
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I always just pill it with my cats. I’ve never tried opening a capsule and mixing it in food. I give my IBD cat a capsule daily. That BeneBac seems to be palatable though. I’ve never had a cat refuse food with it in there.
 
If the diarrhea continues, I would also consider starting Henry on some Metronidazole (from the vet.) It’s twice a day though and it is a tablet that is flat and round and not that small. Metronidazole is usually very effective at treating diarrhea - it’s antibacterial, anti-protozoal and anti-inflammatory. How bad/difficult is it to pill Henry?
 
Visbiome is a probiotic that comes highly recommended for cats with IBD. It’s more expensive than some of these others so I usually start with the Proviable. It’s very good though.
 
Roxana & Henry said:
This is for tomorrow but checking the ingredients it contains sucrose which is a type of cane sugar. Would this work on a diabetic cat? Did you see any change in glucose?
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Did you check the ingredients for the powder or just the gel? I see the powder also has sugars in there ☹️ Poo! I probably would not risk it in Henry. I don’t use it daily. It’s more of an emergency cure. Usually one dose does the job. Honestly, I am hoping that by this morning Henry is back to normal!
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
Did you check the ingredients for the powder or just the gel? I see the powder also has sugars in there ☹️ Poo! I probably would not risk it in Henry. I don’t use it daily. It’s more of an emergency cure. Usually one dose does the job. Honestly, I am hoping that by this morning Henry is back to normal!
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Thank you Suzanne. While he did not have more last night he had a little this morning. The last time it was bad he had it every few hours so I am hoping this time is a lighter case and it will clear out today. He is relaxing belly up and he could care less. I am the only one stressing out here lol I need to channel my inner cat more and just chill lol
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
If the diarrhea continues, I would also consider starting Henry on some Metronidazole (from the vet.) It’s twice a day though and it is a tablet that is flat and round and not that small. Metronidazole is usually very effective at treating diarrhea - it’s antibacterial, anti-protozoal and anti-inflammatory. How bad/difficult is it to pill Henry?
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Well i had to shove clavomox down his throat in the past because he would not eat with food or covered in cheese or food. Does not care for pill pockets.
 
John & Henry said:
That is... Strange. I just went to chewy and saw that reply and I think it's either old or incorrect information. If you go to ziwi peaks website their nutrition information for this product says carbs are 13% on a dry matter basis. Of course what really matters is the "as fed" basis or "as received" as they call it which lists carbs as only 3%. The nutrition information on their website was last updated 8/31/2020 and chewy responded to that question in the FAQ on 10/06/2019 so the recipe may have changed since that answer. Either way, it's like 93% meat so I don't think you'll need to worry about carbs with this one.
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Based on this FDMB thread we need carbs on ME basis which is % of calories from carbs i :https://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/calculating-calories-from-carbohydrates.205128/ . Weruva site is good at having carbs on ME, as fed and dry matter basis. the ME is very close to the dry matter basis but a bit lower. The as fed is very low and misleading. I think the venison is still under 10% on ME basis but between 8-9% if my calculations are correct (their protein, fat, carb, fiber and ash total is 100.5% and not 100% which should be. Technically anything under 10% is LC so if he likes it I would not stop it. Of course I could be wrong, leaving this to the more experienced folks on this site :) I agree though that the ingredients do not seem to have much of any carbs so even seeing 13% on dry matter basis is strange. They may have other ingredients not listed? I don't know.
 
Ben and Oreo said:
Hey Roxanna if the diarrhea persist you might check with your vet to see if you can bag a sample and have them run a cytology on it. Oreo had pretty bad runs last week and it turned out to be bacterial imbalance, so my vet got her fortiflora SA which has finally straightened things out after 4 days. It also solved her green poops haha.
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Can you buy it without a prescription online or do you have to ask the vet for prescription?
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
Looks like you can buy it online. The only difference I can see between the SA (synbiotic action) and the regular FortiFlora is that the SA contains psyllium, which as you know is a fiber so it acts as a "prebiotic." It contains the same amount of enterococcus faecium.

https://www.heartlandvetsupply.com/..._ms=&msclkid=709f18f928f119dece077a3c867cde71
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I will go at Sprouts to see if they have the S boulardi. Ordered on Amazon because they said it will be delivered today and after ordering they changed it to tomorrow. Ugh. I want to be done with this phase sooner rather than later.
 
Sorry for the long wait I'm not sure if its prescription only or not he just did a prescription and I picked it up from the clinic. It definitely did the trick though and I think she might have some kind of poultry allergy to top it off. I know how you feel it killed me to see the blues show up and then go away because she got sick again, I'm just happy that in my case it was a simple fix this time.
 
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